|Christian Apologetics A forum to discuss the systematic defense of the Christian belief system with other Christians. |
24th December 2003, 06:41 AM
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Anybody has an explanation for this???
mathew 27:9 attributes a prophecy to Jeremiah, when it's actually found in Zecheriah 11:12-13
How can it be true?
if MAthew was inspired, he shouldn't have made such a mistake!!
24th December 2003, 12:14 PM
Your question is, "Why does Matthew 27:9 attribute to Jeremiah a prophecy from Zechariah?"
Here is the explanation given by the Encyclopedia of Bible Difficulties, by Gleason L. Archer, p. 345:
"...the greater portion of it is actually from Zechariah 11:12-13, which reads as follows: "And I said to them, 'If it is good in your sight, give me my wages; but if not, never mind!' So they weighed out thirty shekels of silver as my wages. Then Yahweh said to me, 'Throw it to the potter, that magnificent price at which I was valued by them' So I took the thirty shekels of silver and threw them to the potter in the house of Yahweh." There are significant differences between the Zechariah passage and the quotation in Matthew, which has the prophet paying out--or at least giving--the purchase money, and has him turning over the money for a field rather than giving it to the potter personally. Yet the whole point of the quotation in Matthew is directed toward the purchase of the field. The Zecharias passage says nothing at all about purchasing a field; indeed, it does not even mention a field at all.
But as we turn to Jeremiah 32:6-9, we find the prophet purchasing a field in Anathoth for a certain number of shekels. Jeremiah 18:2 describes the prophet as watching a potter fashioning earthenware vessels in his house. Jeremiah 19:2 indicates that there was a potter near the temple, having his workship in the Valley of Hinnom. Jeremiah 19:11 reads: "Thus says Yahweh of hosts: 'Even so I will break this people and this city as one breaks a potter's vessel, that cannot be made whole again; and they shall bury them in Tophet.' " It would seem, therefore, that Zechariah's casting of his purchase money to the potter dated back to the symbolic actions of Jeremiah. Yet it is only Jeremiah that mentions the "field" of the potter--which is the principal point of Matthew's quotation. Matthew is therefore combining and summarizing elements of prophetic symbolism both from Zechariah and from Jeremiah. But since Jeremiah is more prominent of the two prophets, he mentions Jeremiah's name by preference to that of the minor prophet.
A similar procedure is followed by Mark 1:2-3, which attributes only to Isaiah a combined quotation from Malachi 3:1 and Isaiah 40:3. In that case also, only the more famous of the two prophets is mentioned by name. Since that was the normal literary practice of the first century A.D., when the Gospels were written, the authors can scarcely be faulted for not following the modern practice of precise identification and footnoting.
There are your daily ups and downs, and then there is your character. In the ecology of the self, the former is the weather, the latter the climate. - KF
24th December 2003, 01:47 PM
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| | Mat 27:9
Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying, And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him that was valued, whom they of the children of Israel did value; Zec 11:13
And the LORD said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them. And I took the thirty
] of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the LORD. Jer 32:9
And I bought the field
of Hanameel my uncle's son, that [was] in Anathoth, and weighed him the money, [even] seventeen shekels of silver.
28th December 2003, 04:48 AM
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Or let me reply the same way I did your last one. I guess if you're proven wrong about something, it's best to post another in hopes they aren't seen by the same person?
Originally Posted by Svt4Him
"Subsequent Mention." Let me show you Acts 20:35:
"In everything I showed you that by working hard in this manner you must help the weak and remember the words of the Lord Jesus, that He Himself said, 'It is more blessed to give than to receive.'"
Here the apostle Paul is speaking to the elders of the church and he reminds them of something that Jesus had said. Where in the Gospels do we find this quote? It's not there. Does that mean that Paul was mistaken? No, it simply means that it was not recorded in the Gospel record.
30 "Therefore many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book;
31 but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name." So the concept of "Subsequent Mention" is that Paul mentions something that Jesus taught, that was not recorded in the Gospel record, but is now recorded by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit by Paul. Similarly, in our passage in Matthew 27:9, we have Jeremiah speaking, Zechariah records the conversation sometime later, and Matthew, under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, quotes the statement and assigns it to Jeremiah. This is really a divine commentary on who said what! Who's word are you going to accept, the word of the critic, who certainly was not there, and in a sense has no right to deny the truth of the Biblical record, or will we take an inspired man's statement about who said what (in this case Matthews)?
Some people have enough dust on their Bibles to write "Damnation" on it.
1st January 2004, 03:52 AM
Now with Mathew 27:9 you will notice it quotes "spoken through Jeremiah the prophet". There are several possibilities. That it was spoken by Jeremiah, but written by Zechariah. (very easy explanation) But there are other ideas that are plausible as well. The name Jeremiah stands for the collection of prophetic writings in which Zechariah is found. Also another possibility is that back then, the book of Jeremiah headed the books of the prophets, and the quote Matthew used was attributed to the name of the first book, and not name of the specific book within the group.
Another option Is the fact during that time, the rabbi's did routinely quote from one to three people as give credit to only one. Usually the one more deserving, or the one with the main point, or in many cases if all the people quoted are similar in thought, they would be quoted as one person, (again probably by the one more desrving.)
So those are the possibilities that are suggested. Whether they are correct, or there is another reason, (there is one other I know of, and it does involve Jeremiah, but also one of the above reasons, but it so complicated, I'd have to go back and study up the connection), the reasons really come down to, are they good possibilities of being correct? Yes.
Is it probable that Matthew was in error, or confused? Not likely, considering the details that he speaks of, and how much he paid attention to other facts.
Thinking about these ideas though, does help answer an earlier question mentioned that the bible was made by one person. Considering if one person did write it, don't you think the geneologies would be the same, and they would quote the same books?
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