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  #31  
Old 15th September 2013, 05:16 AM
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Originally Posted by bhsmte View Post
If there is a God - bottom line, no one knows the answer to these questions, its all anybody's guess.
No one knows? That sounds like a statement of faith!


Many people have dedicated their life's work into finding answers. Are you certain that it is all futile? Perhaps there is no one person who has all the answers, but that doesn't mean we don't reap any rewards for our efforts.


No scientist knows the answers to all their questions either. But that doesn't stop us from believing what they say they are relatively certain of. Nor is everyone who claims to be a scientist trustworthy. We have to use good judgement to determine who we can trust and who we can't.
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Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.


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  #32  
Old 15th September 2013, 01:47 PM
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One downside of it is that the whole only by Jesus argument seems to get watered down a bit once we allow exceptions in our doctrine.

That’s exactly what satan intended... Jesus warned us of the 5 things sat
an uses to choke God’s Word out of our lives so it bears no fruit... persecution, affliction, cares of this world, lusts of other things, and deceitfulness of riches (Mark 4:14-20)


Matthew 3:10
And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which brings not forth good fruit is cut down, and cast into the fire.

Matthew 7:17-20
Even so every good tree brings forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree brings forth evil fruit.
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Every tree that brings not forth good fruit is cut down, and cast into the fire.
Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Hebrews 6:8
But that which bears thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Matthew 7:21-23
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven. (see James 1:22)
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


If there is a God - bottom line, no one knows the answer to these questions, its all anybody's guess.
If that's true... then WHY did God publish His Word which contains answers to all the questions we need to know answers to?

And, whassup with this "if there be a God" bidness anyhow????

Psalms 14:1
The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.
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  #33  
Old 18th September 2013, 05:40 PM
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September 18, 2013

Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved. (NIV)
Acts 4:12
Meditation

Pluralism is a word popular today. It expresses the idea that every belief system is equal to all others. In a spiritual sense, pluralism teaches that all roads lead to the same end. But the Bible teaches something altogether different. On through faith in Jesus Christ can we have a relationship with God assured. Have you trusted in Jesus Christ as your Saviour?
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  #34  
Old 18th September 2013, 05:46 PM
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The RCC has been drifting into doctrinally dangerous waters for years now. Theistic evolution, all religions paths to god etc.

It's the last days we can expect to see deception coming from churches.

Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons

"... new findings lead us toward the recognition of evolution as more than a hypothesis."
— John Paul II, 1996

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[i]From the lone shieling of the misty island
Mountains divide us, and the waste of seas;
Yet still the blood is strong, the heart is Highland,
And we, in dreams, behold the Hebrides.

Although they cannot repay you now, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous (Luke 14:14)


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Last edited by lismore; 18th September 2013 at 05:57 PM.
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  #35  
Old 18th September 2013, 05:52 PM
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....4) What did Pope Francis actually say about atheists and salvation?
Here is the passage:
First of all, you ask if the God of the Christians forgives those who do not believe and do not seek faith.
Given that—and this is fundamental—God's mercy has no limits if he who asks for mercy does so in contrition and with a sincere heart, the issue for those who do not believe in God is in obeying their own conscience.
In fact, listening and obeying it, means deciding about what is perceived to be good or to be evil.
The goodness or the wickedness of our behavior depends on this decision.
In this passage, you’ll note that after introducing the topic of salvation, Pope Francis begins by saying God’s mercy has no limits “if he who asks for mercy does so in contrition and with a sincere heart.”
This statement appears to apply to believers—the ones you would expect to ask God for mercy with contrition, etc.
Pope Francis then pivots to discuss “the issue for those who do not believe in God.”
He says that for them “the issue” is following their conscience, which will result in good behavior.
This is what the press, etc., have been interpreting as him saying that they can be saved.
But he doesn’t actually say that.
Believers also need to follow their conscience, and doing so will result in them having right behavior. But if they don’t follow their consciences then they sin and need to ask for mercy with contrition and a sincere heart.
What are atheists supposed to do if they don’t follow their consciences?
Pope Francis does not address this question.


5) That’s confusing. What is going on here?
There has already been one case in which Pope Francis made remarks that the press took as saying atheists could be saved, yet when his remarks were examined closely, they didn’t say that at all.
You can read about that case here.
Now we have something similar happening.
Why?
One reason, I suspect, is that the pope may be trying to remain within what the Magisterium has already said.

6) What has the Magisterium already said on the subject of atheists and salvation? (More @ National Catholic Register)
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  #36  
Old 18th September 2013, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by BlunderAngel View Post
Pope Francis then pivots to discuss “the issue for those who do not believe in God.”
He says that for them “the issue” is following their conscience, which will result in good behavior.
This is what the press, etc., have been interpreting as him saying that they can be saved.
That's a valid interpretation considering that answer was a direct response to the question concerning the forgiveness of God towards those who don't believe in Him.
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  #37  
Old 18th September 2013, 11:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Svt4Him View Post
Is this just a RCC thing or are there non-RCC's who believe this?
God is the only one who gets it right always. Dont always go with everything man says. Always go to God's Word and Him for the truth. We also have the Holy Spirit in us who is The Spirit of Truth.
If it doesn't feel right, it probably isn't

John 14:6
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.”


The sad thing is there are innocent people who follow everything man says and are being deceived through that.
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If God is for us, who can ever be against us? Since he did not spare even his own Son but gave him up for us all, won’t he also give us everything else?

Who dares accuse us whom God has chosen for his own? No one—for God himself has given us right standing with himself.
Who then will condemn us? No one—for Christ Jesus died for us and was raised to life for us, and he is sitting in the place of honor at God’s right hand, pleading for us - Romans 8

I LOVE YOU JESUS!!!!!
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  #38  
Old 19th September 2013, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Svt4Him View Post
Is this just a RCC thing or are there non-RCC's who believe this?
yeah I heard about this. And the Pope BEFORE this guy stated that if you're not a member of the Catholic Church you can't go to heaven.

These POPE's need to get together and make up their minds I'd say! lol

Oh wait a minute! .. How in the world are they going to reconcile these differences when there is a Papal dogma established by one of the Popes stating that in virtue of the promise of Jesus to Peter, the pope is preserved from the possibility of error. ... sweet mercy... there's gonna be some cat-fights over that isn't there? Since neither of them is wrong.. lol

Foolishess.

I'm not anti-Catholic, but I am against any spirit that keeps any person bound and from what the Word of God has to say. I'm pro people & pro Word of God.
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Those who persecuted Philadelphia were Jews by birth,
but not in God's eyes (Rom 2:28-29).
The assembly of Satan who persecute Christ's bride the
eve of His return think they do God's work but are self-
deceived & do Satan's bidding. These false Christians
cast reproach on the bride, even calling it a deviant or
cult form of religion
. When the judgement arrives, the
Lord will show His approval of His bride by requiring it's
detractors to kiss the feet of those they maligned
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