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27th June 2010, 12:49 PM
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Reps: 254,726,225,729,237,664 (power: 254,726,225,729,254) | | Originally Posted by ddavdson  Sure, I reckon it is pretty arrogant to make such a claim as "There is definitely no ..." and that of the people who make such statements, few are worth listening to. They haven't any way to know. So I probably agree more with the "agnostic/weak atheist" That said, I am firmly anti-religion with few exceptions. This falls into the problem of treating unexaminable positions equally when they do not deserve it, especially if the positive positions were likely made up precisely because they were unexaminable. Definitely actually means there is a definitive reason why x is wrong. It should be phrased this way: There is an overwhelming probability that unevidenceable position x is wrong.
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28th June 2010, 01:41 PM
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Reps: 114,097,245,952,821,408 (power: 114,097,245,952,829) | | | Just shows that atheists can't sing though, as they had to synthesise the tone changes in the scientists voices by the sound of things. What I want is an atheist who can sing (not some punk/metal/goth drama queen). Can anyone name a single, unequivocally atheist singer? |
28th June 2010, 01:48 PM
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Reps: 579,882,325,460,913,792 (power: 579,882,325,460,945) | | Originally Posted by GrowingSmaller Just shows that atheists can't sing though, as they had to synthesise the tone changes in the scientists voices by the sound of things. What I want is an atheist who can sing (not some punk/metal/goth drama queen). Can anyone name a single, unequivocally atheist singer?
No, but that's because... eudaimonia,
Mark
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28th June 2010, 01:50 PM
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Reps: 114,097,245,952,821,408 (power: 114,097,245,952,829) | | Originally Posted by variant
There is an overwhelming probability that unevidenceable position x is wrong.
Surely theism is evidencable. For example answered prayer could evidence it. I also think that inspiraiton could evidence it (cf prophethood/revelation). Also philosophy could evidence it, eg argument from design.
I think at best you can argue unevidenc ed rathrer than against the possibility ("unevidenc able") entirely. |
28th June 2010, 02:36 PM
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Reps: 254,726,225,729,237,664 (power: 254,726,225,729,254) | | Originally Posted by GrowingSmaller Surely theism is evidencable. For example answered prayer could evidence it. I also think that inspiraiton could evidence it (cf prophethood/revelation). Also philosophy could evidence it, eg argument from design. Unanswered prayer is not taken as evidence against theism. Religions never make public falce revelations and prophecy. Your argument from phiosophy dosen't evidence it theorises, and it theorises in such a way that no evidence could ever be taken as evidence AGAINST desighn because desighn can look like anything. I think at best you can argue unevidenced rathrer than against the possibility ("unevidencable") entirely. If a theory fails to make a single distinction between the world it predicts and the world where the theory fails then it is an unevidencable theory. Theism is an unevidencable theory.
A world with God in it looks exactly the same as a world without one.
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28th June 2010, 06:43 PM
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Reps: 851,845,658,044,315 (power: 851,845,658,051) | | Originally Posted by GrowingSmaller Just shows that atheists can't sing though, as they had to synthesise the tone changes in the scientists voices by the sound of things. What I want is an atheist who can sing (not some punk/metal/goth drama queen). Can anyone name a single, unequivocally atheist singer?
Matthew Bellamy, lead singer of Muse, is likely an atheist. I say "likely" because rockstars never seem to get their stories straight, but his comments would suggest agnostic atheism.
-Lyn
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28th June 2010, 07:50 PM
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Reps: 671,138,758,507,202,560 (power: 671,138,758,507,214) | | Originally Posted by GrowingSmaller Just shows that atheists can't sing though, as they had to synthesise the tone changes in the scientists voices by the sound of things. What I want is an atheist who can sing (not some punk/metal/goth drama queen). Can anyone name a single, unequivocally atheist singer? List of nontheists (music) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
There's a few in there 
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28th June 2010, 09:39 PM
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Reps: 851,845,658,044,315 (power: 851,845,658,051) | | Originally Posted by SithDoughnut
Wikipedia is officially taking over the world.
Someone has that specific of a question and wikipedia has an article listing answers.
-Lyn
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29th June 2010, 08:50 AM
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Next question, I feel that atheists are at a disadvantage because they have no institutionalised philosophy or ethics outside of the atheism bit. Wheras Christian youth can turn to the church or a priest, who might have experience in the field, an atheist may have to learn to philosophise for himself especially if his parents are not atheists. Whilst this can enable independent thinking in the long term, not everyone is going to be a skillful philosopher as a developing adult (which was true in my case). Do you feel that for example humanism, which is atheism +, is a good solution to this problem? |
29th June 2010, 09:18 AM
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Reps: 671,138,758,507,202,560 (power: 671,138,758,507,214) | | Originally Posted by GrowingSmaller Thanks for that list.
Next question, I feel that atheists are at a disadvantage because they have no institutionalised philosophy or ethics outside of the atheism bit. Wheras Christian youth can turn to the church or a priest, who might have experience in the field, an atheist may have to learn to philosophise for himself especially if his parents are not atheists. Whilst this can enable independent thinking in the long term, not everyone is going to be a skillful philosopher as a developing adult (which was true in my case). Do you feel that for example humanism, which is atheism +, is a good solution to this problem?
The thing is that Christianity has more to it, and therefore has more problems. If you turn to a priest or the church, you are either having an issue that is in some way related to Christianity or you are looking for Christian input. There are plenty of philosophies out there, and plenty of people who hold them. If I wanted, I could go and talk to one of them - there's no requirement for an institution.
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