Home | Be a Christian | Devotionals | Join Us! | Forums | Rules | F.A.Q.


Go Back   Christian Forums > Edification (orthodox Christians only) > Edification (orthodox Christians only) > For New Christians
Register BlogsPrayersJobsArcade Calendar Mark Forums Read

For New Christians This forum is for new Christians to ask questions and be encouraged by other Christians. Here you can post your questions and talk about issues relating to new believers.

Reply
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Unread 19th January 2010, 07:08 AM
Junior Member

Gender: Female Faith: Agnostic Member For 4 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 11th January 2010
Posts: 82
Blessings: 219,155
Reps: 643,456,099,040,772 (power: 643,456,099,045)
teaspill has disabled reputation
Water Baptism / Baptism in the Holy Spirit

When I was at my old Bible Study, one of the women was telling me about the significance of baptism. She then stated that water baptism isn't necessary to receive the Holy Spirit, and asked if I'd like to receive the Holy Spirit right then and there. Unfortuntely, we got side-tracked by om nom nommy cake...

On this forum, I see suggestions that perhaps baptism in the Holy Spirit and water baptism are in fact different things, but things that aren't mutually exclusive. So I'm wondering if water baptism and baptism in the Holy Spirit are different. If so, how does one become baptised in the Holy Spirit without a water baptism?
Reply With Quote
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!

  #2  
Unread 19th January 2010, 07:59 AM
Newbie

21 Gender: Male Faith: Pentecostal Country: Australia Member For 4 Years
 
Join Date: 8th November 2009
Posts: 20
Blessings: 983,944
Reps: 54,677,533,667,828 (power: 54,677,533,672)
heggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond repute
heggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond reputeheggarty has a reputation beyond repute
Hey, Im an Aussie and im 17 years old as well. Its cool that your curious and trying to get sweet with god, if you ever need anyone to talk to add me on msn or PM me.

Baptism is an outward expression of an inward reality. Baptism in water declares ones faith in jesus christ publicly. Baptism in the holy spirit is most definately a different experience whereby gods holy spirit fully enters you. You usually pray a prayer initial signs that you have been baptised in the holy spirit include praying in tongues. I know that my mate hasnt been baptised in water yet still very much speaks in tongues. And im pretty sure many of the believers at the day of pentecost (acts 2) wernt baptised in the holy spirit, I might be wrong there though. Usually it is step 1: Salvation. Step 2: Baptism in water and Step 3: Baptism in the spirit. However steps 2 and 3 sometimes swap.

Sorry I dont have time to look up the scriptures. Hope that helps. Blessings joey.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Unread 19th January 2010, 08:15 AM
Junior Member

Gender: Female Faith: Agnostic Member For 4 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 11th January 2010
Posts: 82
Blessings: 219,155
Reps: 643,456,099,040,772 (power: 643,456,099,045)
teaspill has disabled reputation
Hi Heggarty. :3 I've tossed a PM your way. It's nice to meet another young Australian on here!

Thank you very much for explaining that to me. Is there a particular reason that water baptism tends to come before baptism in the Holy Spirit?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Unread 19th January 2010, 11:50 PM
Bouke285's Avatar
It's not a sin to be wrong, but be wrong humbly!

24 Gender: Male Faith: Non-Denominational Country: United States Member For 5 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 3rd July 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 292
Blessings: 229,781
My Mood Thinking
Reps: 4,411,579,193 (power: 4,411,586)
Bouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond repute
Bouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond reputeBouke285 has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by teaspill View Post
Hi Heggarty. :3 I've tossed a PM your way. It's nice to meet another young Australian on here!

Thank you very much for explaining that to me. Is there a particular reason that water baptism tends to come before baptism in the Holy Spirit?
Baptism in the Holy Spirit is more or less a fuller opening of ourselves to God not more of God entering us. Water Baptism is a great great thing "I will do whatever you want me to do God and to show you, Watch this!" is what you are telling God when you go under and emerge from the water. Everybody around you can see but that's not the most important thing it's telling God "Use me, i'm ready."

