Why doesn't God make Himself known again?

dysert · #11 25th June 2012, 05:20 AM

Originally Posted by BuffMonkey5

God should definitely make himself known. And if he does, like someone pointed out, he should do it for an extended period of time in different locations so that a grand majority of people (and heCK, why not all) see him in his glory. Hey, and why not just repeat this every year for all eternity. It'll be like some sort of holiday. God viewing day.

Why are we arguing against wanting this?

I'm with you. If someone's eternal destiny were in the balance, and I had the power to change it, I'd certainly let people know about me.

Having said that, I think He already has made Himself known:
Rom. 1:20 --> "For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse"

John 14:9 --> "Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, `Show us the Father'?"

Furthermore, Jesus also said that even if someone were to come back from the dead, people wouldn't believe (Luke 16:31).

Personally, this is a question I'd like to know the answer to: "Why not continue to make Yourself known in ways that we can readily perceive?" For that matter, another question is, "Why use selfish, cowardly, fallible humans to convey this all-important message to others instead of having supernatural angels going around proclaiming the truth about You?"

Fortunately, we do have the inerrant Word of God to come to the rescue, but what about those people who don't have that luxury?

It's obviously still a mystery to me. Just being honest :-(.

ebia · #12 25th June 2012, 06:06 AM

Originally Posted by ViaCrucis

He is doing just that. It's called the Church.

-CryptoLutheran

Of course the church ain't always crash hot at passing on the message without adding an awful lot of extraneous noise.

BuffMonkey5 · #13 25th June 2012, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by dysert

I'm with you. If someone's eternal destiny were in the balance, and I had the power to change it, I'd certainly let people know about me.

Having said that, I think He already has made Himself known:
Rom. 1:20 --> "For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse"

John 14:9 --> "Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, `Show us the Father'?"

Furthermore, Jesus also said that even if someone were to come back from the dead, people wouldn't believe (Luke 16:31).

Personally, this is a question I'd like to know the answer to: "Why not continue to make Yourself known in ways that we can readily perceive?" For that matter, another question is, "Why use selfish, cowardly, fallible humans to convey this all-important message to others instead of having supernatural angels going around proclaiming the truth about You?"

Fortunately, we do have the inerrant Word of God to come to the rescue, but what about those people who don't have that luxury?

It's obviously still a mystery to me. Just being honest :-(.

Hey, man. These are really good questions. This whole business is pretty mysterious, huh?

non-religious · #14 26th June 2012, 05:23 AM

Thanks for the responses

I'm not really getting the answer that I am looking for.

Millions of Christians around the world, do not any more validate the so-called truth of Christianity, than all the Muslims do Islam. Millions of people can/will be very wrong. I appreciate the wonders of creation, the inner voice believers hear, the Church, the traditions etc...

Those are things that are already applicable to believers or those on the brink of belief. I am talking about the vast majority of the earth's population who do not have a relationship with God or are following the wrong path. If an audible voice from the heavens declared that Jesus is the Way, then the consequence of such a declaration will absolutely bring millions to a belief and trust in God.

So why on earth would God not do that?

Does He desire that all be saved? If so, wouldn't it be more beneficial to make His presence known, in a way that is not easily accepted by traditional Christians? A loud, booming voice would absolutely do that?

WinBySurrender · #15 26th June 2012, 08:39 AM

Originally Posted by non-religious

Thanks for the responses

I'm not really getting the answer that I am looking for.

Millions of Christians around the world, do not any more validate the so-called truth of Christianity, than all the Muslims do Islam. Millions of people can/will be very wrong. I appreciate the wonders of creation, the inner voice believers hear, the Church, the traditions etc...

Those are things that are already applicable to believers or those on the brink of belief. I am talking about the vast majority of the earth's population who do not have a relationship with God or are following the wrong path. If an audible voice from the heavens declared that Jesus is the Way, then the consequence of such a declaration will absolutely bring millions to a belief and trust in God.

So why on earth would God not do that?

