| Spirit Filled / Charismatic Debate A subforum where WOF and non-WOF may discuss their different theological ideas. |
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9th March 2012, 10:40 AM
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Reps: 741,125,502,163,455,360 (power: 741,125,502,163,463) | | Originally Posted by importunity  Look man, if you want to reject what the bible says because you can't reason it out that's cool. Taking the literal translation says HE BECAME SIN. How? God put it on Him (it pleased Him to bruise Him). Do we understand it all? No one does. God said it and His thoughts and ways are more superior than ours.
It's all about the Blood sacrifice. I see no difference in saying 'Jesus died spiritually" and 'Jesus was a sinner'. That's what God was teaching in the OT sacrifices. Jesus was our substitute. He died for us. Some of the English translators understood. Many did not. It's a horrible translation to say that Jesus became sin/sinner.
Romans 8:3 (NASB)
3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh,
And your comment is uncalled for.
"Look man, if you want to reject what the bible says because you can't reason it out that's cool."
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9th March 2012, 10:45 AM
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Reps: 1,735,455,503,896,530 (power: 1,735,455,503,903) | | Originally Posted by dollarsbill It's all about the Blood sacrifice. I see no difference in saying 'Jesus died spiritually" and 'Jesus was a sinner'. That's what God was teaching in the OT sacrifices. Jesus was our substitute. He died for us. Some of the English translators understood. Many did not. It's a horrible translation to say that Jesus became sin/sinner.
Romans 8:3 (NASB)
3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh,
And your comment is uncalled for.
"Look man, if you want to reject what the bible says because you can't reason it out that's cool."
Look, if you are taking offense it wasn't meant in that manor so it seems to me that we are at an impasse. So have fun, and I pray you have a very blessed day. 
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9th March 2012, 10:48 AM
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Reps: 741,125,502,163,455,360 (power: 741,125,502,163,463) | | Originally Posted by importunity Look, if you are taking offense it wasn't meant in that manor so it seems to me that we are at an impasse. So have fun, and I pray you have a very blessed day.
Fair enough. Thanks.
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9th March 2012, 10:49 AM
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Reps: 1,676,320,374,754,305 (power: 1,676,320,374,761) | | Originally Posted by importunity The Bible says he became sin.
How did He "become sin", what would be the basis for that? |
9th March 2012, 11:21 AM
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Reps: 1,676,320,374,754,305 (power: 1,676,320,374,761) | | Originally Posted by importunity Look man, if you want to reject what the bible says because you can't reason it out that's cool. Taking the literal translation says HE BECAME SIN. How? God put it on Him (it pleased Him to bruise Him).
What would stop YHWH from making sin on anyone else then? I mean, you have YHWH doing an unrighteous act of taking a righteous man a making him unrighteous, what would stop Him from doing that to anyone else who has believed on His Son?
Bruising Him, doesn't mean to make Him sin, it means that He took a beating on our behalf and was physically bruised. Hence, by His strips we were healed. YHWH was pleased to offer His Only Begotten Son on our behalf, in order to gain a harvest of millions of children as a result. To read bruised as made Him sin, is quite a twist on scripture.
Do we understand it all? No one does. God said it and His thoughts and ways are more superior than ours.
This is an absolute cop out in order to say that your view can't answer the questions put to it. The fact of the matter is that our sin was imputed to Yeshua, that is, our sin is reckoned to His account, which is one of righteousness and obedience. This fits the teaching of the scriptures, and the types of the OT sacrifices. The bulls, goats and sheep that were sacrifices didn't "become sin", they were the means to atone for those under the Levitical system. Their life and blood was what was required, not that the became sin themselves. This is a matter of reckoning, not a matter of changing the nature of living creatures in something other than what they are. Yeshua's nature never changed, He didn't "become sin", He was the means to reckon righteousness His people that would believe on Him.  |
9th March 2012, 04:19 PM
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Last edited by RhemaWarrior; 10th March 2012 at 08:58 PM.
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10th March 2012, 02:44 AM
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Reps: 741,125,502,163,455,360 (power: 741,125,502,163,463) | | Originally Posted by RhemaWarrior Being sinless prior to the bruising, Jesus was the only one that was at least equal or greater in value.
Are you saying He wasn't sinless afterward?
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10th March 2012, 11:46 AM
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Last edited by RhemaWarrior; 10th March 2012 at 08:58 PM.
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10th March 2012, 11:55 AM
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Reps: 741,125,502,163,455,360 (power: 741,125,502,163,463) | | Originally Posted by RhemaWarrior It would no longer make Him sinless.
Yep, that sounds like JDS. Pretty scary.
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10th March 2012, 12:18 PM
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Reps: 334,194,313,208,274,944 (power: 334,194,313,208,286) | | Originally Posted by RhemaWarrior It would no longer make Him sinless.
So who died or paid the price for Jesus' 'sins'?
The truth is that Jesus took upon His body the sins of the world, and He voluntarily let His physical body die to pay the price for our sins.
Jesus descended into Hell, but the demons could not touch Him because of His innocence; and because He was innocent death had no hold over Him and God lifted Him out and raised His body from death.
peace,
Simon | | |
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