This is a dramaticly over simplified statement, this issue is not about to pay or not to pay its about what extent to pay the courts have percentages set up that are way above what it costs to raise a kid and make it hard for the non custodial parent to even live. If you want to make vauge simple statements as if english is not even your first language please dont post as this is a very serious situation for this man. Im sorry your mind can not comprehend the seriousness of situations like this and how badly feminism is ripping men off but its very clear you have absolutly no comprehension of the extortion that goes on in family law courts, you should read "venus the dark side" and maybe do some case law study and then come back and speak intelegently.
He pulled a gun on his wife.
Now, he has to deal with the legal consequences.
Hopefully, he is repentant, then I am sure God will let up on him.
As for child support, I paid that for eighteen years. We never went to court to set the price because I cared about my child.
I have seen a lot of guys take off on their wives, then not even bother to ever pay child support. Is that good? Is that compassionate? Is that forgiving?
I would state it is better to forgive the ex and pay child support, rather then to hold senseless grudges and not pay child support because of disagreements with the ex. Why should the children suffer because of parents unwillingness to forgive?
Skipping the country... what is that? That sends a big message to the child. It says, "I hate you".
In this man's case, he clearly doesn't even have this problem and seems repentant for threatening his ex. Further, he seems willing to get along with the ex even though she stabbed him in the back. He is lucky he didn't ruin his chances to ever see the kids again by losing his cool. A lot of dads do that. It is hard. Emotions get intense on these things.
If people would, instead, trust in God and the law - which is good in this case - then surely God would ease up and allow them to see their kids.
I am sure there will always be people preaching, "Do not pay child support, skip the country, go to Africa." But that just equals a life of misery.
The legal consequences for pulling the gun are already over, this issue is about the extent of the child support which you conviently dodged in your post, I dont think anyone is advocating skipping out on child support but if your ex is trying to extort you to a point you can not live comfortabley then you have to take more drastic action and unfortunatly the kid suffers but not at the hands of the father at the hands of the mother and the courts the father is just protecting himself, once the courts and the mother have pushed him to that point they are now responsible for dealing with the fact there is no child support, if you keep throwing stones at teh goose that lays the golden eggs its eventually not going to be there anymore. Also going to africa would be foolish (at least south of the sahara) I have friends in Tunisia and Libia and they say its not that bad if you are in libia you probably want to make sure you have employment secured most likely at there gas plant, where you choose to leave to is obvoiusly important so dont make this unnessicarily melodramatic. It is not saying you hate your kids its saying you hate being extorted and homeless while the kids are being used as pawns to extract large sums of money from you.
To many people use the guise of compassion and what ever other buzz words you want to throw in there to justify there extortion, if you read the old testimate most of the stories where nations fell were do to idol worship and extorting there own people or having corrupt laws, im sure babaylon had courts like that where they were sayin "oh but its for the kids" as the other hand was taking 27-50% of someones income putting them right on the edge of homelessness you dont think God sees this?
27-50% of their income is unfair.
My main concern is just that the guy doesn't freak out. If he breaks the law - even if it is bad - he could end up never seeing his kids again.
Leaving the country is not breaking the law, its trading one set of laws for another (hopefully he chooses wisely and trades up for a better set of laws). The laws that he left no longer will apply to him, the thing is he has to act fast before the gestopo catches on and drains all his assets so he no longer has the resources to get out (he could transfer his assets to gold and just carry it with him but he runs the risk of being ripped off. The choise he has to make is does he want to live on the edge of homelessness and have irregular unmeaningful time with his kids when ever it suits his ex (like when she has a booty call with her BF) or is he willing to not see his kids until they are of the age to make there own decisions but be able to make a new life for himself and live in peace and find a new GF/wife who will treat him right. The US courts will enable his ex to drag this out for a very long time and finding a GF on the edge of homelessness is probably very difficult to do and having babys momma drama alot of good women dont want that in there life. So he will be reduced to hiring prostitutes if he wants any kind of sex life at all for the next 18 years and thats not a way to live.
I see. Well that is a perspective I do not have, thanks for elucidating it, and apologies for offending you -- not my intention.
