Encouraging dads to be more involved..how?

im going to jump in here and try to give you some insight from the other side incase it helps.
Just so you know overit, i fully understand you would be quite annoyed by the whole uninvolved dad, and it sounds like he should be doing a lot more with the kids.

I am a Dad who is fighting for custody of my kids. i love them dearly, and they love to spend time with me. I have been a big part of my childrens lifes until my wife up and left me. i was at every hospital scan, every doctors visit and was there when they where born. i had time off work when they where born to help round the house, and to help my wife and to enjoy our new bubba's. on my days off work, i took them to playgroups and family outings when my wife worked.
sometimes i even bottle fed them overnight when i had to work the next day if she was tired or needed a night to sleep through.

Anyhow, i have been very involved with them since birth. theyre now 2 1/2 and 3 1/2 years old. my wife up and left, took the kids away from me and i didnt know where they where for a while. I didnt hardly get to see them for 12-14 weeks.
when i got the landline number, i have rang them just about every night for the last 6 months to talk.

im slowly loosing the connection with them for a number of reasons. because they dont want to talk to me on the phone at night hardly at all anymore, i dont get to see them nearly as much, my ex wife has such a negative attitute towards me it rubbs off onto the kids etc. i have done my absolute best to see them as much as i can, and they dont seem as excited to spend time with me either.

after the years of emotional insults, neglect and constant picking from my wife it has taken its toll on me. i dont find as many things in life nearly as enjoyable as i used to, i dont enjoy many hobbies anymore, and generally avoid much of a social scene. i put on a happy face, and try to be the same dad i have been over the last few years to my kids when i do see them. But its really hard.
my wife is so picky with me that she has been weighing the kids after i spend time with them. its cost me over 25k in solicitors fees to try and get joint custody, and theres nothing i have done to ever jepoardise me seeing my kids.

a couple of times its nearly gotten to the point where i just want to walk away from everything. (house, job, car, kids, etc) no job, nowhere to live, no kids to talk to, no ex wife to worry about still picking at me.

The emotional trauma my wife has caused me by doing the things she has really broken my fatherly role and responsibility. i was so involved with my children, but now we are drifting apart and theres nothing i can do about it.

the point im trying to make here is that it might be the case that your ex husband is not a real good fatherly figure, and he might need to brush up in a few areas. But do you think he will get better by you constantly telling him how bad he is? do you think its going to make him come closer to his kids if he always feels like a failure, do you think he will try spend time with them if they dont want to spend time with him due to them thinking he is no good? I really doubt it will.
i think Autumn leaf has summed it up fairly well
no one is perfect, and we can all get the guns out and emotionally shoot each other up, but what good will it do?
its love and forgiveness that builds people up and makes us better.

I know it might be hard in your shoes because you are felling let down, but try it for the sake of your kids. you sound like you care about your kids a lot, do you care about them enough to try get a good relationship going with them and their father?
Try to think positive thoughts about your ex husband. think about the good he used to do and the good in him. try to have a positive approach towards him and it might start to rub off on the kids. talk the good things about him to them. when talking to your ex on the phone try to encourage him to spend time with them and talk about good things they could do. Get some happy feeling flowing around and see how many wonders it works.

Ddisiple...wow...I just want to say I'm sorry for how your ex has handled the situation-I can totally see, and I KNOW that these kind of things happen and it's so very unfair to the kids, and to the non-custodial parent. It's a pathetic way to be (your ex)....and how selfish to try to come between your relationship. I can imagine where it is very painful and just wanting to start over and leave everything behind. If you're being sabotaged at every turn it makes sense you get totally discouraged. I don't know what to tell you, other then I'm sorry you and your kids have endured this.

That said...I just want to remind if you haven't read my posts-or need further clarification.....my ex was never (even when married) involved w/the kids-maybe with our first he was the first year...after my 2nd son was born it went downhill...he was disinterested from the pregnancy on. His abuse and nelgect increased. He never came to appointments, I had a very bad car wreck when 7 mo preggos-they had to stop labor 3 times through the night...I was in bad shape. My ex came to the hospital and stayed only an hour (my parents were able to watch our youngest)...and left because "he was tired and had to go to work the next day". My dad even yelled at him...saying your wife is in a car crash-your boss will understand! .
For the birth-he went home to get my bag (I had high blood pressure-and was sent to deliver 3 weeks early) and decided to shower, nap and show up after I labored by myself for about 6hrs...and then went on to go BACK to sleep when he arrived.

The abuse increased-his disinterest increased-he never once even suggested joint custody-he didn't want to deal w/the responsibility of kids.

As to what you said about my attitude with him-as I've said-when we speak on the phone I always am pleasant-and even chit chat mundane things, about his parents, his family, his job (lack of), how he likes the new place he moved to. I also tell him the boys are growing and need dad time, I never make him feel like a failure or tell him he's lousy. Only on rare ocassion do I vent my frustration that he step up a bit....but when he comes to the house-or stops by on Christmas, Thanksgiving, he's always welcome at our table, in my home, or my parents, we all have a good time, he even used to bring his gf (now ex gf) and we welcomed them both. So it keeps being insinuated how I treat him-and I really am upset at that because I have forgiven him-believe me-it takes a LOT from me emotionally to be as nice as I am (which I do for my sons sake-I want them to see we have a good co-parenting relationship).

