So far as I understand you, yes. But not on Dec 25th.
Given that you are in a country that has Dec 25th, the traditional date for celebrating it, as a national holiday I don't get why your congregation would not choose to celebrate it on that day. What else would you use that holiday for, and why would you prefer that over celebrating the Incarnation as a congregation on that day?
Are we somehow less spiritual or Christian because of it?
__________________ For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He justified also ; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.
"We are like dwarfs sitting on the shoulders of giants. We see more, and things that are more distant, than they did, not because our sight is superior or because we are taller than they, but because they raise us up, and by their great stature add to ours." John of Salisbury, 1159
As God as my witness, I thought turkeys could fly. Closing the gap between the God I want and the God who is. The same sun that melts the ice hardens the clay. Puritan saying I am doing better than I deserve. God is always bigger than our misunderstandings of Him.
Are we somehow less spiritual or Christian because of it?
Unless I understand your motivations (which I don't) how could I possibly judge that? I'm simply trying to understand a different tradition, not make judgements about it.
__________________ Goodness is stronger than evil,
love is stronger than hate,
light is stronger than darkness,
life is stronger than death,
victory is ours through him who loved us.
(++Desmond Tutu)
Unless I understand your motivations (which I don't) how could I possibly judge that? I'm simply trying to understand a different tradition, not make judgements about it.
That may be the issue then. What we do isn't a tradition any more than not having weekly services on a Tuesday isn't a tradition. So there really is no compare and contrast here.
__________________ For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He justified also ; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.
"We are like dwarfs sitting on the shoulders of giants. We see more, and things that are more distant, than they did, not because our sight is superior or because we are taller than they, but because they raise us up, and by their great stature add to ours." John of Salisbury, 1159
As God as my witness, I thought turkeys could fly. Closing the gap between the God I want and the God who is. The same sun that melts the ice hardens the clay. Puritan saying I am doing better than I deserve. God is always bigger than our misunderstandings of Him.
That may be the issue then. What we do isn't a tradition any more than not having weekly services on a Tuesday isn't a tradition. So there really is no compare and contrast here.
For pity's sake, stop being so defensive.
I just use tradition as a label for [your or my] way of doing things (or not doing things).
__________________ Goodness is stronger than evil,
love is stronger than hate,
light is stronger than darkness,
life is stronger than death,
victory is ours through him who loved us.
(++Desmond Tutu)
I'd think since we'll be spending the majority of our time praising God in heaven, it only makes sense that we do so down here out of joy, but also out of preparing ourselves for His Kingdom.
We have a Christmas evening Vespers type service, and a morning liturgy on Christmas Day. Thanks for this reminder, Boswd, as my family has never gone to the Christmas Day service, I'm ashamed to say, and I think we should make the effort this year and the following years to go. We are missing out, I'm sure, on a beautiful worshipping service with our community.
I hope you do make it to the liturgy on Christmas day. It is a beautiful service. I am still hoping I will get to go on Christmas day and won't have to work. I am looking forward to the Vespers the night before as well. I love the hymns of that service. Also, in our parish, after the liturgy on Christmas, we break the fast together. Matushka usually takes coffee hour and makes Christmas cookies, and has a lot of sausage and cheese (as well as other meat and dairy snack foods).
__________________ Truly the penitent is not one who laments over the evil he has committed, but one who laments over all the evil that he is capable of committing. A wise landowner not only cuts the thornbush that has pricked him, but every thornbush on the field that is waiting to prick him. St. Nikolai Velimirovich (1880-1956) in Prayers by the Lake
I just use tradition as a label for [your or my] way of doing things (or not doing things).
Bthat you're asking is akin to me asking why you don't worship, as a congregation, on Tuesdays and Thursdays. It has nothing to do with desire, necessity or tradition. It just is.
__________________ For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He justified also ; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.
