Home | Be a Christian | Devotionals | Join Us! | Forums | Rules | F.A.Q.


Go Back   Christian Forums > Theology (orthodox Christians only) > Theology (orthodox Christians only) > General Theology
Register BlogsPrayersJobsArcade Calendar Mark Forums Read

General Theology The forum for general theological discussions about issues that do not fit in any other forum, eg. Angelology

Reply
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Unread 18th March 2010, 03:15 PM
Senior Veteran

29 Gender: Female Faith: Catholic Party: US-Constitution Country: United States Member For 5 Years Brickmaker
 
Join Date: 10th October 2009
Posts: 3,852
Blessings: 11,769,081
Reps: 364,739,928,055,567,872 (power: 0)
PilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond repute
PilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond reputePilgrimToChrist has a reputation beyond repute
Such is the claim of Baptist preacher Dr. James Milton Carroll, the author of the "Trail of Blood" pamphlet. He says that the Baptist church was not just a creation of the 17th century, but was present before then:

Originally Posted by Dr. James Milton Carroll, "Trail of Blood"
During the period that we are now passing through the persecuted were called by many and varied names. Among them were Donatists, Paterines, Cathari, Paulicians, and Ana Baptists; and a little later, Petro-Brussians, Arnoldists, Henricians, Albigenses, and Waldenses. Sometimes one group of these was the most prominent and sometimes another. But some of them were almost always prominent because of the persistency and terribleness of their persecution.
Donatists -- Otherwise Catholic rigorists who believed that the Sacraments could not be effected by priests who had apostatized during the persecutions, that is that the Sacraments are dependent on the personal sanctity of the priest.

Paterines -- Catholic reformers in Milan who sought to cleanse the Church of simony and enforce clerical celibacy. St. Arialdo da Carimate was a leader of the movement and was tortured and murdered by fellow clerics.

Cathari -- A Gnostic sect. They had two levels of adherents -- the Believers and the Perfects. The Perfects were held to high standards of fasting, such that many Cathar Believers did not go through the ceremony until their death bed. Like the Marcionites and other Gnostics, they believed the world was not created by God but by the demiurge ("rex mundi"), who they associated with satan. They rejected water baptism.

Paulicans -- Followers of Paul of Samosata. They were Gnostics who also believed that the world was created by the demiurge and thus rejected the Old Testament. They condemned veneration of the Cross and were Adoptionists (they believed Jesus *became* God at some point, such as at His Baptism). The Bogomils were another Gnostic group that formed out of the Paulicans.

Anabaptists -- Part of the Radical Reformation, today in the form of Mennonites, Amish, and Brethren. They were called "ana-baptists" ("ana" = "again") because they re-baptized people into their sects, contrary to Scripture and the Creed (the same reason why Baptists are called such). Some anabaptist groups adopted non-Trinitarian theologies and other heresies, such as the Christadelphians, Michael Servetus, and the Socinians (followers of Faustus Socinus).

Petro-Brussians -- Followers of Peter of Bruys, who denied the authority of all books of the Bible except the Gospels. He rejected the Incarnation, accepting Docetism (the Gnostic heresy that Christ's Incarnation was an illusion). Because he denied the Incarnation, he was also violently opposed to crosses and crucifixes, so he made a bonfire of them outside of a Church on Good Friday. The locals were not pleased with his blasphemies and threw him on the flames as well.

Arnoldists -- Followers of Arnold of Brescia, an Augustinian prior. He taught radical poverty similar to the so-called "Spiritual Franciscans" (distinct from orthodox Franciscans) or Waldensians. That is, he taught that if priests, bishops or monks held any property, they could not be saved. He also echoed the Donatists who relied on the personal sanctity of the individual to give the office authority and to effect the Sacraments.

Henricians -- Followers of Henry of Lausanne, heavily influenced by Peter of Bruys, the Gnostic, except without the contempt of the Cross (he carried a staff with a iron cross on it). He rejected all doctrinal and disciplinary authority of the Church, rejected the communion of saints, and rejected any form of liturgy and worship, and embraced free interpretation of the Gospels.

Albigenses -- Another name for a later revival of "Catharism", a form of Gnosticism, named after a debate between Catholic priests and Cathars held in Albi (Albiga), France.

Waldenses -- Followers of Peter Waldo. Their practices follow that of the Cathars in their division into Believers and Perfects. However, theologically they were more orthodox. The primary issue was the pastoral failure of the Catholic Church, so the Waldensians organized themselves and created their own interpretations of the Scriptures (but nothing terribly theologically radical). In many ways they are similar to Protestants. It was for that reason that during the Reformation, they adopted Calvinism/Zwinglianism. Most blended with the Reformed churches but by name they still exist in the form of the small Waldensian Evangelical Church in Italy. Unlike the Baptists, the Wandensians have always practiced infant baptism.