I may have sounded like I was trying to disagree with you in these replies, but I'm just giving my understanding never let anyone force you to think in certain ways including me. God has given you a great teacher and he knows much more then us all . God Bless
__________________
Faith seeking understanding.
-Faith alone in grace unto salvation!
One in Christ
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

-God is in control!
-Human responsibility and God's sovereignty are incalculably harmonized at the highest level

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Unread 22nd January 2010, 04:06 PM
seashale76's Avatar
Holy God, Holy Mighty, Holy Immortal!

38 Gender: Female Married Faith: Eastern-Orthodox Member For 5 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 29th December 2004
Posts: 8,717
Blessings: 25,985,650
My Mood Pensive
Blog Entries: 1
Reps: 1,079,179,749,896,517,760 (power: 1,079,179,749,896,535)
seashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond repute
seashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond reputeseashale76 has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by teaspill View Post
When I was at my old Bible Study, one of the women was telling me about the significance of baptism. She then stated that water baptism isn't necessary to receive the Holy Spirit, and asked if I'd like to receive the Holy Spirit right then and there. Unfortuntely, we got side-tracked by om nom nommy cake...

On this forum, I see suggestions that perhaps baptism in the Holy Spirit and water baptism are in fact different things, but things that aren't mutually exclusive. So I'm wondering if water baptism and baptism in the Holy Spirit are different. If so, how does one become baptised in the Holy Spirit without a water baptism?
When she was speaking of receiving the Holy Spirit, did she mean speaking in tongues? If so, that isn't a correct teaching (that one doesn't have the Holy Spirit unless they speak in tongues).

Baptism and Chrismation (the seal of the gift of the Holy Spirit) bring one into the Church (i.e. one who is baptized into Christ has put on Christ). One receives one immediately after the other.

About the sacraments:
OCA - The Orthodox Faith
OCA - The Orthodox Faith
Holy Baptism: An Orthodox Christian Understanding
__________________
Lord Jesus Christ, son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner!


Before Thy cross, we bow down in worship, O Master, and Thy holy Resurrection we glorify!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Unread 24th January 2010, 06:02 AM
Junior Member

Gender: Female Faith: Agnostic Member For 4 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 11th January 2010
Posts: 82
Blessings: 219,155
Reps: 643,456,099,040,772 (power: 643,456,099,045)
teaspill has disabled reputation
I was away from the computer for three days and so I couldn't get back to this thread, but thank you both for responding. :3 I went ahead and got baptised in the Holy Spirit after asking my Pastor about it and it was the most powerful feeling I've ever felt...
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Unread 26th January 2010, 09:01 AM
heron's Avatar
Legend

Member For 5 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 24th March 2005
Posts: 20,404
Blessings: 23,521
Reps: 225,918,858,897,027,968 (power: 225,918,858,897,057)
heron has disabled reputation
That's great to hear! Now you know.

Water Baptism is a great great thing "I will do whatever you want me to do God and to show you, Watch this!"


Lol. (-;

Denominations tend to have very firm and disparate views of what the Spirit baptism is, so it's good to just listen to all the approaches and then decide what is scriptural and of God.

Some fellowships will get crazy over insisting people must speak in tongues to prove that God dwells in them. It is not scriptural to treat a gift and a phenomenon as a standard or measure.

The water baptism, as shown above, is a public and formal statement of your intents. You tell God and man that you're serious.

Notice that when Jesus chose to get water baptised, the Spirit descended like a dove.

The Holy Spirit is not a commodity to be weighed and traded and assessed. The Spirit is part of the triune God. We treat the Father with awe, but tend to demean or compartmentalize this part of God that is so fluid and intangible.

Jesus promised that when he left earth, He would send the Comforter, who would lead us to understanding.

John 14

In Greek, comforter/par-ak'-lay-tos was used to describe a legal advocate.

http://studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3875

Ac 2:38 - In Context
Greek Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Mr 1:8 "I baptized you with water; but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit."

Ac 1:5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."

Ac 11:16 "And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, `John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'

1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.


It is the same God that dwells in you, the same Spirit. But people found a distinct difference between committing themselves to God for salvation, and allowing Him to work through them for the building up of other people.

