Home | Be a Christian | Devotionals | Join Us! | Forums | Rules | F.A.Q.


Go Back   Christian Forums > Congregation > Christian Communities > Scripture,Tradition,Reason-Anglican & Old Catholic
Register BlogsPrayersJobsArcade Calendar Mark Forums Read

Scripture,Tradition,Reason-Anglican & Old Catholic The forum for Anglican, Anglo-Catholic and Episcopal churches.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 22nd September 2013, 06:04 PM
Esdra's Avatar
Senior Contributor

28 Gender: Male Faith: Catholic Country: Austria Member For 2 Years Fisherman
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 18th September 2011
Location: Tyrol, Austria
Posts: 6,193
Blessings: 3,704,320
Reps: 9,223,372,036,854,775,808 (power: 9,223,372,036,854,784)
Esdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond repute
Esdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond repute
Question Anglican church in north America (acna)

Hi

In your forum I learned a bit about the Episcopal/Anglican churches in the USA.
(and to be perfectly honest, it's a confusing mess somehow. )

But what would interest me now is, whether the acna is also to be found in Canada. As it says north America, to which Canada naturally also belongs. or is there only one Anglican church like in the UK? (or one Roman Catholic church in Germany or Austria)

Esdra
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. (Matthew 24:35)
Reply With Quote
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!

  #2  
Old 22nd September 2013, 06:10 PM
thecolorsblend's Avatar
Enrolled in RCIA

33 Gender: Male Faith: Catholic Party: US-Libertarian Country: United States Member For 1 Years
 
Join Date: 1st July 2013
Location: Smallville, Kansas
Posts: 150
Blessings: 1,059,433
My Mood Sleepy
Blog Entries: 4
Reps: 27,345,257,239,131,128 (power: 27,345,257,239,133)
thecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond repute
thecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
Hi
Hello.

Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
In your forum I learned a bit about the Episcopal/Anglican churches in the USA.
(and to be perfectly honest, it's a confusing mess somehow. )
Tell me about it. I think it's one of those things that will become simpler with time. A lot of TEC parishes are struggling financially due to a lack of parishioners and so a lot of people have posited that the day may come when it ceases to exist. I'm not advancing that theory myself, you understand, just throwing out something I've read in billions of places. So it's possible that ACNA may someday become the only game in town in North America. Whether or not that even happens or is a good thing even if it does is for history to decide.

Still, it does beg the question of what the AC would do in that circumstance. They have nothing to do with ACNA right now but wouldn't that kind of have to change if TEC evaporated someday? Hm...

Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
But what would interest me now is, whether the acna is also to be found in Canada. As it says north America, to which Canada naturally also belongs. or is there only one Anglican church like in the UK? (or one Roman Catholic church in Germany or Austria)
ACNA apparently encompasses Canada too. Anglican Network in Canada - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 22nd September 2013, 06:22 PM
Esdra's Avatar
Senior Contributor

28 Gender: Male Faith: Catholic Country: Austria Member For 2 Years Fisherman
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 18th September 2011
Location: Tyrol, Austria
Posts: 6,193
Blessings: 3,704,320
Reps: 9,223,372,036,854,775,808 (power: 9,223,372,036,854,784)
Esdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond repute
Esdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond reputeEsdra has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by thecolorsblend View Post
Hello.

Tell me about it. I think it's one of those things that will become simpler with time. A lot of TEC parishes are struggling financially due to a lack of parishioners and so a lot of people have posited that the day may come when it ceases to exist. I'm not advancing that theory myself, you understand, just throwing out something I've read in billions of places. So it's possible that ACNA may someday become the only game in town in North America. Whether or not that even happens or is a good thing even if it does is for history to decide.
Well, to stay with the USA there is Tec, acna and dozens of continuing Anglican churches; and another dozen of churches that call themselves Episcopal church, but are in neither of mentioned church bodies (like the charismatic Episcopal church). I guess I haven't really understood which of these are in the worldwide Anglican communion and which not and which are really apostolic churches (in case of the various Episcopal churches outside Tec).
Imo, it's getting even more confusing when you have a look why they left Tec (which is as far as I have understood it the official Anglican church of the USA in the worldwide Anglican communion). And much more confusing when it comes to the theological differences. - Which ones are those that came back to the rcc (although that was the UK, if I remember correctly.)?