---

So what do we notice? For one, there is no obvious historical link between most of these different groups and some teach very different things. If these are supposed to represent pre-17th century Baptists, wouldn't you at least expect none of the groups to have practiced infant baptism (the rejection of which is the cause of the very name of the Baptist sect)? Secondly, several of the groups are outright Gnostics.

A 1991 survey by the Southern Baptist Convention found that 14% (1 in 7) of their pastors and 18% of their deacons (nearly 1 in 5) were Masons. It is estimated that 37% of Freemasons are Southern Baptists. Such prominent Baptist leaders and theologians such as B.H. Carroll (founder of Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary; brother of the author of this pamphlet) and Robert E.B. Baylor (founder of Baylor University) were Freemasons. Freemasonry is Gnosticism, Scottish Rite Freemasonry even openly refers to Gnosticism several times in its rites.

So the Landmarkist Baptists, following Dr. Carroll, claim that the Baptist religion is founded on various Gnostic sects. The brother of the author was a Freemason, which is a Gnostic religion. (I do not know if there is evidence that the author was a Mason but I'm sure there was some influence here.) Today, many Baptists are also Freemasons, and thus Gnostics.

So the question must really be: How much of a connection is there between Baptists and Gnostics?

Last edited by PilgrimToChrist; 18th March 2010 at 03:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!

  #2  
Unread 18th March 2010, 03:38 PM
Tyndale's Avatar
Veteran

40 Gender: Male Faith: Protestant Party: UK-Conservative Country: United Kingdom Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 3rd February 2007
Location: United kingdom
Posts: 1,945
Blessings: 1,098,707
My Mood Happy
Reps: 226,463,294,458,032,512 (power: 226,463,294,458,041)
Tyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond repute
Tyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond reputeTyndale has a reputation beyond repute
Are Baptists Gnostics?

Aren't we all Gnostic to some degree? Do we not seek to "know" the secrets of the mystery?

__________________
William Tyndale cried out, "Lord, open the King of Englands eyes"
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Unread 18th March 2010, 03:53 PM
Tangible's Avatar
ن

49 Gender: Male Married Faith: Lutheran Country: United States Member For 5 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 29th May 2009
Location: The intersection of Law and Gospel
Posts: 8,418
Blessings: 7,649
My Mood Bahahaha
Blog Entries: 8
Reps: 2,065,579,732,512,599,296 (power: 2,065,579,732,512,613)
Tangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond repute
Tangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond repute
"The sanctification of conduct by the strengthening of the will; the sanctification of the emotions by a strenuous training of the soul; the sanctification of thought by a deepening of the understanding; moralism, mysticism, speculation, these are the three ladders on which men continually seek to climb up to God, with a persistent purpose that it seems nothing can check; a storming of Heaven that is just as pathetic in its unceasing efforts as in its final futility."

- Adolf Koberle, The Quest for Holiness
__________________
Confessional Lutheran Christianity: Christ-centered, Cross-focused.
Biblical, historic, traditional, creedal, confessional, liturgical, monergistic, sacramental, evangelical, catholic, orthodox Christianity.
(All scripture quotes from the ESV unless otherwise indicated.)
Daily return to the waters of Holy Baptism that the old man might be drowned and die. Daily, for he is a good swimmer.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Reply With Quote
  #4  
Unread 18th March 2010, 04:19 PM
Rhamiel's Avatar
Member of the Round Table

29 Gender: Male Faith: Catholic Country: Vatican City State Member For 5 Years Tentmaker
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 11th November 2006
Location: ohio
Posts: 30,662
Blessings: 97,402,174
My Mood Praying
Blog Entries: 2
Reps: 4,557,354,351,743,351,296 (power: 4,557,354,351,743,389)
Rhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond repute
Rhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by PilgrimToChrist View Post
Such is the claim of Baptist preacher Dr. James Milton Carroll, the author of the "Trail of Blood" pamphlet. He says that the Baptist church was not just a creation of the 17th century, but was present before then:



Donatists -- Otherwise Catholic rigorists who believed that the Sacraments could not be effected by priests who had apostatized during the persecutions, that is that the Sacraments are dependent on the personal sanctity of the priest.

Paterines -- Catholic reformers in Milan who sought to cleanse the Church of simony and enforce clerical celibacy. St. Arialdo da Carimate was a leader of the movement and was tortured and murdered by fellow clerics.

Cathari -- A Gnostic sect. They had two levels of adherents -- the Believers and the Perfects. The Perfects were held to high standards of fasting, such that many Cathar Believers did not go through the ceremony until their death bed. Like the Marcionites and other Gnostics, they believed the world was not created by God but by the demiurge ("rex mundi"), who they associated with satan. They rejected water baptism.