Your not offending me im trying to save this guys life, the courts put men in such crappy situations that alot of them contemplate suicide and many go through with it, there is nothing that takes a higher priority than the state of his soul, not even his own kids, his relationship with God comes before all else (kids, wife, job, everything). If the extortion is so bad he has to leave the nation to regain a stable state of mind then so be it, if his kids suffer thats too bad because his relationship with God comes first. Our family law courts are so corrupt that sometimes there is no other choise, I do think he should exhaust all his legal options first but with the state of our nation under control of feminism the odds are not good and he needs to be mentally and financailly prepared to make the choise to leave rather than kill himself. I think society and even christianity has there priorities all mixed up, kids are not the end all be all, your relationship with God and then your wife come first the kids are 3rd, if thats not the case then your priorities are messed up, and thoes messed up priorities are causing alot of problems in this nation and in church, without a stable relationship with God and your wife there is no hope for the kids.
Yes, God comes first, I agree.
I think you have a valid perspective, just different from mine where I have known a lot of single moms whose dad just skipped town. I am not big on broken families, not at all. I have also met a lot of seriously troubled kids who didn't have a father figure around.
I had to be estranged from my daughter while growing up, but it was beyond my control and prayed that she be okay. Thankfully, God gave me the faith in that and while we do not have a close relationship, she does seem to regard me highly.
And thank God she did not get into any trouble.
I do think she has been with me in my heart, however.
I have not been a big fan of the sixties "free love" (code word for sex being "love") nonsense, and the rise in broken marriages and crime I see as related to that. OTOH, if people believed and trusted God to raise their kids, that would be a different matter.
If he is going to be worn down by costs such that it destroys his life, yes, he probably should leave. You are correct.
Just to make this topmost: I was alarmed at reading about Bacon2 recommending guns and such, but since talking to him agree that it is better to take off then to stay and have your life drowned by an unfair legal system. I simply had no idea that they could do that, apologies, I should have looked it up first... from my perspective, I have just always seen the situation from the perspective of single moms.
Looking this up...
The proper applicable percentage is calculated by determining how many children the paying parent has an obligation to support. For example, a parent who only has an obligation to support one child will pay 20% of net earnings. A father who has an obligation to support two children with the same mother will pay 25% of net earnings. However, a father who has an obligation to support two children with different mothers will pay 17.5% of net earnings to each child.
There is a cap on child support of $6000 of net earnings. In other words, if the paying parent earns more than $6000 per month (net), the percentage applied will only apply to the first $6000. The only exception to this is if the court finds that the child or children have additional or exceptional "needs" that require additional support.
That is just Texas. So the poor get slammed and the wealthy get off under that system. That is horrible.
Its pretty much the same in every state, my state is 27% for 2 kids, I have a friend who is going through this and because he works construction he makes good money when he is working but they expect you to save that money until the next job so you average out to a good wage, but with teh court taking that money plus arrerages (because he is out of work but it is a short enough time the court will not make changes to the order) so he lived with me last summer on an air mat in my office otherwise he would have been homeless, as far as trying to save money to get ahead you can forget about that. Leaving the nation is a drastic measure I would not have recommended if our court system were not so messed up.
Hospitals are the same way, if you are old and have an emergency they can take the very house you live in out from under you if you dont have insurance, my parents wanted to put the house in my name.
Nasty. I am somewhat aware the the health care problem, though a conservative libertarian sort... I don't like the idea of the poor being left in the cold or people getting horrendous debt.But, I haven't seen a good real fix for that yet. Maybe they will.
Life does get very hard for some people. Many times I have been tempted with suicide or just taking off, I hate to admit. I have taken off to be homeless at least twice in my life.
I am too hopeful to consider suicide seriously, even in my darkest times.
Now that I have a family, I could not bear to take off and leave them, and do not find a way to afford to take them to some distant place. Where I would have to get a job to afford them, and there are not jobs in these ways.
So, finding myself against the walls like this, I find I have to force the faith to deal with it. God forces me to pray in these situations.
I have found in that dark hour - which happens all too frequently - God pulls me out of the mess and turns it around.
