Dying women don't need contraception...

Michie · #1 6th October 2011, 03:06 PM

Now let's return to the statistics about what happens when women actually give birth. How many American women suffer injuries, bleeding, infections and death in childbirth? These numbers are harder to come by, but this comparative chart gives you the general idea: the maternal death rate in the US is about 8 per 100,000 women.

Continued- Dying women don't need contraception...

MikeK · #2 6th October 2011, 03:21 PM

Aww, it's cute how the author suggests providing medical services for the people of Africa instead of a once every 3 months injection of a mass produced medication...because I'm sure that there are tons of people, the author included, lining up to pay for, build and staff hospitals in Africa that would create the dafer births she calls for. It is also my assumption that she has a rock solid plan for feeding and educating these would-be children, who's siblings and neighbors and townsfolk are dying of starvation or HIV.

I have zero patience for people who think pointing out problems without offering solutions.

Cosmic Charlie · #3 6th October 2011, 03:58 PM

Unforunately we can't possible start paying for women in Africa to have health care.

The would be socalized medicine.

What we need is to do is have African women buy a health care plan from a for profit health care insurance company.

This will have to be some kind of birth care only plan since most African women can't
afford total health coverage.

But

That's ok because I'm sure that the for profit health care industry will be knocking down African women's doors with competing plans and that will force down the cost of the plan giving African several very affordable options.

And

If the African women deicde that don't want the health care coverage, well, than they're on their own because THEY chose not to be covered and they need to take personal responsiblity for they're actions.

This is the American way.

Which is, of course, the best way, to ensure that health care is available, affordable and delivered at the lowest cost possible.

The free market will assure this works.

Gwendolyn · #4 6th October 2011, 04:10 PM

Originally Posted by Cosmic Charlie

This is the American way.

That it is.

MikeK · #5 6th October 2011, 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by Cosmic Charlie

The free market will assure this works.

I don't get why they don't just trade their bootstraps for better health care, they aren't using them anyway.

AMDG · #6 6th October 2011, 04:57 PM

Originally Posted by MikeK

I don't get why they don't just trade their bootstraps for better health care,

Maybe they don't consider contraceptives better health care? Afterall it only hurts them. More hands (children) make less work. Having many children means that mom doesn't have to work as hard. And they probably see that if they have kids, they will have someone to take care of them in their old age, and if they make certain that they don't, it will leave them "high and dry" in their old age when they need.... You know for some African women, having children is like an old age insurance policy. Of course, that is *supposed* to be, extended families with the older members being included in the family and not shunted aside--it's just not the present day Western way-of-life.

MikeK · #7 6th October 2011, 05:22 PM

Originally Posted by AMDG

Maybe they don't consider contraceptives better health care? Afterall it only hurts them. More hands (children) make less work. Having many children means that mom doesn't have to work as hard. And they probably see that if they have kids, they will have someone to take care of them in their old age, and if they make certain that they don't, it will leave them "high and dry" in their old age when they need.... You know for some African women, having children is like an old age insurance policy. Of course, that is *supposed* to be, extended families with the older members being included in the family and not shunted aside--it's just not the present day Western way-of-life.

You should have read the article.

Cosmic Charlie · #8 6th October 2011, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by AMDG

Maybe they don't consider contraceptives better health care? Afterall it only hurts them. More hands (children) make less work. Having many children means that mom doesn't have to work as hard. And they probably see that if they have kids, they will have someone to take care of them in their old age, and if they make certain that they don't, it will leave them "high and dry" in their old age when they need.... You know for some African women, having children is like an old age insurance policy. Of course, that is *supposed* to be, extended families with the older members being included in the family and not shunted aside--it's just not the present day Western way-of-life.

I don't know what facts you're working with to develop this view of the African utopia but here are some that bother me:

Facts on Poverty in Africa
315 million people – one in two of people in Sub Saharan Africa survive on less than one dollar per day

184 million people – 33% of the African population – suffer from malnutrition

During the 1990s the average income per capita decreased in 20 African countries

Less than 50% of Africa’s population has access to hospitals or doctors

In 2000, 300 million Africans did not have access to safe water

The average life expectancy in Africa is 41 years

Only 57% of African children are enrolled in primary education, and only one of three children complete school

One in six children die before the age of 5. This number is 25 times higher in sub-Saharan Africa than in the OECD countries

Children account for half of all civilian casualties in wars in Africa

The African continent lost more than 5,3 million hectares of forest during the decade of the 1990s

Less than one person out of five has electricity. Out of 1.000 inhabitants 15 have a telephone line, and 7,8 out of 1.000 people surf on Internet.