God did some crazy things that most people would not normally feel comfortable with. These results strengthened faith, brought more people to connect with God, and gave insight. God continues to work in this way, if we let Him.

One difference between the two baptisms -- when we get water baptised, we usually tell God we are committed... when we get Spirit baptised, we ask God to be more involved. Both involve yielding, but in a different way. Water baptism seems to be more of a begging to be accepted into His kingdom; Spirit baptism is sort of a "now that I'm here, I want to be involved."
Ask, seek, knock.

But I don't think the two are necessarily separate for each person. It's the same God dwelling in us.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Unread 22nd February 2010, 03:23 AM
Regular Member

Gender: Male Married Faith: Christian Member For 5 Years
 
Join Date: 10th June 2005
Posts: 496
Blessings: 500,222,659
Reps: 9,225,156,917,826,646 (power: 9,225,156,917,836)
Mister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond repute
Mister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond reputeMister_Al has a reputation beyond repute
Water Baptism is your marriage ceremony to Jesus and you don't get the Holy Spirit until then.

Acts 2:38 (New International Version)

38) Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.


You can't go by what you feel, you must go by what the Bible says.


Acts 19:1-7 (New International Version)

1) While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples 2) and asked them, "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?"
They answered, "No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit."

3) So Paul asked, "Then what baptism did you receive?"
"John's baptism," they replied.

4) Paul said, "John's baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus." 5) On hearing this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. 6) When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues and prophesied. 7) There were about twelve men in all.

Blessings,

Alan

Last edited by Mister_Al; 22nd February 2010 at 03:29 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Unread 22nd February 2010, 08:20 AM
heron's Avatar
Legend

Member For 5 Years
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 24th March 2005
Posts: 20,404
Blessings: 23,521
Reps: 225,918,858,897,027,968 (power: 225,918,858,897,057)
heron has disabled reputation
Baptism is an outward expression of an inward reality...Baptism in the holy spirit is most definately a different experience whereby gods holy spirit fully enters you.
Yes, the first one requires your action, the second requires God's action.

A long time ago some friends wanted to get water baptized, but their church did not teach of the born-again life, and they didn't know of others that would baptize them with the same meaning they intended. They waited about half a year before they could find an opportunity that reflected what they believed baptism was about.

In the meantime, God didn't stop working in their lives. From what I remember, they were baptized in the Holy Spirit before their water baptism. This is not the scriptural order of things, but their desire for water baptism was there, and they were public about asking for referrals... in asking, they gave a public declaration of intent, informally.

I always thought it was a little confusing that water baptism would be required, when so much of the rest of faith happened in the heart. But I think that's the point -- we need to hold ourselves to some formal public expressions of faith, so we're not just hermits who think ourselves wise.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Unread 22nd February 2010, 11:02 AM
LilLamb219's Avatar
Category Manager
WonderLamb

47 Gender: Female Married Faith: Lutheran Country: United States Member For 5 Years Tentmaker
View Profile Pic
 
Join Date: 2nd June 2005
Posts: 25,195
Blessings: 4,344,910
My Mood Sad
Reps: 1,331,642,002,732,547,328 (power: 1,331,642,002,732,582)
LilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond repute
LilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond reputeLilLamb219 has a reputation beyond repute
When we look at the scriptures that concern baptism, we see that God is the one at work through the waters with His Word attached to it in the form of promises.

In baptism, we are clothed in Christ's righteousness...covered so that we are righteous. Galatians 3:27. For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.

In baptism, our sins are washed away. Acts 22:16. And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name. Titus 3:5. He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit. Eph. 5:26. Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word. 1 Corinthians 6:11. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

In the early church, when baptism was mentioned...one only had in mind ONE baptism, not two as some churches today declare it to be. There is but one baptism for the remission of our sins.
Ephesians 4:5 (New International Version) one Lord, one faith, one baptism;
Acts 2:37-39. Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Brothers, what shall we do?" And Peter said to them, "Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself."
Reply With Quote
Reply

« Crying? | Praying »

Return to For New Christians

Thread Tools
Display Modes


 
Become a CF Site Supporter Today and Make These Ads Go Away!


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:44 PM.