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23rd September 2010, 08:23 PM
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Do you think God wrote the Incarnation? |
24th September 2010, 03:06 PM
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25th September 2010, 11:30 PM
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Reps: 305,387,769,917,928,320 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Joshua G.  I know I am not an iconographer... but what does that question mean?
Well, you Orthodox believe icon writers write icons, right? And icons are made because the Icon of God became incarnate, right? So, would God have written the Incarnation? |
26th September 2010, 06:40 AM
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Reps: 39,917,204,960,078,960 (power: 39,917,204,960,087) | | | There are some people who will insist that icons are "written" rather than "painted" but it is not an Orthodox belief. There are those who have developed a pious custom out of a mistranslation. In Greek, the word used for "paint" is the same as for "write" and so to distinguish between ordinary painting and icon-painting, some people insist on using the wrong word just to make the distinction clear. As an iconographer, I tell people that I paint icons. I use paints as a medium, I use paint brushes, and I move those brushes in a similar way to other painters. I see no value in calling this process "writing." With that said, your question can't really be taken seriously.
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26th September 2010, 11:59 AM
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Reps: 212,529,459,622,953,760 (power: 212,529,459,622,961) | | "Writing" icons is an Americanism. This article explains why Icons are not "written"
Otherwise as Nutroll says, your question makes no sense whatsoever. The Word didn't become incarnate as a piece of wood with paint on it. You cannot compare the incarnation to the manner in which an icon is painted. |
26th September 2010, 12:43 PM
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Reps: 455,907,154,049,556,096 (power: 0) | | | Okay fine... then change the op's question to: Did God paint the incarnation? It's good that he was corrected (I never knew this... I was always told they were written and the explanation made... well, a lot of sense to me. But fine... paint, color... whatever) but now let's try to answer his question rather than dismissing it simply because he (understandably) used the less preferred term.
I'm not an iconographer, but this is what I would say. It's important to distinguish between what an iconographer does and what God does. The iconographer represents something that has already happened or is happening through painting. They don't make it happen. They give us a mystical window into that event or that person.
On the other hand, God creates those events and people. God doesn't represent them through other media. |
26th September 2010, 05:02 PM
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Reps: 1,008,025,187,147,289,600 (power: 1,008,025,187,147,333) | | Originally Posted by nutroll There are some people who will insist that icons are "written" rather than "painted" but it is not an Orthodox belief. There are those who have developed a pious custom out of a mistranslation. In Greek, the word used for "paint" is the same as for "write" and so to distinguish between ordinary painting and icon-painting, some people insist on using the wrong word just to make the distinction clear. As an iconographer, I tell people that I paint icons. I use paints as a medium, I use paint brushes, and I move those brushes in a similar way to other painters. I see no value in calling this process "writing." With that said, your question can't really be taken seriously.
Matt and I do not always agree on many things, but I am with him on this matter.
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26th September 2010, 05:05 PM
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Reps: 1,008,025,187,147,289,600 (power: 1,008,025,187,147,333) | | Originally Posted by Joshua G. I'm not an iconographer, but this is what I would say. It's important to distinguish between what an iconographer does and what God does. The iconographer represents something that has already happened or is happening through painting. They don't make it happen. They give us a mystical window into that event or that person.
On the other hand, God creates those events and people. God doesn't represent them through other media.
What an iconographer does, the iconographer does through God. The iconographer may be the painter who paints the icon, but it is always God who moves the iconographer to do his/her work. You really can not draw a line between what the iconographer does and what God does because there is a symbiosis there. What each does is equally important to the process of creating an icon and they are not inseparable from each other. Do not attempt to draw false distinctions that really do not exist.
__________________ Bless the Lord, all of you works of the Lord! Praise and exult him above all forever! A change that even with regret can not be undone...
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26th September 2010, 08:22 PM
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26th September 2010, 08:37 PM
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Reps: 455,907,154,049,556,096 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Michael the Iconographer What an iconographer does, the iconographer does through God. The iconographer may be the painter who paints the icon, but it is always God who moves the iconographer to do his/her work. You really can not draw a line between what the iconographer does and what God does because there is a symbiosis there. What each does is equally important to the process of creating an icon and they are not inseparable from each other. Do not attempt to draw false distinctions that really do not exist.
THat's an important point Michael. BUt surely you and I agree that there is a difference between the actual creation and the icon of the creation. The icon (because of God's work through the icon painter) is mystically connected to that event, but it is not the event itself. Right? I mean, we agree on that, I would imagine.
I apologize if I wasn't clear enough in my last post. | | |
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