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  #11  
Unread 13th November 2012, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Adam Warlock View Post
I'm an AC too. As far as I know, one could absolutely hold Orthodox beliefs about those things. Pretty sure that all of the ACs whom I know believe in Original Sin as Western Christians have defined it, but I can't say if that's "required" or not. To me, an AC is someone who believes that the Anglican Church didn't come into existence at the Reformation. He or she also believes in the the Councils, the Creeds, and the traditional beliefs & practices that were shared by the undivided Church. Those beliefs are expressed in certain forms of Sunday worship, devotional practices, etc. Since that undivided Church included Eastern Christians, some ACs like icons and Eastern devotions. Eastern theology might also be an area of interest.
This sounds a lot like what I believe, although I believe in the eastern concept of ancestral sin rather than original sin. I pray the Angelus, and pray for the departed, and for the intercession of the Saints. I also incorporate icons and eastern devotions into my personal worship. I don't believe in the immaculate conception or the assumption of Mary, or in the Papacy. Or in purgatory. Maybe I'm semi AC.
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  #12  
Unread 14th November 2012, 01:22 AM
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Personally I think I'm an "open evangelical" Anglican like N.T. Wright, who just happens to be in an AC parish. I'm fine with that, and I do like all the ceremony.
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  #13  
Unread 14th November 2012, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Izdaari View Post
Personally I think I'm an "open evangelical" Anglican like N.T. Wright, who just happens to be in an AC parish.I'm fine with that, and I do like all the ceremony.
I do, too.

To be more precise, I like the ceremony except for the extremes that sometimes appear, but I also appreciate a dignified Low Church ritual. We should, in any case, keep in mind that this isn't what defines Anglo-Catholicism since there are High Church Evangelicals and Low Church Anglo-Catholics.
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Unread 14th November 2012, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Albion View Post

I do, too.

To be more precise, I like the ceremony except for the extremes that sometimes appear, but I also appreciate a dignified Low Church ritual. We should, in any case, keep in mind that this isn't what defines Anglo-Catholicism since there are High Church Evangelicals and Low Church Anglo-Catholics.
In both England and Australia liturgical style and theological outlook are sufficiently heavily correlated that high-church is pretty much synomous with Anglo-Catholic and low-church with Evangelical. The theoretical low-church A/C is as rare as hens teeth.
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  #15  
Unread 14th November 2012, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by ebia View Post
In both England and Australia liturgical style and theological outlook are sufficiently heavily correlated that high-church is pretty much synomous with Anglo-Catholic and low-church with Evangelical.
Yes, I think most of us know that.
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  #16  
Unread 14th November 2012, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Albion View Post

Yes, I think most of us know that.
So then, for lot of people the liturgy is the largest single part of what denies Anglo-Catholic.
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Unread 14th November 2012, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ebia View Post
So then, for lot of people the liturgy is the largest single part of what denies Anglo-Catholic.
You're talking about popular impressions; I was talking about accuracy.

While we can easily acknowledge the former, it seems to me that we ought to strive for the latter here. That's why I said that ceremony doesn't "define" Anglo-Catholicism (even though it usually accompanies it, and for good reason).
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Unread 14th November 2012, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Albion View Post

You're talking about popular impressions; I was talking about accuracy.

While we can easily acknowledge the former, it seems to me that we ought to strive for the latter here. That's why I said that ceremony doesn't "define" Anglo-Catholicism (even though it usually accompanies it, and for good reason).
I think you are trying to be precise about a term that isn't precise.

And if "we are what we pray"...
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  #19  
Unread 14th November 2012, 03:24 PM
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Since we are what we pray, I would say that the liturgy, and the understanding of the liturgy (including the Eucharist) do indeed define Anglo-Catholic. I would also suggest that IMHO Anglo-Catholics also have a different sense of Church and of Tradition/tradition. They maintain many of the traditions of the ancient church including saints, relics, Mary, the monastic life, lay orders and much more.

For example, I see the ABC as the patriarch of the English speaking Church, with roots that traditionally go back to the ancient Church. For me, it is an accident of history (and a tragic one) that we are not the English Orthodox Church.

And yes, many Anglo-Catholic can understand the idea that the Patriarch of Rome could be considered the first among equal patriarchs of the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church. For me, it is not critical whether the first among equals is the Patriarch of Constantinople, Jerusalem or Rome.

I have been long winded. I guess, the nature of the Church is also important, in addition to the form of the liturgy. In the end, the nature of the Church is much more important. As in the RCC, there can be much variety in liturgy across cultures and even with cultures. For example, there are charismatic groups in the RCC and in the AC.

Originally Posted by ebia View Post
So then, for lot of people the liturgy is the largest single part of what denies Anglo-Catholic.
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Unread 14th November 2012, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by mark1 View Post
Since we are what we pray, I would say that the liturgy, and the understanding of the liturgy (including the Eucharist) do indeed define Anglo-Catholic.
IOW, the exact opposite of the perspective held by the Oxford Divines who gave us Anglo-Catholicism in the first place.
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