Paulicans -- Followers of Paul of Samosata. They were Gnostics who also believed that the world was created by the demiurge and thus rejected the Old Testament. They condemned veneration of the Cross and were Adoptionists (they believed Jesus *became* God at some point, such as at His Baptism). The Bogomils were another Gnostic group that formed out of the Paulicans.

Anabaptists -- Part of the Radical Reformation, today in the form of Mennonites, Amish, and Brethren. They were called "ana-baptists" ("ana" = "again") because they re-baptized people into their sects, contrary to Scripture and the Creed (the same reason why Baptists are called such). Some anabaptist groups adopted non-Trinitarian theologies and other heresies, such as the Christadelphians, Michael Servetus, and the Socinians (followers of Faustus Socinus).

Petro-Brussians -- Followers of Peter of Bruys, who denied the authority of all books of the Bible except the Gospels. He rejected the Incarnation, accepting Docetism (the Gnostic heresy that Christ's Incarnation was an illusion). Because he denied the Incarnation, he was also violently opposed to crosses and crucifixes, so he made a bonfire of them outside of a Church on Good Friday. The locals were not pleased with his blasphemies and threw him on the flames as well.

Arnoldists -- Followers of Arnold of Brescia, an Augustinian prior. He taught radical poverty similar to the so-called "Spiritual Franciscans" (distinct from orthodox Franciscans) or Waldensians. That is, he taught that if priests, bishops or monks held any property, they could not be saved. He also echoed the Donatists who relied on the personal sanctity of the individual to give the office authority and to effect the Sacraments.

Henricians -- Followers of Henry of Lausanne, heavily influenced by Peter of Bruys, the Gnostic, except without the contempt of the Cross (he carried a staff with a iron cross on it). He rejected all doctrinal and disciplinary authority of the Church, rejected the communion of saints, and rejected any form of liturgy and worship, and embraced free interpretation of the Gospels.

Albigenses -- Another name for a later revival of "Catharism", a form of Gnosticism, named after a debate between Catholic priests and Cathars held in Albi (Albiga), France.

Waldenses -- Followers of Peter Waldo. Their practices follow that of the Cathars in their division into Believers and Perfects. However, theologically they were more orthodox. The primary issue was the pastoral failure of the Catholic Church, so the Waldensians organized themselves and created their own interpretations of the Scriptures (but nothing terribly theologically radical). In many ways they are similar to Protestants. It was for that reason that during the Reformation, they adopted Calvinism/Zwinglianism. Most blended with the Reformed churches but by name they still exist in the form of the small Waldensian Evangelical Church in Italy. Unlike the Baptists, the Wandensians have always practiced infant baptism.

---

So what do we notice? For one, there is no obvious historical link between most of these different groups and some teach very different things. If these are supposed to represent pre-17th century Baptists, wouldn't you at least expect none of the groups to have practiced infant baptism (the rejection of which is the cause of the very name of the Baptist sect)? Secondly, several of the groups are outright Gnostics.

A 1991 survey by the Southern Baptist Convention found that 14% (1 in 7) of their pastors and 18% of their deacons (nearly 1 in 5) were Masons. It is estimated that 37% of Freemasons are Southern Baptists. Such prominent Baptist leaders and theologians such as B.H. Carroll (founder of Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary; brother of the author of this pamphlet) and Robert E.B. Baylor (founder of Baylor University) were Freemasons. Freemasonry is Gnosticism, Scottish Rite Freemasonry even openly refers to Gnosticism several times in its rites.

So the Landmarkist Baptists, following Dr. Carroll, claim that the Baptist religion is founded on various Gnostic sects. The brother of the author was a Freemason, which is a Gnostic religion. (I do not know if there is evidence that the author was a Mason but I'm sure there was some influence here.) Today, many Baptists are also Freemasons, and thus Gnostics.

So the question must really be: How much of a connection is there between Baptists and Gnostics?
well i do see a link between the freemasons and the Baptist Church

both seem to latch onto historical groups that they really have nothing in common with to show some kind of contunuity, both groups were products of early modern europe, both groups wanted to be seen as anciet
__________________
I can do all things through Him who gives me strength

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

St. Raphael, Pray for us
O angel of God, my holy guardian, given to me from heaven, enlighten me this day, and save me from all evil. Instruct me in doing good deeds, and set me on the path of salvation. Amen.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Unread 18th March 2010, 04:59 PM
Tangible's Avatar
ن

