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  #1  
Old 28th November 2013, 10:44 AM
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Was Judas's destiny predestined?

The Bible says (I forgot the specific verse) something about Judas betraying Christ so that the "scriptures be fullfilled", or something like that. I forgot what exactly the verse says. But does that verse imply that Judas was predestined to betray Christ, and he had no choice in the matter?
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  #2  
Old 28th November 2013, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Superhero Sam View Post
The Bible says (I forgot the specific verse) something about Judas betraying Christ so that the "scriptures be fullfilled", or something like that. I forgot what exactly the verse says. But does that verse imply that Judas was predestined to betray Christ, and he had no choice in the matter?
John 17:12 is the scripture I think you are referring to.
Scriptures tell us all things are predestined by the sovereign God for his pleasure and by his will.
Without Judas doing his part Christ would have not been able to die for the sins of the world. Fulfilling the mission he too was destined for.
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Old 28th November 2013, 12:07 PM
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Yes it means exactly that, but it does not mean that Judas did not make the decision to do so himself. He reject the Lord as His Savior and God had predestined him to be in the position to betray Jesus, it does not say that he was predestine to rejected Jesus as His Savior. All things working together to fulfill God's purposes means He does have the final say in ever situation. Pro 16:1 The preparations of the heart belong to man, But the answer of the tongue is from the Lord. Pro 16:33 The lot is cast into the lap, But its every decision is from the Lord. Pro 19:21 There are many plans in a man’s heart, Nevertheless the Lord’s counsel—that will stand.
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Old 1st December 2013, 10:07 AM
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Was Judas`s destiny predestined?

Dear Superhero Sam. No, Judas was not predestined, but Judas was chosen by God because Judas was the right person to do so, and was capable because he did not believe that Jesus was the promised Messiah. We have
an other case, when Pharao would not let the people go. God did not keep the Pharao from not wanting to let the Israelites go, This Pharao wanted to keep the Israelites as his slaves, and said No to God and Moses.
We have free will, and God will not force us, we can either follow Jesus back to God, or go our own way, and end up without God`s Love or Light, in Outer Darkness. I say this with love, Sam. Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ.
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  #5  
Old 1st December 2013, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Superhero Sam View Post
The Bible says (I forgot the specific verse) something about Judas betraying Christ so that the "scriptures be fullfilled", or something like that. I forgot what exactly the verse says. But does that verse imply that Judas was predestined to betray Christ, and he had no choice in the matter?
He had plenty of choice in the matter, prophesy is explicitly a foretelling, through foreknowledge, which is different from predestination.
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  #6  
Old 1st December 2013, 01:07 PM
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Something not yet mentioned, for what it's worth:

The scriptures never say "Judas Iscariot, one of the twelves disciples, the one who had the money bag, etc. etc. betrayed Christ". It was more general: Close friend betrayed Christ, for thirty pieces of silver, I believe that's how specific the prophecies get. Never mentions an exact person.


Also never forget, we'll never totally understand His ways, at least not down here. Our ways are not His ways, and all that jazz.
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Old 1st December 2013, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Superhero Sam View Post
The Bible says (I forgot the specific verse) something about Judas betraying Christ so that the "scriptures be fullfilled", or something like that. I forgot what exactly the verse says. But does that verse imply that Judas was predestined to betray Christ, and he had no choice in the matter?
God knowing the future does not mean that God predestined
Judas to betray Jesus.

Knowledge is not control.
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2 Cor 5:21
For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.
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Old 1st December 2013, 03:12 PM
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Judas wasn't an automaton, nor was he following a script.

Judas' actions were his own.

-CryptoLutheran
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  #9  
Old 1st December 2013, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Pal Handy View Post
God knowing the future does not mean that God predestined
Judas to betray Jesus.

Knowledge is not control.
If God knew, and yet God still created, then God intended and therefore predestined.

It really just depends on if you believe God created out of mandatory grace or decisive intent.
If God created by an automated grace of His being, then Judas freely chose. If it was decisive, then Judas was predestined.
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Old 1st December 2013, 03:45 PM
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Yes God predestined, however Judas was NOT forced to betray Jesus. It was a free choice made by him
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Jesus is real; he's from Israel!! -Me
Reasons to Believe the Bible:
•Christian understanding of God •Salvation by faith vs. Salvation by works
•Old Testament Prophecies •Unique Claims of Jesus Christ
•Biblical Archaeology •Evidence for the ressurection

Galatians 3:28 (WEB) " There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus."
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