Question: "What is the scroll"

5010 · #1 2nd November 2009, 10:44 PM

Question:

Can anyone tell me in 50 words or less;

"What the scroll in Revelation 5 is?"

And

Why did John cry when he learned no one was found worthy to open it?

Rev 5:4 Then I wept because no one could be found who was worthy to open the scroll and read it.

- This is a pop quiz, think about it.

Brad2009 · #2 3rd November 2009, 01:36 AM

I can't say for sure.

My best guess as to what that particular scroll is would be the scroll of God's wrath.

5010 · #3 3rd November 2009, 02:07 PM

Thanks for the reply Brad!

Why do you think John cried when no one could open it if it's the scroll of GOD's wrath?

Anyone else think they know?

Standing Up · #4 3rd November 2009, 02:38 PM

Revelation 4 is a flashback from the beginning of God's covenants with man.

The throne and around it:

Rainbow--Noah

24 elders--OT

4 beasts--NT

John weeps in 5:4 because at that time between the OT and NT covenants, he was "unaware" of the Triumphal Lamb.

Brad2009 · #5 3rd November 2009, 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by 5010

Thanks for the reply Brad!

Why do you think John cried when no one could open it if it's the scroll of GOD's wrath?

Anyone else think they know?

Pure speculation: I think he cried because without God's wrath there is no final victory, no purging of sin and death would be ever present.

NJBeliever · #6 3rd November 2009, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by 5010

Question:

Can anyone tell me in 50 words or less;

"What the scroll in Revelation 5 is?"

And

Why did John cry when he learned no one was found worthy to open it?

Rev 5:4 Then I wept because no one could be found who was worthy to open the scroll and read it.

- This is a pop quiz, think about it.

It's the book that Daniel is asked to seal up until the end times at the end of the book of Daniel.

5010 · #7 3rd November 2009, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by NJBeliever

It's the book that Daniel is asked to seal up until the end times at the end of the book of Daniel.

Now that is a very unique answer!

Still not explaining why John cried though.

Sure are alot of folks talkin about the seals everywhere but I don't think people can understand the seals if they don't understand the scroll properly first. THE LORD definately left us all the information we need to understand it but who is actually learning from HIM and not from men?

Anyone else have anything to put forward?

Hint: John knew exactly what it was.

zeke37 · #8 4th November 2009, 12:42 AM

Originally Posted by 5010

Question:

Can anyone tell me in 50 words or less;

"What the scroll in Revelation 5 is?"

And

Why did John cry when he learned no one was found worthy to open it?

Rev 5:4 Then I wept because no one could be found who was worthy to open the scroll and read it.

- This is a pop quiz, think about it.

Originally Posted by Standing Up

Revelation 4 is a flashback from the beginning of God's covenants with man.

The throne and around it:

Rainbow--Noah

24 elders--OT

4 beasts--NT

John weeps in 5:4 because at that time between the OT and NT covenants, he was "unaware" of the Triumphal Lamb.

agreed....

Originally Posted by NJBeliever

It's the book that Daniel is asked to seal up until the end times at the end of the book of Daniel.

agreed again...

Originally Posted by 5010

Now that is a very unique answer!

Still not explaining why John cried though.

Sure are alot of folks talkin about the seals everywhere but I don't think people can understand the seals if they don't understand the scroll properly first. THE LORD definately left us all the information we need to understand it but who is actually learning from HIM and not from men?

Anyone else have anything to put forward?

Hint: John knew exactly what it was.

the Scroll is sealed up till the end in Daniel...
only the elect will know what the scroll and it's seals means...
but it is revealed to the elect because of Christ.

the weaping is because, at that point in the vision, no one could yet unseal the scroll....no one

john weeps

but then Christ the Lamb Slain does open the seals

5010 · #9 4th November 2009, 03:03 PM

Originally Posted by zeke37

agreed....

agreed again...

the Scroll is sealed up till the end in Daniel...
only the elect will know what the scroll and it's seals means...
but it is revealed to the elect because of Christ.

the weaping is because, at that point in the vision, no one could yet unseal the scroll....no one

john weeps

but then Christ the Lamb Slain does open the seals

Oh' so excited to share what THE LORD has taught me I can hardly contain it!

Is anyone here familiar with the laws and traditions surrounding redemption of lost property? if not, here goes...

- A redeemer must be a close relative (JESUS born of woman but SON OF GOD!)

- A redeemer must fulfill all requirements to pay for the redemption of his "brother's" lost property.

- Scrolls were used to ascribe evidence and requirements for a given redemption. The sealed scroll could only be opened by the "REDEEMER" but the unsealed copies were given to the witnesses who would testify of the redeemers right to redeem and the fulfillment of all the requirements

Jer 32:7 Behold, Hanameel the son of Shallum thine uncle shall come unto thee, saying, Buy thee my field that [is] in Anathoth: for the right of redemption [is] thine to buy [it].

Jer 32:11 Then I took the sealed deed and an unsealed copy of the deed, which contained the terms and conditions of the purchase,

Jer 32:14 "The LORD Almighty, the God of Israel, says: Take both this sealed deed and the unsealed copy, and put them into a pottery jar to preserve them for a long time.

- John cried when he heard no one could open the scroll because that meant no one could redeem the earth to whome Adam has sold our dominion through sin unto satan! That meant the earth and all who dwell on it, our entire family would be LOST!

- JESUS, THE LAMB OF GOD OVERCAME AND IS WORTHY AND ABLE TO OPEN THE SCROLL BECAUSE HE HAS THE RIGHT TO REDEEM THE EARTH!

\o/
HALLELUJAH!

This helps so much to understand the rest of Revelation and the "two witnesses", indeed it helps put everything into proper perspective. GLORY TO GOD!

Zadok7000 · #10 4th November 2009, 03:37 PM

This has made me think on some things. Maybe just stream of consciousness type stuff, give it a whirl:

Ezek. 2:9-3:3
And when I looked, behold, an hand was sent unto me; and, lo, a roll of a book was therein; And he spread it before me; and it was written within and without: and there was written therein lamentations, and mourning, and woe. Moreover he said unto me, Son of man, eat that thou findest; eat this roll, and go speak unto the house of Israel. So I opened my mouth, and he caused me to eat that roll. And he said unto me, Son of man, cause thy belly to eat, and fill thy bowels with this roll that I give thee. Then did I eat it; and it was in my mouth as honey for sweetness.

Rev. 5:1-4
And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals. And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof? And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof? And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon. And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

+

Rev. 10 (same book only now opened)
But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets. And the voice which I heard from heaven spake unto me again, and said, Go and take the little book which is open in the hand of the angel which standeth upon the sea and upon the earth. And I went unto the angel, and said unto him, Give me the little book. And he said unto me, Take it, and eat it up; and it shall make thy belly bitter, but it shall be in thy mouth sweet as honey. And I took the little book out of the angel's hand, and ate it up; and it was in my mouth sweet as honey: and as soon as I had eaten it, my belly was bitter. And he said unto me, Thou must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings.

If this is indeed Daniel's book sealed, did he see Ezekiel and John in this vision??

Dan. 12:4-9
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders? And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.