Still, it does beg the question of what the AC would do in that circumstance. They have nothing to do with ACNA right now but wouldn't that kind of have to change if TEC evaporated someday? Hm...
So you think Tec would cease to exist some time?

Do you know why they split from the Anglican church in Canada?
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. (Matthew 24:35)

Last edited by Esdra; 22nd September 2013 at 06:44 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 22nd September 2013, 07:39 PM
thecolorsblend's Avatar
Enrolled in RCIA

33 Gender: Male Faith: Catholic Party: US-Libertarian Country: United States Member For 1 Years
 
Join Date: 1st July 2013
Location: Smallville, Kansas
Posts: 150
Blessings: 1,059,433
My Mood Sleepy
Blog Entries: 4
Reps: 27,345,257,239,131,128 (power: 27,345,257,239,133)
thecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond repute
thecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond reputethecolorsblend has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
I guess I haven't really understood which of these are in the worldwide Anglican communion
If it's not TEC, it's not part of the WWAC. That's my understanding anyway.

Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
and which not and which are really apostolic churches (in case of the various Episcopal churches outside Tec).
I'm not sure which are really apostolic either, tbh. I feel confident with ACNA but I'm not prepared to hazard a guess about any of the others.

Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
So you think Tec would cease to exist some time?
I've read people with far greater experience/background in these matters suggest it.

Personally, I'm a bit skeptical. TEC is still a solid brand insofar as Christianity in America is concerned. It's hard to think of circumstances where it wouldn't exist anymore in some form or another. It could happen (and very frankly I'm probably not the best person to answer this anyway) but my hunch is it's going to be around for a long while.

Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
Do you know why they split from the Anglican church in Canada?
It's to do with fidelity to Scripture. I feel more comfortable discussing this aspect because I'd kept an eye on TEC/schism issues since about 2005. Many in (or formerly in) TEC said it's not specifically a homophobic thing so much as ordaining gays is a repudiation of Scripture. For those getting their blood fired up reading this, I'm not trying to reopen this debate; I'm just answering a question. I've heard and read far too many priests and bishops say that the gay thing is the straw that broke the camel's back. Their point is that there ought to be a place for gays in the church but it's not serving (in any capacity).
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 22nd September 2013, 09:31 PM
MKJ's Avatar
Contributor

Married Faith: Anglican Party: CA-Greens Country: Canada Member For 5 Years Brickmaker
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 6th July 2009
Location: East
Posts: 11,311
Blessings: 1,705,929
My Mood Angelic
Reps: 1,166,980,527,183,991,552 (power: 1,166,980,527,184,008)
MKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond repute
MKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond reputeMKJ has a reputation beyond repute
I don't remember what the issue that actually triggered the split in Canada was, but the whole thing had been fermenting for a while. And different parishes and priests have joined them at different times, for different primary reasons.

I have a feeling that it was more about same-sex blessings than it was about ordaining gay clergy, but I could be misremembering. There was not the same high-profile ordaining an openly gay bishop thing here as in the US, there were a few diocese where priests were conducting same sex blessings though, and parishes that no longer wanted to be associated with that bishop. But it all followed many people being really fed up with a lot of things.
__________________
“Be sure you choose what you believe and know why you believe it, because if you don't choose your beliefs, you may be certain that some belief, and probably not a very credible one, will choose you.”
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 22nd September 2013, 10:46 PM
PaladinValer's Avatar
Orthodox Catholic in the English Style

32 Gender: Male Faith: Anglican Party: US-Others Country: United States Member For 5 Years Commander
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 7th April 2004
Location: Myrtle Beach, SC
Posts: 20,038
Blessings: 26,671,428
My Mood Serious
Reps: 1,133,746,556,813,832,320 (power: 1,133,746,556,813,863)
PaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond repute
PaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond reputePaladinValer has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
Hi

In your forum I learned a bit about the Episcopal/Anglican churches in the USA.
(and to be perfectly honest, it's a confusing mess somehow. )

But what would interest me now is, whether the acna is also to be found in Canada. As it says north America, to which Canada naturally also belongs. or is there only one Anglican church like in the UK? (or one Roman Catholic church in Germany or Austria)

Esdra
In terms of the Anglican Communion, the only valid province of it in the United States is The Episcopal Church and the only valid province of it in Canada is the Anglican Church of Canada.

