Unrefuted creationist arguments

Wasn't it lucaspa that just posted an article about the gene limiting brain size the other day? I'm pretty certain of it.

I haven't read it.

But at any rate, if there is a gene that limits existing brain size in humans, there is no reason to say that this would remain so. Genes can change (that "evolution" thing, remember?)

Ah, the wonder working power of Evolution...

Ah incredulity the last desperate argument when a creationist fails...again

i suggest you check your facts:

Genetics. 2003 Dec;165(4):2063-70.

Evolution of the Human ASPM Gene, a Major Determinant of Brain Size.

Zhang J.

Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology, University of Michigan, Ann
Arbor, Michigan 48109.

The size of human brain tripled over a period of approximately 2 million years
(MY) that ended 0.2-0.4 MY ago. This evolutionary expansion is believed to be
important to the emergence of human language and other high-order cognitive
functions, yet its genetic basis remains unknown. An evolutionary analysis of
genes controlling brain development may shed light on it. ASPM (abnormal
spindle-like microcephaly associated) is one of such genes, as nonsense
mutations lead to primary microcephaly, a human disease characterized by a 70%
reduction in brain size. Here I provide evidence suggesting that human ASPM went
through an episode of accelerated sequence evolution by positive Darwinian
selection after the split of humans and chimpanzees but before the separation of
modern non-Africans from Africans. Because positive selection acts on a gene
only when the gene function is altered and the organismal fitness is increased,
my results suggest that adaptive functional modifications occurred in human ASPM
and that it may be a major genetic component underlying the evolution of the
human brain.

So natural selection has acted on a gene that increases brain size in humans and humans have bigger brains...loveley exactly what you would expect if evolution had happened weird huh?

Here's lucaspa's original thread if you want to discuss the matter further: http://www.christianforums.com/t84380

I have one. Tell me how dirt decided it was just going to all of a sudden get up and walk away without any human or divine intervention whatsoever. No catalyst. Nothing. No reason in the world why this little piece of dirt decided it was going to turn into a living organism. No preprogrammed ability for it to do so, either. No built in abilities for that to happen. Absolutely NONE.

As with so much of evolution, the misinformation on the topics related thereto have been so often repeated instead of being deleted, especially in school curriculums and textbooks, not to mention sites like these, that science fiction has been masquerading as science.

An important pioneer in scientific research on abiogenesis is Alexander I. Oparin. In 1924, he determined what chemicals must be in the earth atmosphere for amino acids to be formed (e.g. methane, hydrogen, ammonia) and what chemicals ought not be there that will prohibit the formation of amino acids (e.g. Oxygen). Scientists like A.I. Oparin and J.B.S. Haldane proposed a sequence for life's origins in the 1920's, from complicated molecules in an oily liquid he called coacervate droplets, to the first protocell, to enzymes, to finally genes.

Miller prepared an experiment to observe what complicated molecules' might be produced under Oparin-Haldane's proposed ideal pre-biotic atmosphere. Sure enough, in an assumed atmosphere that was DESIGNED to produce amino acids, it was not at all surprising that amino acids formed:

The Products of the Miller Experiment: Tar 85%
Carboxylic acids not important to life 13.0%
Glycine 1.05%
Alanine 0.85%
Glutamic acid trace
Aspartic acid trace
Valine trace
Leucine trace
Serine trace
Proline trace
Treonine trace

Note: Glycine and Alanine are the two simplest amino acids of the twenty proteinous amino acids found in living creatures.

Miller's results were well received and widely reported by the mass media to be a major confirmation of evolution and of life arising spontaneously without a Creator. It became a valuable weapon in the evolutionists' propaganda arsenal for brain washing and brow beating the public and more so, unwary students, into accepting the legitimacy of Evolution.

The Miller-Urey experiment that produced amino acids under laboratory controlled conditions, has been misrepresented in many High school, college and other text books. It is often presented that this experiment demonstrates that amino acids, necessary for life, form naturally in a primitive atmosphere. It is usually further asserted or implied that this experiment demonstrates that abiogenesis is highly probable and that this further demonstrates that evolution (Darwinian) is indeed a fact. Of course such textbooks are nonsense, this experiment demonstrates nothing of the kind. In fact, the Miller-Urey experiment demonstrates the opposite, it revealed the overwhelming difficulties that exists with the view that life can form naturally from non-living chemicals.

The key word above is 'controlled'. Intelligent control is what gets one the outcome they are looking for.

