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  #1  
Old 5th March 2013, 05:32 PM
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Sad The vessel made unto dishonor

Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden....
.........Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?

I hear a lot of different interpretations of scriptures. This scripture has always concerned me, though. Does it mean that a good and righteous Christian can live a life of misery in spite of his faith and devotion to the Lord, while a more self-centered and less earnests Christian can lead a blessed and prosperous life, no matter what they do?
If this is the case, why keep praying about something, not knowing that God has chosen to let me suffer.
I'll give an outline of my own life to explain. I was born into a life of disadvantage – very poor, a social outcast (I believe I was born Asperger's Syndrome). My mother was a Christian, but she harbored a resentment against me because she didn't want a girl.
There was a very strange pattern in my life – all my life of failure, deprive and rejection.
The simplest accomplishments always escaped me. If I got my hopes up on anything – like a trip or vacation or a change to go to the fair (very rare opportunists for me), almost always, something would happen, usually at the very last minute, to prevent me from getting to go. This happened far too often to be coincidence.
It was a pattern that follow me through life. I lost the chance to graduate, get me driver's license, achieve a black-belt. This didn't happen out of laziness or lack of effort– far from it. I went to extremes to reach such seemingly simple goals – but different things would keep happening.
I tried about 4 different times to get horseback riding lessons, I'd even have them set up and scheduled – never happened. Each time, at the last minute, something would prevent it (this was from all different people).
I was saved as a child and tried to really follow God's Will in my life. I tithed faithfully since I was about 16. I never drank, ran wild, did drugs or slept around. I was lonely and was tying to meat Christian men, I earnestly asked God to guide me and help me find somebody – never happened.
I kept trying to go forward in my life, but at 26, I got CFS/Fibromyalgia and ended up on disability. I had faith that God would heal me – never happened. I and 45 and have been sick for a little less than 2 decades.
The physical agony has been so much that I wanted to commit suicide many times and even became angry at the Lord.
Also, I saw another patter that followed me around. Every time I thanked God for something I did have – immediately after I thanked him , I lost it! Even my home. Anything I would Thank God for (trying to stay grateful) or if I spoke of something I had and was thankful for it – I'd lose it – right after!
For the last 4 years, I have occupied a basement that floods during hard rain. We found black mold down here, it's dark and damp, my health has worsened.
This is the truth, every time I have felt well enough and really cleaned the basement, scouring for sanitary reasons. Every single time, the same night or the night after, it would rain and flood the basement. Once during a summer drought, I scrubbed the floors and a hard rain came for that one night only and flooded it with dirty unsanitary water. (I think when it rains too hard, there is sewer water mixed with the rain water.)


Understand, through all this, I put God first and prayed. But lately, I have lost hope and much of my faith. I even pleaded with him to let me die because of the pain.
There is more to the story, I may explain further in this post. But there have been 2 saying that seemed to define my life “No good deed goes unpunished” and “Anything that can go wrong, will.”
So I wonder, if God intends me to be as the clay made as unto dishonor, should I even try? (This is not meant to sound like self-pity, I promise you, it's just desperation for answers).
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  #2  
Old 5th March 2013, 06:28 PM
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forget it. I pm'd you my response
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Romans 8:18
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  #3  
Old 5th March 2013, 07:36 PM
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Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden....
.........Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?

I hear a lot of different interpretations of scriptures. This scripture has always concerned me, though. Does it mean that a good and righteous Christian can live a life of misery in spite of his faith and devotion to the Lord, while a more self-centered and less earnests Christian can lead a blessed and prosperous life, no matter what they do?

I don't think the verse is comparing Christians to Christians. I think the clay that is for honor is believers, and that for dishonor is unbelievers.

Romans 9 22What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—prepared for destruction? 23What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, (I believe believers are the object of mercy) whom he prepared in advance for glory

Your suffering and trials may be many but they are not God treating you as a vessel of dishonor. Gods plans are not our plans. Who can know the mind of God? If we believe God we also believe that He causes all things (even those difficulties you suffer) to work together for our good.

Romans 5
1Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, wea have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And web rejoice in the hope of the glory of God. 3Not only so, but wec also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; 4perseverance, character; and character, hope. 5And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.
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Old 5th March 2013, 07:36 PM
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Last edited by madetoworship; 5th March 2013 at 07:45 PM.
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Old 5th March 2013, 08:32 PM
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I don’t have a specific plan for you, but I do know the principles that will get you out of the spiritual place you are in. They are adaptable to any such circumstance.

When Moses was accused by his brothers, the first thing he did was fall on his face. He was willing to be wrong in the sight of God. He submitted to God for judgment. But then when the Holy Spirit didn’t convict him, he got up in confidence that God would defend him. And He did. There was no confused, faithless middle ground for Moses. Either he was wrong, or God would vindicate him.

In the kind of situation you are in, it is necessary to do the same thing. Examine yourself and make sure you are not bringing anything upon yourself. Trust that God is willing and able to show you where you have been going wrong, if that's the case (Heb 11.6). Submit to Him.

But if there is no sin that is causing self-defeat, then get back up, put on the full armor and take your stand. Because we know that God is not a respecter of persons – He does not play favorites.

