Atheism. What are your thoughts?

AtheistAlan · #1 21st April 2012, 11:16 AM

First, I would like to be very clear. I'm not here to promote atheism. I am not here to answer questions about atheism, as that is clearly not allowed on these forums.

I had an entire thread deleted because I wanted to answer any questions about atheism, respectively, so that I can show that we are good, normal people like everyone else. I wanted to inform and educate about what, exactly, we are or are not. That is clearly not allowed. I was respectful the entire time. I even appealed, but I was denied that request. The reason given is that they do not allow "Ask a ___" for non-Christians. I did not post in a Christian only sub-forum category.

I am here to hear any conceptions you may have about atheism. I will then attempt to either confirm, correct, elaborate, or debate.

I am here to engage in stimulating conversation. I kindly request that everyone be respectful at all times. I thank everyone for their time and comments.

-Atheist Alan

AlexBP · #2 21st April 2012, 12:29 PM

What do you think about people who claim to have had personal experiences with God, such as holy visions, locutions, or direct communications from God?

What do you think about people who, because of their religious beliefs, worked hard for social reform and did a great amount of good in the world, such as John Wesley, George Fox, Gandhi, Mother Teresa, and Rev. Martin Luther King? Do you think it would have been better if they hadn't been religious and thus hadn't done what they did?

AtheistAlan · #3 21st April 2012, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by AlexBP

What do you think about people who claim to have had personal experiences with God, such as holy visions, locutions, or direct communications from God?

What do you think about people who, because of their religious beliefs, worked hard for social reform and did a great amount of good in the world, such as John Wesley, George Fox, Gandhi, Mother Teresa, and Rev. Martin Luther King? Do you think it would have been better if they hadn't been religious and thus hadn't done what they did?

I think that good people can do good things, and bad people can do bad things. I don't specifically care why they are motivated to do good things, so long as good things are done. And of course I don't mean overly bad things that have some good included in them.

Mother Teresa was a highly regarded "spokesperson", if you will, for Catholics. She raised quite a lot of money to help poor people. But when you look at what the actual result, were that a majority of donated funds were NOT used to actually help the suffering improve quality of life. There are several Youtube videos that highlight my point. (I cannot link in posts, yet)

I'm in no way saying that the above is true, as I have not performed extensive research on the subject, I'm simply using it as an example. I also note that MT may not have known where the funds were being used.

Also, lets not forget a fairly recent court case where a woman killed her children because she thought God told her to do it. Again, the why or the reason still doesn't outweigh the actual act.

People around the world find different sources of motivation for both good and bad things.

-Atheist Alan

Davian · #4 21st April 2012, 06:23 PM

Originally Posted by AlexBP

What do you think about people who claim to have had personal experiences with God, such as holy visions, locutions, or direct communications from God?

I would ask why these direct communications with "God" do not appear to rise above the level of personal anecdote.

Originally Posted by AlexBP

What do you think about people who, because of their religious beliefs, worked hard for social reform and did a great amount of good in the world, such as John Wesley, George Fox, Gandhi, Mother Teresa, and Rev. Martin Luther King? Do you think it would have been better if they hadn't been religious and thus hadn't done what they did?

I do not accept the premise of the question. You cannot demonstrate that those individuals did these things because they were religious, or that they would not have done them were they not.

drjean · #5 21st April 2012, 07:18 PM

Originally Posted by AtheistAlan

I had an entire thread deleted because I wanted to answer any questions about atheism, respectively, so that I can show that we are good, normal people like everyone else.

-Atheist Alan

Aye, there's the rub.

Christians believe that God says that none of us are good...that we are all sinners and even our Sunday best is "as filthy rags" before the goodness of God.

Perhaps a new premise can begin us all on equal ground?

AtheistAlan · #6 21st April 2012, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by drjean

Aye, there's the rub.

Christians believe that God says that none of us are good...that we are all sinners and even our Sunday best is "as filthy rags" before the goodness of God.

Perhaps a new premise can begin us all on equal ground?

Ah, see that is where I respectfully disagree. I do not believe that the first humans, as per the Holy Bible, who committed the original sin, really determine if I'm a bad person. I believe our actions are who we truly are.

Also, I'm fuzzy on the exact details, as it has been a couple of years since reading the Holy Bible, but didn't Jesus's sacrifice absolve humans of the original sin and save us all? My understanding may be outdated or centered around the incorrect denomination.

-Atheist Alan

Orkan · #7 21st April 2012, 11:24 PM

Also, lets not forget a fairly recent court case where a woman killed her children because she thought God told her to do it. Again, the why or the reason still doesn't outweigh the actual act.

The problem I have with this is that often those who commit crimes such as this are the victims of mental illness. I don't know which specific case you're referring to, but often post-partum psychosis can take the form of religious-based hallucinations and delusions. It is not the fault of the religion at all. If there were no religion, her hallucinations would have been of something else and the result would likely be the same. If you want to make a compelling argument about the harm religion can cause, it might be best not to include the mentally ill.

SavingCady · #8 21st April 2012, 11:29 PM

Originally Posted by AtheistAlan

....didn't Jesus's sacrifice absolve humans of the original sin and save us all? My understanding may be outdated or centered around the incorrect denomination.

-Atheist Alan

Jesus Christs sacrifice "saves you" from Hell if you accept Him as your Savior. Other than that, no, I wouldn't say He "saved" everyone. He paid for everyone's sins, but being saved is a gift that YOU have to accept.

Buy Bologna · #9 21st April 2012, 11:55 PM

For some reason, christians/theist get uncomfortable when presented with the fact that there are good people who don't need their virtues from a holy book. Or a belief in a god.

drjean · #10 22nd April 2012, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by Buy Bologna

For some reason, christians/theist get uncomfortable when presented with the fact that there are good people who don't need their virtues from a holy book. Or a belief in a god.

I certainly know that that is the basis of such a religion as atheism. However, again and especially since this is in the philosophy forum, I just want to make clear that Christians believe (that) without an Absolute Truth and Perfect God as an example, man has nothing to which to compare, and thus there can be no morals or virtues.