Using a system of glass flasks, Steven Miller attempted to simulate Alexander Oparin's ideal atmospheric conditions. He passed a mixture of H2O, ammonia, methane and hydrogen through an electrical spark discharge. At the bottom of the apparatus was a trap to capture any molecules made by the reaction. This trap prevented whatever chemicals formed from being destroyed by the energy source used to create them. Eventually, Miller was able to produce the above described mixture, containing the amino acids described above, the building blocks of proteins.

This was as good as the science ever got for the evolutionists and their hopes for abiogenesis. From now on things get much worse for the Evolutionists. What the public and students have not been told about what science knows concerning the 'origin of life'.

Many attempts by Stanley Miller failed to produce any amino acids or other building blocks of life.

In an effort to make his Oparin atmosphere to mimic actual atmospheric conditions, Miller arranged fro his electrical discharge to simulate lightning. After a week of these lightning type electrical discharges in the reaction chamber, the sides of the chamber turned black and the liquid mixture turned a cloudy red. The predominant product was a gummy black substance made up of billions of carbon atoms strung together in what was essentially tar, a common nuisance in organic reactions.

However, no amino acids used by living systems, or other building blocks of life, were produced on these first attempts. In his own words, Miller stated "An attempt was made to simulate lightning discharge by building up a large quantity of charge on a condenser until the spark jumped the gap between the electrodes. ... Very few organic compounds were produced and this discharge was not investigated further." from Robert Shapiro: "Origins, A Skeptics Guide ..." P. 103., 1986.

Only by constantly readjusting and fine tuning his apparatus and using a continuous electrical charge that Miller eventually obtained the amino acids indicated it above. Even when using the same gas mixture and a continuous electrical discharge, Miller did not obtain any positive results until placing the apparatus in a different order. Shapiro, Ph.D. Chemistry, noted that with respect to the use of "Intelligence" and "Know How:" on the part of the experimenters to achieve the results they desire in "Origin of Life" type experiments:

(P. 102-103)

"another significant factor also influences the products being formed in an experiment of this type, but is less recognized, selection by the experimenter."

"One clear message should emerge from this discussion. A variety of results may be possible from the same general type of experiment. The experimenter, by manipulating apparently unimportant variables, can affect the outcome profoundly. The data that he reports may be valid, but if only these results are communicated, a false impression may arise concerning the universality of the process. This situation was noticed by Creationist writer, Martin Lubenow, who commented: "I am convinced that in every origin of life experiment devised by evolutionists, the intelligence of the experimenter is involved in such a way as to prejudice the experiment.""

Now it gets much worse for Abiogenesis.

The tar tends to fix the amino acids so that they are not that free to
bond, which must happen if theses amino acids are to form any kind of
molecular structures leading to a replicating life form.

Now it gets fatally worse for abiogenesis. Miller's amino acids are useless as a basis for abiogenesis.

The amino acids formed were racemates. That is, each amino acid was
produced in equal quantities of Dexterorotary (Right handed Molecules)
and Laevorotary (Left handed) molecules. Furthermore, both right and
left handed amino acids bond to each other equally well. However, all
of life's proteins are made from left-handed amino acid chains. If
just a single right handed amino acid molecule binds to a forming
three dimensional chain of left handed amino acids, that right handed
amino acid is lethal to the formation of the three dimensional chain.
"Without exception, all of Miller's amino acids are completely
unsuitable for any type of spontaneous generation of life. And the
same applies to all and any randomly formed substances and amino acids
that form racemates. This statement is categorical and absolute and
cannot be affected by special conditions. This is scientific fact." (1)

You can never even "naturally" achieve an RNA world because of this
scientific fact.

All amino acids that form by natural causes alone are racemized. Even those found on comets are racemized.

Though the above is fatal to any scenario for abiogenesis, things continued to get worse for the evolutionists conception of origins.

Oparin's ideal atmosphere of Methane, Ammonia, Hydrogen, and without Oxygen never existed! We've known for at least the past thirty years that the pre-biotic atmosphere had oxygen that is lethal to the formation of life's building blocks, and it had at best, traces of methane, ammonia, and hydrogen. Ultra-violet let would have destroyed amino acids formed in the atmosphere, and the chemicals of the ocean would have destroyed life's building blocks that ended up there.

HOLY SONOVA... Just spent the better part of an hour responding to Feelgoods copy/past, was almost finished, and I hit the friggen home button on my IE browser, thus erasing my post ( >_< ) Luckily it's the weekend and I still have plently of caffinated drinks and half of a large pizza. Going to get back to work...