"We are like dwarfs sitting on the shoulders of giants. We see more, and things that are more distant, than they did, not because our sight is superior or because we are taller than they, but because they raise us up, and by their great stature add to ours." John of Salisbury, 1159
As God as my witness, I thought turkeys could fly. Closing the gap between the God I want and the God who is. The same sun that melts the ice hardens the clay. Puritan saying I am doing better than I deserve. God is always bigger than our misunderstandings of Him.
I hope you do make it to the liturgy on Christmas day. It is a beautiful service. I am still hoping I will get to go on Christmas day and won't have to work. I am looking forward to the Vespers the night before as well. I love the hymns of that service. Also, in our parish, after the liturgy on Christmas, we break the fast together. Matushka usually takes coffee hour and makes Christmas cookies, and has a lot of sausage and cheese (as well as other meat and dairy snack foods).
Aww, that's nice! I hope you can make it, Katherine. Yes, we usually go to the Christmas Eve vespers service. It's beautiful, as well, of course. Unless one of us is sick, we should be going to the Christmas Day Liturgy this year. Laziness was the only reason the past few years, I admit.
I was talking to my sister last night, and her church (Antiochian) does an evening vespers liturgy Christmas Eve. They don't have a Christmas Day Liturgy.
__________________ "This is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the commandment, that as you have heard from the beginning, you should walk in it." 2 Jn 6
"We love Him because He first loved us." 1 Jn 4:19
“The grace of God is not in the man who does not love his enemies.” St. Silouan To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
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I realise that you celebrate it on another day, but I left that tacit because your post I responded to left it tacit.
You said:
"But if my local congregation chooses not to, that should be fine as well."
I responded:
"It is fine - if you don't want to then you shouldn't - but that doesn't help me understand why you wouldn't want to."
Clearly the unstated thing in my post is the same as the unstated thing that your post refers to you choosing not to do - ie celebrating as a community on December 25th.
So, what I'm trying to figure out is why you choose not to do that - the thing you've said you choose not to do: celebrate as a community on Christmas day.
Your response: "For us, we don't see the necessity of having another service."
Doesn't help because necessity has got absolutely nothing to do with it. None of us see it as necessary but being Christian isn't about doing the necessary minimum. My position isn't "why don't you see it as necessary" but "I cannot figure out why a Christian would not choose to do it because they actively want to do it". None of us do it because it is necessary, but boil the Christian faith down to what is necessary and you've boiled the baby away with the bathwater.
Please remember what "it" is in the above, because spelling it out every time shouldn't be necessary.
I agree, all I'm looking for is the "why" I think Momma Z gave the most honest answer, simpley " I don't know"
Why is everybody talking about how they observe a pagan holiday as if it was sanctioned by God. It wasn't. In fact God says He hates that kind of worship. Knowing this it seems strange that people would do that claiming to do it in His name. Strange indeed!
Why do you think that celebrating Christ's birth is pagan?
Why do you think God hates us celebrating one of the most important events in mankind's history?
Were not the angels rejoicing at the event “Do not be afraid; for behold, I proclaim to you good news of great joy that will be for all the people. For today in the city of David a savior has been born for you who is Messiah and Lord. And this will be a sign for you: you will find an infant wrapped in swaddling clothes and lying in a manger.” And suddenly there was a multitude of the heavenly host with the angel, praising God and saying: “Glory to God in the highest and on earth peace to those on whom his favor rests.” (Lk 2:10-14)
I agree, all I'm looking for is the "why" I think Momma Z gave the most honest answer, simpley " I don't know"
Let me ask this. When you do go on Christmas, do you stay all day?
__________________ For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He justified also ; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.
"We are like dwarfs sitting on the shoulders of giants. We see more, and things that are more distant, than they did, not because our sight is superior or because we are taller than they, but because they raise us up, and by their great stature add to ours." John of Salisbury, 1159
As God as my witness, I thought turkeys could fly. Closing the gap between the God I want and the God who is. The same sun that melts the ice hardens the clay. Puritan saying I am doing better than I deserve. God is always bigger than our misunderstandings of Him.
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