Home | Be a Christian | Devotionals | Join Us! | Forums | Rules | F.A.Q.


Go Back   Christian Forums > Discussion and Debate > Unorthodox Doctrinal Discussion
Register BlogsPrayersJobsArcade Calendar Mark Forums Read

Unorthodox Doctrinal Discussion orthodox and unorthodox Christians only - A forum to discuss/debate theological doctrines not accepted by mainstream evangelical Christianity (eg. full preterism, unitarianism).

Closed Thread
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #111  
Unread 5th October 2004, 10:36 PM
CrownCaster's Avatar
FlyFishers Of Men

44 Gender: Male Faith: Christian Country: Israel Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 18th August 2004
Posts: 1,612
Blessings: 166,684
Reps: 955 (power: 0)
CrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really nice
Originally Posted by Doc T
JaneKaty, if you want correct information, you might best make sure that the person responding to you has the little icon of the angel Moroni in the upper right hand corner.

While that is not the only reason, certainly what you have been told is correct in principle.

Doc

~
No, dont do that. The only thing the little "angel of light" means is that you are speaking to someone who is still bound by the un-truths of mormonism and still will perpetrate them further. I for one am an ex-mormon and took my garments off some time ago. I would be happy to explain them to you including the marks and the meaning of them. Let me know if you want this info. You will not get full answer on this issue by a mormon as they are forbidden to reveal the secrets behind the marks and meanings.
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!

  #112  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:04 AM
Katzpur's Avatar
Regular Member

65 Gender: Female Faith: Mormon Country: United States Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 23rd September 2004
Location: Salt Lake City
Posts: 170
Blessings: 116,579
Reps: 59 (power: 0)
Katzpur will become famous soon enough
Originally Posted by happyinhisgrace
Like I said, the differences. Christianity embraces the cross of Jesus as a symbol of what He did for us. It is a symbol of love, compasion, devotion, selflessness, charity, redemption, and saving Grace.

When LDS will not allow crosses to be used in their churches, that speaks a great deal to me about how lds view the symbol of Christ's atonement for man.
Mormonism embraces the resurrection of Jesus as infinitely more important than the means by which He was tortured to death. Of course it was through His atoning sacrifice that we are promised forgiveness of our sins. We value that sacrifice every bit as much as you do, whether you believe we do or not. But it was not in dying, per se, that He gave us eternal life. It was in conquering death. We believe that He would much rather have us focus on him rising in majesty and glory from the tomb than hanging mutilated and dying on the cross. If the cross serves a purpose for you in symbolizing love, compassion, devotion, selflessness, charity, redemption and saving grace, that's fine. I have no problem with that and would not presume to imply that your use of this symbol makes your belief any less sincere or devout than mine. So why can't you accept that our choice not to use it is simply a preference and implies nothing in terms of our love for our Savior and our gratitude for His sacrifice?
__________________
Though argument does not create belief, the lack of it destroys belief. What seems to be proved may not be embraced, but what no one shows the ability to defend is quickly abandoned. Rational argument does not create belief, but it nourishes a climate in which belief may flourish. Austin Farrer
  #113  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:09 AM
Senior Veteran

41 Gender: Male Faith: Christian Country: United States Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 15th February 2004
Posts: 2,074
Blessings: 148,839
Reps: 2,105 (power: 15)
unbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of lightunbound is a glorious beacon of light
Originally Posted by JaneKaty13
He's blowing a horn, right?
JaneKaty, the best way to get a completely honest description of everything mormon, is to talk to an ex-mormon.

The active LDS have a bad habit of witholding information from you.

Even marriage in thier temple is not open for family and friends to attend.

At first, the made-for- flesh LDS doctrine tastes OK like a bowl of cereal with sour milk, then as a little time passes, you get a sick uneasy feeling, and it all comes spewing back out. And the moral to the story is? Be able to know sour milk before you drink of it.
  #114  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:12 AM
Katzpur's Avatar
Regular Member

65 Gender: Female Faith: Mormon Country: United States Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 23rd September 2004
Location: Salt Lake City
Posts: 170
Blessings: 116,579
Reps: 59 (power: 0)
Katzpur will become famous soon enough
Originally Posted by CrownCaster
No, dont do that. The only thing the little "angel of light" means is that you are speaking to someone who is still bound by the un-truths of mormonism and still will perpetrate them further. I for one am an ex-mormon and took my garments off some time ago. I would be happy to explain them to you including the marks and the meaning of them. Let me know if you want this info. You will not get full answer on this issue by a mormon as they are forbidden to reveal the secrets behind the marks and meanings.
JaneKaty,

If you wanted to know the truth about Jesus Christ, would you ask Judas Iscariot for his point of view? You are, of course, free to believe whomever you wish to believe, but I think you will find the LDS people on this board to be honest with your about their beliefs. Many of the non-LDS people here have participated in the ordinances performed in the temples. Although they have since left the Church, and no longer believe its teachings, every one of them knows that in speaking of things they once held sacred, they are breaking a promise they once made to God in good faith. To me, that is significant.

About the garments: For the life of me, I cannot understand the fascination over somebody else's underwear, but maybe my interests just lie elsewhere.