200,000 child slaves are sold every year in Africa. There are an estimated 8,000 girl-slaves in West Africa alone. (sources: BBC 5 October, 2001 & Anti-Slavery Society)<LI class=MsoNormal>About 120,000 African children are participating in armed conflicts. Some are as young as 7 years old. (source: Africa Children’s Charter)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Children account for half of all civilian casualties in wars in Africa. (source: Africa 2015)
<LI class=MsoNormal>One in six African children dies before the age of five. Most of these deaths could be prevented. (source: Africa 2015)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Nearly one third of children in Sub-Saharan Africa are underweight. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>In sub-Saharan Africa, measles takes the life of a child nearly every minute of every day. An effective measles vaccine costs as little as $1 per child. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Between 12 and 14 million African children have been orphaned by HIV/AIDS. (source: World Bank/UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Nearly 2 million children under 14 years old are HIV positive. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>43% of children in Sub-Saharan Africa do not have safe, accessible drinking water. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>64% of children in Sub-Saharan Africa do not have adequate sanitation. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Only 57% of African children are enrolled in primary education, and one in three of those does not complete school. (source: Africa 2015)

For every 100 boys there are only 83 girls enrolled at primary school. (source: World Bank/UNICEF)

Now, I'm not agaisnt having children but:

An African women has to raise a family on less then a dollar a day, has no access to clean water, and out of 6 kids, 1 will die before five, 1 will be put into slavery, one will be pressed into the miltary and 3 won't get an education.

On top of all that she's going to die at 40 anyway so she's not going to have an old age wear she needs care.

Most people living in Africa are up to there hips in blood and excrement and you're thinking is that more kids is going to make life easier.

I really don't know what to say.

MikeK · #9 6th October 2011, 05:32 PM

Eh, that's nothing an increased birthdate won't fix.

Originally Posted by Cosmic Charlie

I don't know what facts you're working with to develop this view of the African utopia but here are some that bother me:

Facts on Poverty in Africa
315 million people – one in two of people in Sub Saharan Africa survive on less than one dollar per day

184 million people – 33% of the African population – suffer from malnutrition

During the 1990s the average income per capita decreased in 20 African countries

Less than 50% of Africa’s population has access to hospitals or doctors

In 2000, 300 million Africans did not have access to safe water

The average life expectancy in Africa is 41 years

Only 57% of African children are enrolled in primary education, and only one of three children complete school

One in six children die before the age of 5. This number is 25 times higher in sub-Saharan Africa than in the OECD countries

Children account for half of all civilian casualties in wars in Africa

The African continent lost more than 5,3 million hectares of forest during the decade of the 1990s

Less than one person out of five has electricity. Out of 1.000 inhabitants 15 have a telephone line, and 7,8 out of 1.000 people surf on Internet.

200,000 child slaves are sold every year in Africa. There are an estimated 8,000 girl-slaves in West Africa alone. (sources: BBC 5 October, 2001 & Anti-Slavery Society)<LI class=MsoNormal>About 120,000 African children are participating in armed conflicts. Some are as young as 7 years old. (source: Africa Children’s Charter)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Children account for half of all civilian casualties in wars in Africa. (source: Africa 2015)
<LI class=MsoNormal>One in six African children dies before the age of five. Most of these deaths could be prevented. (source: Africa 2015)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Nearly one third of children in Sub-Saharan Africa are underweight. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>In sub-Saharan Africa, measles takes the life of a child nearly every minute of every day. An effective measles vaccine costs as little as $1 per child. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Between 12 and 14 million African children have been orphaned by HIV/AIDS. (source: World Bank/UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Nearly 2 million children under 14 years old are HIV positive. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>43% of children in Sub-Saharan Africa do not have safe, accessible drinking water. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>64% of children in Sub-Saharan Africa do not have adequate sanitation. (source: UNICEF)
<LI class=MsoNormal>Only 57% of African children are enrolled in primary education, and one in three of those does not complete school. (source: Africa 2015)

For every 100 boys there are only 83 girls enrolled at primary school. (source: World Bank/UNICEF)

Now, I'm not agaisnt having children but:

An African women has to raise a family on less then a dollar a day, has no access to clean water, and out of 6 kids, 1 will die before five, 1 will be put into slavery, one will be pressed into the miltary and 3 won't get an education.

On top of all that she's going to die at 40 anyway so she's not going to have an old age wear she needs care.

Most people living in Africa are up to there hips in blood and excrement and you're thinking is that more kids is going to make life easier.

I really don't know what to say.

AMDG · #10 6th October 2011, 07:13 PM

Yes, it's awful about what is in store for the poor women in Africa. Yet, there is still something very wrong and very arrogant with those that push the pro-contraceptive mentality and not realize that culture is the reason that the women choose to have the family members (the children) that they do (and that's the attitude we should all have--that of taking care of each other.) Think, if most of the children the woman has won't be around, it behooves her to have many so that there is at least half a chance that when she grows old (maybe age 40 you say) there will be *someone* to take her in and care for her. The women are "hedging their bets". What on earth do you propose, make certain she will be alone in her later years? Honestly, that's all that contraceptives will do for her. Take love and support away and leave her with nothing.

Why do you think that U.N.'s throwing contraceptives at the poor in Africa or India isn't working? It's because it's not in the woman's best interest--that's why. The women are poor--they are dying in poverty--but contraceptives are not what they need especially since it only increases the women's chances of contracting AIDS.