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  #31  
Old 20th February 2004, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Jet Black
the nature of the Big Bang singularity is different.

note though that I think the ekpyrotic model seems much more convincing. Rather than universes being born from some nasty singularity, they are born from extreme flatness.
Do you, or anyone else, have any links for further information?

Thanks,
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  #32  
Old 20th February 2004, 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Rheticus
These organic molecules created by the energy release randomly bumped into each other. And eventually nucleotides were formed (the basis of DNA and life) and by its nature, it is self replicating.
Nucleotides are the basis of genetic information in modern cells, but they are not the basis for life. You can have life without DNA/RNA. Protocells are alive and they are protein. What you need to convey is that these chemical reactions are not random. Chemistry isn't chance.

This life lived off of other organic molecules at first. Then, some started living off of other life (photosynthesis came later) from there, evolution takes over, and we go from bacteria to human in one fell swoop (or was it a billion years... I can never remember...)
1. It appears that photosynthesis might have been there from the beginning. When you make thermal proteins from amino acids, porphyrins are also made in the reaction. Porphyrin is the basis of chlorophyll. Studies with protocells indicate that they have a primitive photsynthetic ability.
Bahn PR, Fox SW. Models for protocellular photophosphorylation. Biosystems. 1981;14(1):3-14.
Masinovsky Z, Lozovaya GI, Sivash AA, Drasner M. Porphyrin-proteinoid complexes as models of prebiotic photosensitizers. Biosystems 1989;22(4):305-10.
Masinovsky Z, Lozovaya GI, Sivash AA. Some aspects of the early evolution of photosynthesis. Adv Space Res 1992;12(4):199-205.

2. Once you get replication of the original life, then you have units for selection.
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  #33  
Old 20th February 2004, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by lucaspa
Altho the Big Bang was a singularity due to the concentration of mass, that's not all it was. Remember, at the BB all space was infinitely small, too, while black holes exist in a very large spacetime.

I don't see how you could introduce a new spacetime into an existing spacetime. One of the consequences of ekpyrotic is that, when the branes collide, you don't get a new BB in the existing branes, but each universe is destroyed and you start with a new spacetime.
(bolding mine)

I didn't even consider that.




This might sound a little simplistic, but I'm curious; will a black hole continue to engulf everything around it forever? Do they fill up?
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  #34  
Old 20th February 2004, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Meatros
Do you, or anyone else, have any links for further information?

Thanks,
Not links, but check out this month's Discover magazine. It has a feature article on ekpyrotic.

If you want technical, however, you can go to:
www.arXiv.org/abs/hep-th/0103239
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/292/5515/189
2. Turok on ekpyrotic http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/colloq/turok2/
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  #35  
Old 20th February 2004, 05:00 PM
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well, the randomness depends on what you are talking about. they are randomly bumping against each other, but you have to have certain elements to have a reaction. You say potatoe, I say potahtoe.
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  #36  
Old 20th February 2004, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Meatros
(bolding mine)

I didn't even consider that.




This might sound a little simplistic, but I'm curious; will a black hole continue to engulf everything around it forever? Do they fill up?
I don't ever remember seeing where black holes fill up. Theoretically, they could engulf everything, as long as they are taking in matter faster than they are losing it. Black holes do radiate. Hawking showed that.
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  #37  
Old 20th February 2004, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by lucaspa
Not links, but check out this month's Discover magazine. It has a feature article on ekpyrotic.

If you want technical, however, you can go to:
www.arXiv.org/abs/hep-th/0103239
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/292/5515/189
2. Turok on ekpyrotic http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/colloq/turok2/
Thanks, I'll pick up the discover mag. I took a quick check on the first link and it looks like I'm going to have to break in my dictionary...
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If we are going to teach 'creation science' as an alternative to evolution, then we should also teach the stork theory as an alternative to biological reproduction. ~Judith Hayes, In God We Trust: But Which One?

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Just remember, you are unique, just like everybody else.
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  #38  
Old 20th February 2004, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Rheticus
well, the randomness depends on what you are talking about. they are randomly bumping against each other, but you have to have certain elements to have a reaction. You say potatoe, I say potahtoe.
Yeah, but I want to avoid the whole "random" and "chance" situation. Evolution and abiogenesis has been attacked for being random and chance and it's past time we put a stop to that. I don't want to feed the creationist mistakes.
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  #39  
Old 20th February 2004, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Meatros
This might sound a little simplistic, but I'm curious; will a black hole continue to engulf everything around it forever? Do they fill up?
It turns out that the event horizon of a black hole is directy related to the amount of matter that is "inside" it. If you had a black hole and then threw a star in it the black hole would actually get bigger, so it can't fill up.

Black holes give off energy however in the form of hawking radiation, the event horizon shrinks as energy is given off until it eventually evapoates away.
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