Kathryn
__________________
Though argument does not create belief, the lack of it destroys belief. What seems to be proved may not be embraced, but what no one shows the ability to defend is quickly abandoned. Rational argument does not create belief, but it nourishes a climate in which belief may flourish. Austin Farrer
  #115  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:19 AM
CrownCaster's Avatar
FlyFishers Of Men

44 Gender: Male Faith: Christian Country: Israel Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 18th August 2004
Posts: 1,612
Blessings: 166,684
Reps: 955 (power: 0)
CrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really nice
Originally Posted by Katzpur
JaneKaty,

If you wanted to know the truth about Jesus Christ, would you ask Judas Iscariot for his point of view?
Oooh, nice dig there.

I would have to follow up with this, going to a mormon for a factual answer to what mormonism is like would be akin to asking hitler for a factual look at the holocaust. You are not going to get the truth.

Oh, and yes I made promises in the temple but luckily I now know that the only god in that whole thing is the god of this world and I dont feel too beholden to him.
  #116  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:25 AM
CrownCaster's Avatar
FlyFishers Of Men

44 Gender: Male Faith: Christian Country: Israel Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 18th August 2004
Posts: 1,612
Blessings: 166,684
Reps: 955 (power: 0)
CrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really nice
THE SQUARE

The square is a symbol located on the right breast area of the Mormon underwear, officially called the "garment of the Holy Priesthood." The garment is worn by all temple Mormons as "a shield and a protection to you from the power of the destroyer until you have finished your work on the earth." 1

A close examination of the garment reveals two button holes sewn in the shape of a square reminding the Mormon of the "need for exactness and honor in living up to his temple vows." 2

Evidence shows that the square was originally taken from the Masonic ritual where the Fellowcraft candidate (2nd degree--Blue Lodge) is challenged on his naked right breast by the point of the square. According to Masonic tradition, the candidate is originally taught that the square is both "a symbol of morality" and the "emblem of a Master Mason." 3


  #117  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:28 AM
CrownCaster's Avatar
FlyFishers Of Men

44 Gender: Male Faith: Christian Country: Israel Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 18th August 2004
Posts: 1,612
Blessings: 166,684
Reps: 955 (power: 0)
CrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really nice
THE COMPASS
The compass is a symbol located on the left breast area of the Mormon underwear, officially called the "garment of the Holy Priesthood." The garment is worn by all temple Mormons as "a shield and a protection to you from the power of the destroyer until you have finished your work on the earth." 1

A close look at the garment reveals a pair of button holes sewn in the shape of a "V." The compass reminds the Mormon "...that all Truth may be circumscribed into one great whole, and that all appetites and passions must be kept within certain bounds which the Lord has prescribed." 2

Evidence shows that the compass was originally taken from the Masonic ritual where the Entered Apprentice candidate (1st degree--Blue Lodge) is challenged on his naked left breast by the point of the compass. According to Masonic tradition, the candidate is originally taught that the compass is "...the most prominent emblem of virtue, the true and only measure of a Freemason's life and conduct." 3

  #118  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:29 AM
CrownCaster's Avatar
FlyFishers Of Men

44 Gender: Male Faith: Christian Country: Israel Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 18th August 2004
Posts: 1,612
Blessings: 166,684
Reps: 955 (power: 0)
CrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really nice
THE GAUGE

The "navel mark" or gauge is a horizontal buttonhole sewn into the fabric of the Mormon undergarment. Along with the Masonic symbols of the square, compass, and knee marking, the navel mark is considered sacred.

According to Chuck Sackett, author of What's Going On In There? and former Temple worker, the navel mark "recalls the need of constant nourishment for body and spirit. In the early Mormon Temple ceremonies some of the marks were cut into the garment with a small knife while on the patron's body, thus knicking his flesh and shedding his blood into the garment."
1


The navel mark resembles a gauge or ruler. William Schnoebelen tells us, " [the navel mark] is the Masonic symbol for the 'Middle Pillar' of the Qabalistic Tree of Life. Just as the right and left hand parts of the body in occultism are male and female respectively; so the Middle Pillar corresponds to the center of the body--the head, solar plexus, navel and genitals." 2
  #119  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:32 AM
Finchy's Avatar
Junior Member

45 Gender: Female Faith: Christian Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 6th September 2004
Posts: 45
Blessings: 145,625
Reps: 108 (power: 0)
Finchy has a spectacular aura aboutFinchy has a spectacular aura about
Originally Posted by Katzpur
If you wanted to know the truth about Jesus Christ, would you ask Judas Iscariot for his point of view?
Yikes!

Finchy
  #120  
Unread 6th October 2004, 12:35 AM
CrownCaster's Avatar
FlyFishers Of Men

44 Gender: Male Faith: Christian Country: Israel Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 18th August 2004
Posts: 1,612
Blessings: 166,684
Reps: 955 (power: 0)
CrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really niceCrownCaster is just really nice
http://home.teleport.com/~packham/garment.jpg

Go there for a look at the Garment as a whole being worn by both a woman and a man. Didnt know if posting people in underwear would be too appropriate.
Closed Thread


Return to Unorthodox Doctrinal Discussion

Thread Tools
Display Modes


 
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:11 PM.