Is Marriage a Sacred Institution?

Originally Posted by Godcreatedsteve

Blatantly false. Please give the quote and cite your source.

Read St. Ignatius' Letter to St. Polycarp.

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For You are the Lord Most High, of great compassion, long-suffering, and very merciful, and You relent at human suffering. O Lord, according to Your great goodness You have promised repentance and forgiveness to those who have sinned against You, and in the multitude of Your mercies You have appointed repentance for sinners so that they may be saved.

-Prayer of Manasseh verse 7 (NRSV)
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Marriage is a complex, elaborate, and culturally diverse thing. Most cultures have some form of marriage, ranging from highly complex social rituals to the very simple.

The concept of marriage in Christianity has been an evolving one. One is not going to find a marriage rite in the New Testament because such wasn't particularly necessary--what was important was rather that two that are married be faithful to each other. In some ways the early Church (and this can be seen in the New Testament) somewhat saw celibacy to be preferable to marriage, though highly resisted those who sought to present marriage as ungodly.

Marriage was mostly a state or civil matter (as addressed, the Apostles didn't lay down any marriage rites) and Christians likely got married the same way everyone else did in the culture. A Christian in Athens would get married like any other Greek would, a Christian in Rome would get married like a Roman, etc.

As we approach and move through the middle ages, marriage evolves into a solemn and sacred rite, and is reckoned as one of seven recognized Sacraments in the Western Church. St. Thomas Aquinas, in the Summa, addresses it as such, and seeks to offer philosophically how a marriage is properly constituted. Though, for Aquinas, the efficient cause of matrimony is consent, and the marriage is consecrated by consummation, intercourse between the two. As such, the validity of the Sacrament of Holy Matrimony is dependent upon two consenting and consummating, and have thus joined together as one flesh--married.

As we have moved into the modern period, with the advent of modern democracy in the late 18th and early 19th centuries, the religious and the secular have been separated into their respective fields of human endeavor in such political/social models. As such, marriage remains a religious institution as well as a secular contract.

It's in this that things have become more complicated in trying to "define marriage".

-CryptoLutheran

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To be crucified with Christ means to be in the business of dying. Our arms should be outstretched, unable to make a fist or be armed to injure. To be crucified is to be too busy suffering, serving, and loving everyone that we don't have time to think ill or wish one harm. "When Christ calls a man, He bids him, 'Come and die.'" (Dietrich Bonhoeffer)

Godcreatedsteve-

I suspect that your OP was designed to give credence to gay marriages. That will not be approved by Christians, nor will we drag the sacred institution of Christian marriage into the dirt by permitting it to be put on the same level as what many of us see as fragrant acts of perversion.

We have a code of conduct which homosexuality in all its forms violates. That code is spelled out in this passage:

So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.

The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other. (Galatians 5:16-26,NIV)

Originally Posted by Godcreatedsteve

1 Corinthians 6:16 "Or do you not know that he who is joined to a prostitute becomes one body with her? For, as it is written, 'The two will become one flesh.'"

Do you also view prostitution as a sacred institution?


'One flesh' simply means 'sexual relations.' There is nothing inherently sacred about it.

You wish. No, it means that the two in fact become emotionally, spiritually and mentally intertwined. When Paul wrote those words, he was speaking of the emotional and spiritual attachment one has when sex is the most important thing on his mind. Corinth was a city filled with prostitutes working in the temple of Aphrodite. The city was a crossroads of the world, with sailors, merchants, worldly minded people who flocked to Corinth to participate in gambling, legalized temple prostitution, business adventures and amusement available in this first century navy town. The city soon became a melting pot for the approximately 500,000 people who lived there when Paul arrived. Paul was using the marriage metaphor for the relationship these people had with the wild life of the city.

As to the actual meaning of the phrase, you speak without checking the facts. The Hebrew phrase in Genesis 2:24 is hayah 'echad basar, "exist as one being." The Greek is eimi heis sarx, "exist as one body." The connotation is not of simple flesh, but every fiber of being. This is what true marriage is.

I'm asking you again to back up your claim "Marriage has been considered sacramental since St. Ignatius of Antioch." It's not my job to back up your false statement - that's your obligation. And I'm still waiting.

He never said they were one flesh with the city - I don't know how anyone could leap to that far-fetched conclusion. His meaning is quite clear and specific.

1 Corinthians 6:16 "Or do you not know that he who is joined to a prostitute becomes one body with her? For, as it is written, 'The two will become one flesh.'"

He meant exactly what he wrote. And the same Greek words "Mia sarx" which Jesus uses in Mark 19:6 are the words Paul uses in 1 Cor 6:16. So unless you want to acknowledge that prostitution is a sacred institution, there is no basis for making the assumption about marriage. You should also realize that it was the Pagans - not the Israelites - who had sanctified human sexuality as a way to draw closer to their gods. So your view of marriage and human sexuality is much closer the Pagan view.

Your assumptions have nothing to do with the topic. It might be better to start another thread if you want to give a sermon.

Originally Posted by Godcreatedsteve

I'm asking you again to back up your claim "Marriage has been considered sacramental since St. Ignatius of Antioch." It's not my job to back up your false statement - that's your obligation. And I'm still waiting.

I gave you where to look - it isn't my obligation to make you read it.

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For You are the Lord Most High, of great compassion, long-suffering, and very merciful, and You relent at human suffering. O Lord, according to Your great goodness You have promised repentance and forgiveness to those who have sinned against You, and in the multitude of Your mercies You have appointed repentance for sinners so that they may be saved.

-Prayer of Manasseh verse 7 (NRSV)
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It's your obligation to back the statement you made, and obviously you can't.

Originally Posted by Godcreatedsteve

It's your obligation to back the statement you made, and obviously you can't.

I did; I cited where you can look.

If you don't like the answer; that's your choice. It is ridiculous however to simply dismiss it.

__________________
President of the WACCAV
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For You are the Lord Most High, of great compassion, long-suffering, and very merciful, and You relent at human suffering. O Lord, according to Your great goodness You have promised repentance and forgiveness to those who have sinned against You, and in the multitude of Your mercies You have appointed repentance for sinners so that they may be saved.

-Prayer of Manasseh verse 7 (NRSV)
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