This is a man remember who abused me in every way-neglected us-and caused damage beyond what you can imagine-it took me years of healing, therapy, prayer to heal the scars left by him....and even with that Iv'e taken the higher road. Done EVERYTHING I possibly can so my boys will benefit from us being civil w/eachother.

And...I guess compared to other divorced parents-I believe we do MUCH better (I see hostility amongst people divorced 20 years-can't be in the same room)...it's not like that with us, and it mostly has to do with me letting go and being above that mess so my sons can benefit.

He on ocassion will still verbally abuse me -but it's very rare now- happened more the first few years. SO as far as how we behave w/eachother-it's very good....the problem we have is his lack of financial support-and his disinterest in wanting to spend more time with them. But as flnt said-I've tried all I can do-let go and let God at this point.

Overit I just wanted to say that the situation dd descibed is far more the norm than the one you do...and thats why that reaction keeps coming towards you, undeserved.
One way to address that is to join the chorus of people speaking out AGAINST the things he mentions and the things that were mentioned in the article I linked and deleted. Its insanely rampant, its just not something that is popular to report on, and in a way its politically incorrect to say things in defense of dads, since the overall societal perception is that once divorced (and all men deserved to be kicked out for starters) men are dead beats who dont care....when the exact opposite is true and the number of men in DD's situation, paying legal fees and fighting is MASSIVE. Its why when someone like MacX said "man up" it gets my dander up so badly.
Ive had women on forums say that even men who are legally forced out of the kids lives and are trying to do everything they can to get back in, are not man enough because they dont see their kids EVEN THOUGH THEY ARE FORCED NOT TO. Its really hard to read that, and DD's post, and the myriad of others I know of and not get a little raw.
You are a good example, i wish others would learn.

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Sure hope this is relevant and not plagiarism.

overit - your ex and situation (esp when still married) sound so much like mine. I think you're doing a great job with your boys and they will see that as they grow/mature, if they don't already.

ddisciple - I don't think projecting your own situation onto others is helpful or necessary. I'm sorry for what you're going through and will pray for your situation. But, to suggest that overit is somehow responsible for her ex-husband's behavior is not a fair statement to make. There are some of us moms who would give ANYTHING to have our ex-husband's want to be involved and supportive (emotionally, physically - with time/invovlement, and financially) of their children. Not all men are wired that way, though. Just like not all women are wired to desire to support a relationship between her children and their father.

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overit and flnativegrl,

I put my story up there to give you an idea of how things feel from the other side of the fence. i put a little more of my story in there than normal due to the magnitude of my situation so you could see where i was coming from. when i originally read your thread, i felt a lot of what my ex wife would say and do to me, and naturally thought the case might have been fairly similar.
Conservation pretty much summed it up, im just in a minority basket thats all. Sorry if it has upset anyone and that it doesnt so much apply.
The comforting part of all is that god sees everything that happens in our lifes. he knows the motives of our hearts. You trying for the best and forgiving is the right thing to do, and you will be rewarded someday.
just frustrating having to wait hey

Oh my gosh----is is that men on this board just automatically assume the worst and that the guy is the victim and we're out to "destroy his life"...this was a mistake really-since the bias is glaringly obvious-and EXTREMELY mistaken and off base. Maybe you need to read in more detail-not what you assume-but take the time to read and not jump to conlusions.

Let me explain something to you...first, the man IS saved....his spiritual relationship may not be what it could be, but it's his choice... He is saved, he goes to church-I've seen him pray....his problem was that he felt his prayers were never answered.

But won't you know- if you read Malachi 2.....God tells a man his prayers will BE HINDERED because of how he dealt treacherously with his wife. So in marriage that is why he didn't move forward spiritually-he chose to abuse me-and I'm a daughter of God-he KNEW it was wrong-he chose to stay in that muck. His pride gets in the way constantly, I've seen a very receptive side of Him towards the Holy Spirits guidance, I KNOW he knows the answer. God will not force us against our will. Thing is I interceded for him for years and years and saw nothing.....when God reminded me of the "free will" part. He will not force him to change because of my prayers...the desire to change and be filled spiritually has to come from each individual webweaver.

I have never spoken death, or anything but encouragement to him. My parents have been spiritual mentors to this man for years-including when he originally was saved (they were ministers at the time). THey helped him grow....but it only reached a certain point and decided no more-the change was to hard and he was too proud.

The fact that he doesn't care about anything other then himself is simply because he has real narcissitic tendencies-the "kill myself" threats are a manipulation tactic done to make me "back off" for asking him to help support HIS OWN CHILDREN! I know it's a tactic-most narcisists dont' commit suicide by the way, it's a ploy...he would do that after a severe abusive episode....do get me to back down from leaving him.

So please don't speak of what you don't know, don't make assumptions-if you have questions, ask me....read my posts in more detail.

His previous relaitonship went sour as well-it's because of his behavior...he knows the better way, he knows God, he's been receptive before-he CHOOSES to not advance and move forward in his life. I also think the reason he's not where he needs to be in life (spiritually, emotionally, financially) is a direct consequence of his actions towards his family (the boys and I) and his unrepentant heart. He's paying the price, when you act this way you can't expec to to NOT have consequences.