Why would an atheist come to Christ, if not to avoid hell?

Ah ok, got it. It is interesting to note in Genesis 1: "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;". It seems to imply that in the beginning God did in fact express Himself to Himself through Himself, but the word "us" must have meant He had company. It's difficult to get one's mind around. The bible certainly does promote thought.

That's an interesting way to think! Do you believe it is true? Or do you think the absence of creativity is nothing?

Good for you. I hope you question God one of these days.

It means that Mary was a virgin who found herself with child. God raised His hand and took the credit. How she became fertilized is beyond me but since I believe God created life I don't believe it is too hard for Him to fertilize her.

So, are you saying that you once believed the ideas that your church had fed you, but you had never actually been grateful to God for anything?

Well in honesty I can say that the bible does teach this. Romans 9 discusses it.

Not sure what that means.

I don't see it that way. Perhaps my heart is hardened.

I am trying to engage you to think of what Christ is. That is important to establish before you can expect to comprehend the answer to your question.

Having been on this forum as long as I have, I'm not entirely sure that's true.

No I don't believe it's true. Believing would require understanding, and I don't understand it. What I'm saying is that one cannot claim their deity to be infinite and limitless, and then limit that deity with finite characteristics.

I questioned God many years ago.

I know that part too. What I'm asking is "what does it mean to be the human embodiment of God's spiritual word?"

I did once. Not anymore. There came a point where I realized that I would thank God for good things that happened, but would not blame God for bad things. When my friend killed himself, I didn't blame God, I blamed my friend, and the people who pushed him to do it (including myself). When I was excommunicated and abandoned, I didn't blame God, I blamed my family, and my congregation. When my wife was diagnosed with cancer I didn't blame God, I blamed the randomness of life. When I realized that bad things just happen to good people because that stuff happens, and couldn't blame God, I realized that I could no longer give God credit for the good things either. Somewhere in that eight year period, I stopped.

Well, since the thread is about atheists, let's assume that what the writers of the Bible believed doesn't hold much weight.

How is the sanctity of marriage of more benefit than the sanctity of monogamy?

Just an idea. An ideal.

"If Hell is not eternal and not a place of punishment eternally, then Jesus dying on the cross was in vain. There was no reason for Him to take away the sins of the world.

Why then would an atheist come to Christ if there was no punishment, no penalty for breaking God's law?"

This is a question among many, put forth by a Christian elsewhere on the board.

Discuss...

Why would an atheist come to Christ, if not to avoid hell?

Which one is saying that you will be rewarded with heaven if you believe?

Jesus would be who said that, I guess, but he isn't creating or has any control over the situation of reward and punishment, he is just letting the people know the consequence of their behavior in that particular situation. If you want to understand that as coercion then you have to understand all education or informing people of consequence as coercion, and in that case the word no longer has any negative connotation.

Hell is not an eternal place of punishment according to God's word friend. We can only have immortality through Jesus. People don't willingly choose hell. People choose sin! On Judgement Day, God is going to judge people. He is going to do one of two things, grant eternal life or destroy them in the lake of fire. The wages of sin is death, not eternal concious torture. The bottom line is that this sadistic doctrine of perpetual conscious suffering is absolutely inconsistent with the just, loving, moral character of our Almighty Creator as revealed in the bible. Condemned people who sinfully reject God’s love in Christ are cast into hell. They chose sin, and the lake of fire, is where they will reap the unfortunate wages of their choice – death. Yes, there will be a period of suffering as divine justice properly dictates for each individual – perhaps a split second, perhaps longer – but any such suffering will mercifully end in the ultimate just punishment, namely everlasting total extermination with no hope of resurrection.

In regards to utter extinction in hell not being severe enough, how much severer should it justly be? How much severer does it need to be?
Just imagine how it will be on judgment day for those people who foolishly reject God: They’ll have to stand before the Almighty, who will judge their entire lives, and condemn them to death in the lake of fire – an annihilation so utterly complete that it will be as if they had never existed (see Obadiah 16). Then they’ll be removed from His presence and cast into a vast, consuming lake of fire. Can you imagine the depression, shame, guilt and torment of being rejected by the very Creator of the universe who has judged your life so completely worthless that you must be absolutely snuffed out of existence and memory? Can you imagine being led to a vast, dreadful lake of fire, standing at its edge, knowing that this is it – your life’s going to be blotted out and there’s absolutely no hope of resurrection, restoration or recovery? And then, finally, the torment and pain experienced when cast into the fire – suffering that will last precisely as long as God’s justice requires.

To gain eternal life?

So, infinite, limitless, all-seeing, all-knowing, all-powerful God, who created all that is, did not create nor does he have control over reward or punishment? That's a little confusing...

If you are working with an anthropomorphic understanding of God, then yes it can be confusing on why he doesn't live up to the expectations of your imagination. Start to understand God rationally, and not based on what you've seen on television or from taking mythological representations literal, then it isn't confusing because it isn't a guy in the sky pulling levers but a spiritual constant whose activity produces the universe we experience.