49 Gender: Male Married Faith: Lutheran Country: United States Member For 5 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 29th May 2009
Location: The intersection of Law and Gospel
Posts: 8,418
Blessings: 7,649
My Mood Bahahaha
Blog Entries: 8
Reps: 2,065,579,732,512,599,296 (power: 2,065,579,732,512,613)
Tangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond repute
Tangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond reputeTangible has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by Rhamiel View Post
well i do see a link between the freemasons and the Baptist Church

both seem to latch onto historical groups that they really have nothing in common with to show some kind of continuity, both groups were products of early modern europe, both groups wanted to be seen as ancient
Ancient, Free and Accepted Baptists.
__________________
Confessional Lutheran Christianity: Christ-centered, Cross-focused.
Biblical, historic, traditional, creedal, confessional, liturgical, monergistic, sacramental, evangelical, catholic, orthodox Christianity.
(All scripture quotes from the ESV unless otherwise indicated.)
Daily return to the waters of Holy Baptism that the old man might be drowned and die. Daily, for he is a good swimmer.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Reply With Quote
  #6  
Unread 18th March 2010, 05:08 PM
Contributor

39 Gender: Male Married Faith: Baptist Country: United States Member For 5 Years Fisherman
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 3rd October 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,027
Blessings: 7,394,061
My Mood Fine
Reps: 295,613,036,765,515,136 (power: 0)
DD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond repute
DD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond reputeDD2008 has a reputation beyond repute
The trail of blood isn't true. The Baptists originated in 1609. They were led by an Englishman named John Smyth.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Unread 18th March 2010, 05:58 PM
LiturgyInDMinor's Avatar
Celtic Rite Old Catholic Church

Gender: Male Married Faith: Utrecht Country: United States Member For 5 Years Steward
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 20th February 2009
Posts: 4,915
Blessings: 340,195,455
My Mood Lurking
Reps: 187,207,274,281,724,320 (power: 187,207,274,281,734)
LiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond repute
LiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond reputeLiturgyInDMinor has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by DD2008 View Post
The trail of blood isn't true. The Baptists originated in 1609. They were led by an Englishman named John Smyth.

__________________
In Christ,

Fr. John

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Unread 18th March 2010, 08:15 PM
Rhamiel's Avatar
Member of the Round Table

29 Gender: Male Faith: Catholic Country: Vatican City State Member For 5 Years Tentmaker
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 11th November 2006
Location: ohio
Posts: 30,662
Blessings: 97,402,174
My Mood Praying
Blog Entries: 2
Reps: 4,557,354,351,743,351,296 (power: 4,557,354,351,743,389)
Rhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond repute
Rhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond reputeRhamiel has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by DD2008 View Post
The trail of blood isn't true. The Baptists originated in 1609. They were led by an Englishman named John Smyth.
are you Baptist? is this a common belief among Baptists?
i thought almost all Baptistis believed in the trail of blood
__________________
I can do all things through Him who gives me strength

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

St. Raphael, Pray for us
O angel of God, my holy guardian, given to me from heaven, enlighten me this day, and save me from all evil. Instruct me in doing good deeds, and set me on the path of salvation. Amen.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Unread 18th March 2010, 08:17 PM
jckstraw72's Avatar
Doin' that whole Orthodox thing

30 Gender: Male Faith: Eastern-Orthodox Party: US-Republican Country: United States Member For 5 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 9th December 2005
Location: South Canaan, PA
Posts: 8,884
Blessings: 3,096,135
My Mood Bored
Reps: 551,142,111,139,651,200 (power: 551,142,111,139,668)
jckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond repute
jckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond reputejckstraw72 has a reputation beyond repute
i think the whole OSAS thing is pretty Gnostic -- as long as you know that Jesus died on the Cross youre good to go!
__________________
"Acquire a peaceful spirit and 1000s around you will be saved"--St. Seraphim

”For as it is not yet six thousand years since the first man, who is called Adam, are not those to be ridiculed rather than refuted who try to persuade us of anything regarding a space of time so different from, and contrary to, the ascertained truth?” St. Augustine

"I am super stupid." Jesse
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Unread 18th March 2010, 08:22 PM
ebia's Avatar
Senior Contributor

Gender: Male Married Faith: Anglican Party: AU-Greens Country: Australia Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 6th July 2004
Location: A very long way away. Sometimes even further.
Posts: 38,451
Blessings: 63,448,539
Reps: 1,085,283,283,357,449,984 (power: 1,085,283,283,357,499)
ebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond repute
ebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond reputeebia has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by jckstraw72 View Post
i think the whole OSAS thing is pretty Gnostic -- as long as you know that Jesus died on the Cross youre good to go!
That doesn't bear much resemblence (in itself) to historic gnosticsm.

There is a good deal of gnostic influence in much of modern Christianity, but one needs to look slighly deeper than that for it.
__________________
"Goodness is stronger than evil,
love is stronger than hate,
light is stronger than darkness,
life is stronger than death,
victory is ours through him who loved us."
(+Desmond Tutu)
Reply With Quote
Reply


Return to General Theology

Thread Tools
Display Modes


 
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:23 PM.