ACNA is Anglican, but not a part of the actual Anglican Communion. While certain bodies within the Anglican Communion consider them to be in communion, the actual Communion itself does not, and the personal opinions of those bishops and archbishops in questions are just that.
__________________
Member of the Round Table


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
For You are the Lord Most High, of great compassion, long-suffering, and very merciful, and You relent at human suffering. O Lord, according to Your great goodness You have promised repentance and forgiveness to those who have sinned against You, and in the multitude of Your mercies You have appointed repentance for sinners so that they may be saved.

-Prayer of Manasseh verse 7 (NRSV)
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 23rd September 2013, 10:39 AM
Albion's Avatar
Senior Contributor

Gender: Male Married Faith: Anglican Country: United States Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 8th December 2004
Posts: 44,107
Blessings: 83,367,938
Reps: 9,223,372,036,854,775,808 (power: 9,223,372,036,854,830)
Albion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond repute
Albion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond reputeAlbion has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by Esdra View Post
Well, to stay with the USA there is Tec, acna and dozens of continuing Anglican churches; and another dozen of churches that call themselves Episcopal church, but are in neither of mentioned church bodies (like the charismatic Episcopal church). I guess I haven't really understood which of these are in the worldwide Anglican communion and which not and which are really apostolic churches (in case of the various Episcopal churches outside Tec).
I had the feeling this wasn't quite clear in your mind yet.

TEC is the official representative of the Anglican Communion in the USA. No other Anglican church is. However, ACNA is trying to persuade the Anglican Communion to make it the second recognized province here and has the official recognition of a number of overseas churches that are members of the Anglican Communion. (I doubt that that will succeed.) The Continuing Anglican churches are not desirous of joining the Anglican Communion.

Imo, it's getting even more confusing when you have a look why they left Tec (which is as far as I have understood it the official Anglican church of the USA in the worldwide Anglican communion). And much more confusing when it comes to the theological differences. - Which ones are those that came back to the rcc (although that was the UK, if I remember correctly.)?
This is something that should NOT be all that confusing. First, the Continuing Anglican churches left TEC (and the ACofCanada) because of two issues: the ordination of women and (in their view) the severing of Apostolic Succession, and also the reworking of the Book of Common Prayer to make it more liberal theologically and more of a collection of liturgies than anything "common."

ACNA (also called "Anglican Realignment") left over TEC's acceptance of the main demands of the homosexual activists: gay bishops and priests and, secondarily, same-sex blessings and unions.

Both the Continuers and ACNA were generally alarmed at the liberal drift of The Episcopal Church, it should be added. However, that's less easy to itemize or summarize.

As for the Anglicans who went over to the the RCC, they number only a miniscule number, maybe a couple thousand, and are mainly in the UK, although there are some in the USA and Canada.

So you think Tec would cease to exist some time?
Probably not. But it is losing about 1,000 member each week and has been forced to close and/or sell off a growing number of church buildings and properties. Few dioceses have averted serious shortfalls in meeting their budgets. The situation is worse with the Anglican Church of Canada which is more likely to actually cease to exist.

why they split from the Anglican church in Canada?
The same reasons as ACNA in the United States.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 23rd September 2013, 01:43 PM
FireDragon76's Avatar
Christian humanist

Gender: Male Married Faith: Christian Party: US-Democrat Country: United States Member For 1 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 30th April 2013
Location: Orlando, Florida
Posts: 1,363
Blessings: 1,028,168
Reps: 129,327,317,858,441,888 (power: 129,327,317,858,444)
FireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond repute
FireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond reputeFireDragon76 has a reputation beyond repute
TEC still has alot of money through endowments in property owned. And its still relatively large and influential. There are some conservative Reformed churches, for instance, that have much fewer members than TEC. In the Orthodox world- many of their "denominations" or jurisdictions are smaller. The Orthodox Church in America had a few influential theologians, despite a very small number of regular churchgoers, they made up for it in terms of influence. Episcopalians, on the other hand, have alot of influential theologians- like Miroslav Volf or Matthew Fox, and they have more numbers, cultural influence, and money. I see no reason TEC is going to disappear any time soon.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Return to Scripture,Tradition,Reason-Anglican & Old Catholic

Thread Tools
Display Modes


 
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:17 AM.