| The Ancient Way - Eastern Orthodox The forum for Eastern Orthodox churches (such as Greek, Russian, Antiochian, etc). |
 | | 
13th October 2012, 04:10 PM
|  | Can somebody please pass the incense?
    
| | Join Date: 21st May 2009 Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 1,192
Blessings: 5,050,586 My Mood 
Reps: 162,440,654,515,197,408 (power: 162,440,654,515,203) | | | Ancient Christians, today's Orthodox, and the Sabbath
Is anyone informed about how the early Christians treated the Sabbath? It was always on Saturday for the Jews, the first Christians were Jews, and for some time they continued (as I'm able to tell) worshipping in the temple and synagogues on the Sabbath, but also held services (homes, etc.) on Sundays to observe the resurrection of Christ through the breaking of bread, fellowship meals and preaching/reading of NT letters.
What happened after Christianity split away from Judaism? At what point did worship move to Sunday? And, did Christians come to see Sunday as the new Sabbath day, or did they continue to see Saturday as the Sabbath and Sunday as the Lord's Day?
What about working on those days, vs. setting them apart for worship and service to God?
How does Orthodoxy view this today?
I've really never heard this addressed. I know Protestant interpretation of this varies quite widely. Honestly I'm not sure about Catholic views...whether they differ from Orthodoxy or not.
__________________
"Only pray that I may have power within and without, so that I may not only say it but also desire it; that I may not only be called a Christian, but also be found one." - St. Ignatius of Antioch
My two cents...worth every penny!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
13th October 2012, 06:23 PM
|  | Doin' that whole Orthodox thing
29  
 | | Join Date: 9th December 2005 Location: South Canaan, PA
Posts: 8,106
Blessings: 3,077,233
Reps: 412,362,632,947,693,184 (power: 412,362,632,947,709) | | | the main day of Christian worship has always been Sunday, but the Sabbath has always remained Saturday for us. It is still that way today.
__________________
"Acquire a peaceful spirit and 1000s around you will be saved"--St. Seraphim
”For as it is not yet six thousand years since the first man, who is called Adam, are not those to be ridiculed rather than refuted who try to persuade us of anything regarding a space of time so different from, and contrary to, the ascertained truth?” St. Augustine |
13th October 2012, 06:39 PM
| | Veteran
39 
| | Join Date: 14th May 2006 Location: New York
Posts: 4,006
Blessings: 1,143,879
Reps: 184,029,514,354,317,600 (power: 184,029,514,354,329) | | | Read the canons, they address this. The liturgy can be celebrated on both a saturday and sunday. During lent it is forbidden to celebrate the DL on the weekdays since only saturday and sunday is considered the festal days of worship.
That christians always worshipped on saturday (and sunday) is false. The church of Rome never ever gathered on saturday for worship, they instead fasted on that day in anticipation for sunday. The evidence is so overwhelming for this. It were the asian churches that worshipped on both saturday and sunday. Rome (and pre-5th century Alexandria) followed a different tradition where saturday was to no longer a festal day but the day the disciples mourned the burial in grief.
Last edited by buzuxi02; 13th October 2012 at 06:49 PM.
|
13th October 2012, 07:21 PM
| | Regular Member
 
| | Join Date: 13th August 2012
Posts: 539
Blessings: 7,682 My Mood
Reps: 41,159,537,815,148,816 (power: 0) | | | You forgot the Hindus, the Moslems, the Bahai's, and the other-religion people. |
13th October 2012, 09:44 PM
|  | Senior Member
| | Join Date: 18th June 2007 Location: New York
Posts: 3,200
Blessings: 11,342,716 My Mood 
Reps: 585,151,852,732,879,872 (power: 585,151,852,732,888) | | Originally Posted by Ignatius21  Is anyone informed about how the early Christians treated the Sabbath? It was always on Saturday for the Jews, the first Christians were Jews, and for some time they continued (as I'm able to tell) worshipping in the temple and synagogues on the Sabbath, but also held services (homes, etc.) on Sundays to observe the resurrection of Christ through the breaking of bread, fellowship meals and preaching/reading of NT letters.
Sounds accurate to me. I know from the Didache and from Pliny's letter to Trajan that Christians worshiped on the "Lord's Day" (Sunday, the day of Resurrection) from quite an early date; I think Acts confirms this, but I don't have the reference handy.
Saturday remains the Sabbath, though, since on Saturday Christ rested in the tomb, having completed the Creation of Man on the 6th day (Friday). Sunday became the 8th day of the old creation (superfulfillment) and the 1st day of the new creation. Here, I'm combining a bit of Origen (for the allegorizing of Christ's rest in the Sabbath) and Augustine (for the number-symbolism of the 8th day / 1st day stuff).
The Octoechoes, the weekly cycle of hymns for today's Orthodoxy, still refers to Saturday as the Sabbath. So its definitely, 100% still Saturday. Sunday is not the Sabbath, it is not the day Christ rested in the tomb - it is the 1st day of the New Creation, the day of Resurrection.
Hope that helps.
Good to hear from you / see you here. How have you been?
In Christ,
Macarius  |
14th October 2012, 03:01 AM
| | Newbie
  