Does He desire that all be saved? If so, wouldn't it be more beneficial to make His presence known, in a way that is not easily accepted by traditional Christians? A loud, booming voice would absolutely do that?

I'm mystified as to why you believe that would convince billions of anything? They would still deny the voice, just as they denied the resurrection. As Abraham told the rich man in hell:

Luke 16 NASB
31 "But he said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.' "

Publius · #16 26th June 2012, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by non-religious

So, I was just pondering on the thought that if God was/is so interested in people believing in Him and avoiding an eternity without Him. Why does He not, in a loud and booming voice declare that Jesus is His Son and that He is very much real?

If you don't believe the Bible, why would you believe a "loud and booming voice"? And how would you know this "loud and booming voice" is God?

What would be the point of doing this? Isn't God's effectual call...erm, effectual?

Surely, the amount of people that would respond to a loud, booming voice from the heavens would be insurmountable?

Surely not. The Bible says that men already have two witnesses of God and yet, they still hate Him.

Your entire premise is false, as it assumes that it's up to us to seek God and that men would seek God if only they would hear from Him, but that's precisely the opposite of what Jesus said. Jesus said that it isn't men who seek God, but God who seeks and calls men.

non-religious · #17 26th June 2012, 11:32 AM

[WinBySurrender]I'm mystified as to why you believe that would convince billions of anything? They would still deny the voice, just as they denied the resurrection. As Abraham told the rich man in hell:
Luke 16 NASB
31 "But he said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.' "

In this day and age where current events are broadcast throughout the world, it would be a very different prospect entirely, if God revealed Himself via the loud and booming voice. If people in China hear the same message at the same time as Mr Jones walking his dog, somewhere in London. Why on earth would you not think that many more millions would come to believe?

As the verse you cited states, there will always be those who will resolutely refuse to believe, but God can, if He so wills, make Himself know in a way that cannot be refuted or questioned. The world could know in an instance that He is real. Instead, what we have to rely upon is a very old book, that has been the source of doubt, debate and death (the latter especially so) and it causes people to be skeptical, unbelieving and offended.

God, if He really desires all to be saved, could in a very instance add to the numbers of believers by making himself known again. If you witnessed a stark decline in the number of believers, wouldn't you do something spectacular to make your message appeal to the unbelieving masses?

A thunderous voice from the heavens, transmitted to the entire world at the same time, would be one way in which God could do it. I'm sure He can very easily create something more persuasive, should He choose to.

non-religious · #18 26th June 2012, 11:41 AM

[Publius]
Your entire premise is false, as it assumes that it's up to us to seek God and that men would seek God if only they would hear from Him, but that's precisely the opposite of what Jesus said. Jesus said that it isn't men who seek God, but God who seeks and calls men.

If God has the power to save and call all, but refuses and only calls a few, thus consequently sending the masses to hell. What does that say about the God you serve?

WinBySurrender · #19 26th June 2012, 01:21 PM

Originally Posted by non-religious

In this day and age where current events are broadcast throughout the world, it would be a very different prospect entirely, if God revealed Himself via the loud and booming voice

On what do you base tis statement? The spoken word was trusted throughout the first-century world, as was the written word. That was how news was transported. So if someone spoke of Jesus' resurrection, it got the attention of everyone, even the skeptics. With today's instant communications and innovative technology, a "loud voice booming from heaven" would be assumed by nearly everyone (even believers) to be satellite- or hypersonic airplane-based loud speaker, or a compressed atmosphere device that could theoretically make the voice heard throughout the world. Assuming people will pay any attention to a miracle of this type and not credit it to a man-created event, even if such an event is beyond our technological skill set, would be giving way too much credit to the human susceptibility to God's influence. Hearts are hardened, and would not except even such a miracle. Besides which, God left it in our hands to spread the gospel, when Jesus gave the Great Commission to His church.

Publius · #20 26th June 2012, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by non-religious

If God has the power to save and call all, but refuses and only calls a few, thus consequently sending the masses to hell. What does that say about the God you serve?

That He's sovereign.