What is it like? It is like how Job just sat in a place and did not have any appetite. I find in those situations my spirit just screams out for help, all day, all night.
Frankly, it hurts so bad, I can't help also saying, "I would rather die then live", though I know God saves me from all such depths of pain.
Like a knife twisted in the soul and twisted around.
All day, all night.
Last edited by freeport; 7th November 2009 at 08:09 PM.
Nasty. I am somewhat aware the the health care problem, though a conservative libertarian sort... I don't like the idea of the poor being left in the cold or people getting horrendous debt.But, I haven't seen a good real fix for that yet. Maybe they will.
Life does get very hard for some people. Many times I have been tempted with suicide or just taking off, I hate to admit. I have taken off to be homeless at least twice in my life.
I am too hopeful to consider suicide seriously, even in my darkest times.
Now that I have a family, I could not bear to take off and leave them, and do not find a way to afford to take them to some distant place. Where I would have to get a job to afford them, and there are not jobs in these ways.
So, finding myself against the walls like this, I find I have to force the faith to deal with it. God forces me to pray in these situations.
I have found in that dark hour - which happens all too frequently - God pulls me out of the mess and turns it around.
What is it like? It is like how Job just sat in a place and did not have any appetite. I find in those situations my spirit just screams out for help, all day, all night.
Frankly, it hurts so bad, I can't help also saying, "I would rather die then live", though I know God saves me from all such depths of pain.
Like a knife twisted in the soul and twisted around.
All day, all night.
Also, I should note... if the parents are in pain over the lost child, the children may also suffer. That is what 'being with them in spirit' is about.
Most people would say that is untrue, or try and describe away depression - "depression" - as genetic to explain it away. I have found otherwise.
I have also found it can lead to a life of sustainable misery in the case of separation. But, you are right, better a sustained misery over time, then such a climatic misery one feels they must kill themselves or do something else bad.
Such misery is profound prayer: for God is close to the contrite and broken hearted. And if one is born again, they find the amount of pain they can take is completely unreal. (This, however, is direction people may need to be reminded or or told, to maximize their faith... that God is close to every single second of their misery and is a wise Judge who can alleviate it.)
Pain is an important part of life, it is the cross we take up, and the fire we walk.
This is a dramaticly over simplified statement, this (. This) issue is not about to pay or not to pay its (pay. It's) about what extent to pay the (men have to pay due to court orders. The) courts have percentages set up that are way above what it costs to raise a kid *1 and make it hard for the non custodial parent to even live (to live). If (Apparently) you want to make vauge simple (vague, simple) statements as if english is not even your (as though English is not your) first language please (language. Please) dont post as this (because this)is a very serious situation for this man. Im sorry your mind can not comprehend the seriousness of situations like this *2 and how badly feminism is ripping men off but its (off. It is) very clear you have absolutly no comprehension of the extortion *3 that goes on in family law courts, you (courts. You) should read "venus the dark side" (Venus the Dark Side) and maybe do some case law study (study case law) and then come back and speak intelegently.
Spelling Problem = words in this color
Gramar Problem = underlined problem (possible correction)
*1 Unsupported statement irrelevant to the subject.
*2 Unsupported statement, in which the author assumes to know what the span of knowledge is in a stranger's mind.
*3 Unsupported statement, extortion is a crime. Crimes are a matter for criminal courts, extortion is not handled in the venue of family law.
So, when you said
If you want to make vauge simple statements as if english is not even your first language please dont post as this is a very serious situation for this man. . . . . and maybe do some case law study and then come back and speak intelegently.
Surely you didn't expect to be taken seriously.
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Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy .” Olmstead v. U.S., 277 U.S. 438
Spelling Problem = words in this color
Gramar Problem = underlined problem (possible correction)
*1 Unsupported statement irrelevant to the subject.
*2 Unsupported statement, in which the author assumes to know what the span of knowledge is in a stranger's mind.
*3 Unsupported statement, extortion is a crime. Crimes are a matter for criminal courts, extortion is not handled in the venue of family law.
So, when you said Surely you didn't expect to be taken seriously.
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