| | Join Date: 3rd October 2009
Posts: 1,397
Blessings: 1,080,303 My Mood 
Reps: 105,736,992,925,981,088 (power: 105,736,992,925,986) | | | This certainly is news to me and I am unclear what it means when you say that Saturday is still the Sabbath. I know that the RCC considers Sunday to be the Sabbath and the day that one is refrain from labor that is not essential. As I recall, the Sabbath and/or day of worship was officially named as Sunday somewhere around the time of Constantine. Obviously, we all know that Christians had been worshipping on Sunday since the earliest days, though no doubt Jewish Christians still viewed Saturday as the Sabbath for several hundred years. |
14th October 2012, 05:37 AM
|  | Regular Member
30
| | Join Date: 26th January 2007
Posts: 9,177
Blessings: 2,135,928
Reps: 889,701,577,308,805,504 (power: 889,701,577,308,821) | | | well, for starters, welcome back man. good to see you again.
I think I would run with what jckstraw said by saying that the Sabbath for us is still Saturday (because it was the day Christ rested in the tomb), and we go to work on Sunday because the Liturgy literally is the work of the people.
if you want a solid book that has good stuff about this, I reccomend The Truth of Our Faith Vol I. it was a dialogue between a Protestant inquirer and Elder Cleopa of Romania. there is a whole chapter on Sunday being the day of worship.
__________________
"Everyone capable of thanksgiving is capable of joy and eternal salvation." -Fr. Alexander Schmemann
"The time of the end, though it seems to be near, we do not know. Let us then struggle while it is still day, with the time and the weapons which our All-merciful God has given us!" -Fr. Seraphim Rose |
14th October 2012, 09:05 AM
|  | strives to live eschatologically
37  
| | Join Date: 4th February 2005
Posts: 5,851
Blessings: 2,175,100 My Mood 
Reps: 388,320,850,392,329,792 (power: 388,320,850,392,343) | | Originally Posted by Basil the Great This certainly is news to me and I am unclear what it means when you say that Saturday is still the Sabbath. I know that the RCC considers Sunday to be the Sabbath and the day that one is refrain from labor that is not essential. As I recall, the Sabbath and/or day of worship was officially named as Sunday somewhere around the time of Constantine. Obviously, we all know that Christians had been worshipping on Sunday since the earliest days, though no doubt Jewish Christians still viewed Saturday as the Sabbath for several hundred years.
The day of the sabbath can't be changed. It's an everlasting ordinance according to God. It's the 7th day on which God rested from the work of creation. You can't change which day is the 7th day of the week.
Sunday is the mystical 8th day, the day that points to the new, incorrupt creation.
The distinguishing feature of the sabbath is NOT that it is a day of worship. It is that it is a day of rest. A sabbath breaker wasn't someone who didn't go to temple, it was a person who worked on the sabbath. Christ fulfilled the commandment to rest on the sabbath when he rested in the tomb on great and holy Saturday. We celebrate the Eucharist on Sunday as our central act of worship because that is how He told us to remember Him until He comes. Many Christians misunderstand the sabbath and that is why they think the day can be "changed" to Sunday. That's impossible.
M.
__________________
We have received the seal of the Holy Spirit. Our task now is to preserve the integrity of what we have received by living a truly Christian life.
We must give time to prayer, and to the study of scripture. Now speaking to God; now listening to His word to us, and letting His teaching mold us. He has enriched us with a treasure no one can take away.
We have eaten and drunk at His heavenly banquet, and can never again know the pinch of poverty. --St. Cyprian of Carthage
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
15th October 2012, 07:04 PM
|  | Mark 9:14-29
 
| | Join Date: 19th December 2011
Posts: 935
Blessings: 42,643
Reps: 41,123,349,066,666,672 (power: 41,123,349,066,668) | | | The he Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church celebrates the Sabbath and the first day. They also forbid pork. This is because of cultural factors they had less gentile influence than Roman Empire churches and therefore retained more of the Jewish practices that fell out of favor in the more Gentile Roman Christian churches. |
15th October 2012, 08:07 PM
| | Senior Member
| | Join Date: 18th June 2007 Location: New York
Posts: 3,200
Blessings: 11,342,716 My Mood
Reps: 585,151,852,732,879,872 (power: 585,151,852,732,888) | | Originally Posted by SeventhValley The he Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church celebrates the Sabbath and the first day. They also forbid pork. This is because of cultural factors they had less gentile influence than Roman Empire churches and therefore retained more of the Jewish practices that fell out of favor in the more Gentile Roman Christian churches.
I think it had less to do with a lack of "Gentile" influence and more to do with the reintroduction of Judaizing practices due to mythic ties between the Davidic-Solomonic dynasty (of iron-age Israel) and the medieval Ethiopian crown.
Regardless, as we've already said, the Orthodox Churches keep Saturday as the Sabbath, and Sunday as the Resurrection Day. | | |
| Thread Tools | | | | Display Modes |  Linear Mode |
| | |