That is not to say that some people don’t have more difficult lives than others, as we judge them. It is to say that whatever we come up against in life, God is able to work it for good, according to His promises, such as in Rom 8.28. You need to get into that stronghold of overcoming faith, where you have a confident expectation that no matter how the matter currently at hand ends up, God has a plan for you and nothing is going to stop Him from implementing it. Guard you heart, for out of the heart are the issues of life. It is of critical importance that you do not lose a practical faith in God's care and provision for you because of adverse circumstances, or even a pattern of adverse circumstances. God's faithfulness is a rock on which we can stand, no matter what, because when we come down to that it becomes a question of His character.
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Old 6th March 2013, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by 1hope View Post

Understand, through all this, I put God first and prayed. But lately, I have lost hope and much of my faith. I even pleaded with him to let me die because of the pain.
There is more to the story, I may explain further in this post. But there have been 2 saying that seemed to define my life “No good deed goes unpunished” and “Anything that can go wrong, will.”
So I wonder, if God intends me to be as the clay made as unto dishonor, should I even try? (This is not meant to sound like self-pity, I promise you, it's just desperation for answers).
God in heaven, sister, my heart breaks for you.

My story has been nearly the opposite. I never had money, but all my life I have been showered with love and support and even health. A better than easy life. I thought that it was because I was so good. That if others would only be good like me, they too could live in peace.

I was a fool.

I lost one important thing (my son) and I crumbled like burnt paper. I finally had to swallow what I had been dishing out to others all those years, and it tasted like hell.

Now, I can't say for certain what our Lord is working on in you, but what I do know is that when the Lord passes us through the flames, He is burning away the dross, making us beautiful. You are gonna shine brighter than the sun, sister.

Jesus said, "whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me." You are 'the least of these'. People like me will be judged on how we treated people like you. (Lord have mercy.)

Keep up your prayers, your laments. Even an unrighteous judge will open the door eventually if you keep knocking. You've got the Lord's ear more than most. Make no mistake.

“Because of the oppression of the weakand the groaning of the needy,
I will now arise,” says the Lord.
“I will protect them from those who malign them.”
And the words of the Lord are flawless,
like silver refined in a furnace of clay,
purified seven times." (Ps 12)



The Lord bless you and keep you, sister.
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  #7  
Old 6th March 2013, 09:59 AM
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You need to get yourself out of that basement if possible. The black mold is often the trigger or cause of fibro and other diseases, depression, exhaustion, respiratory problems, etc. The mold is going to make you more tired, and sap your mental energy. Even after your bleach, there will be spores in the air, so make sure to keep windows open.

CDC - Mold - General Information: Facts about Stachybotrys chartarum and Other Molds
Mold health issues - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In addition to what others said, it's important to recognize that life is just that way. Things go wrong continually, and carelessness of others impacts everyone's life. In fact, I have a list of a dozen I have just spent two weeks trying to resolve, and am still in the middle of all of them. All due to others' carelessness. Some involving thousands of dollars, and people's plans for several months. That is life, it's not pretty. But we go on.

In the Bible, when God hardened hearts it was more often the mind of a king from an opposing country -- not a believer. God would allow things to play out in an enemy's negative way, when people did not lean on Him for protection. God hardened the heart of Pharaoh before the Exodus -- I think because many Hebrews wouldn't actually leave unless they saw how dire the circumstances were. The situation needed a clean break from one group oppressing another.
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  #8  
Old 6th March 2013, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by seeingeyes View Post
God in heaven, sister, my heart breaks for you.

My story has been nearly the opposite. I never had money, but all my life I have been showered with love and support and even health. A better than easy life. I thought that it was because I was so good. That if others would only be good like me, they too could live in peace.

I was a fool.

I lost one important thing (my son) and I crumbled like burnt paper. I finally had to swallow what I had been dishing out to others all those years, and it tasted like hell.
Oh, I am sorry about the loss of your son. thank you for your words, they mean a lot to me.

Thank you all for your answers, I don't feel so very alone through all this now. Your words and advice give me hope, something I have lost so much of the last couple of years. God bless!!
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  #9  
Old 6th March 2013, 10:48 AM
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It's great that you came here -- it's so hard to find friends and family members that will stand by you in the way that you need during a transition like this.
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  #10  
Old 7th March 2013, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by parsley View Post
You need to get yourself out of that basement if possible. The black mold is often the trigger or cause of fibro and other diseases, depression, exhaustion, respiratory problems, etc. The mold is going to make you more tired, and sap your mental energy. Even after your bleach, there will be spores in the air, so make sure to keep windows open.

I keep a window cracked often in the winter and there are 3 windows that can open in the summer. I know about the danger. I confess I've been a little worried for my lungs too, not only because of the mold but because of the possibility of Radon and other gasses. I've tested for Carbon monoxide and Radon. But I have not been able to get out. I am renting a very small house with a brother and our mother - both also on disability. The house is very small, no room for me upstairs. I take my mattress up (with my brother's help) and sleep on the utility room floor when the basement floods.
I have tried to move but have not had the finances. I am praying, believe me I am praying!
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