That interpretation seems just as problematic to me; what are we going to do, hop into airplanes?
Originally Posted by Aibrean
Granted it takes a whole new meaning based on how you interpret heaven (such as the expanse over the earth rather than a spiritual realm).
That is another problematic verse, what is meant by the elements being destroyed?
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What would your emotional reaction be if you found out that Jesus Christ was returning in 30 minutes to take the faithful to Heaven? What would you do for that 30 minutes?
Luther wrote that he would plant a tree.
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I certainly don't believe in the rapture, but I have a hard time debating the point in light of the following passage:
After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.
-1 Thessalonians 4:17
What is the proper interpretation of this verse, DaRev and Filo? I'm completely at a loss when this verse is brought up.
(I know I'm not DaRev or Filo, but I'll throw my $0.02 in here anyway.)
I know that conservative Christians don't have any truck with John Dominic Crossan, but he gives what seems to be a pretty sound exegesis of this passage in his latest book, God & Empire.
Crossan's exegesis focuses on two words in the passage, parousia (usually translated as being "caught up") and apantesis (meeting or, more specifically, greeting). Apantesis is a word used to describe going out and greeting a dignitary; this was the custom in the walled cities of Paul's day. If someone important was coming to a city, emissaries would be sent out to greet that dignitary. How do the emissaries who greet Jesus at his return "go out" to meet him when he's returning not to a particular city but to the earth as a whole? By being caught up (parousia) in the air! If Jesus is returning from heaven (somewhere up in the sky, according to the cosmology that Paul's working with), then meeting him in the air before he touches down on the ground would be the equivalent of meeting him outside the earth's "city gates." Crossan takes it for granted that Paul's original intended audience would have understood that he was referring to this common practice. The notion that believers would greet Jesus upon his return in order to follow him back from whence he came wouldn't have occurred to that audience. If a dignitary comes to a city and is received outside its gates by the city's emissaries, they'd invite the dignitary in! That's the whole point of their going out for the apantesis! Meeting Jesus for the purpose of following him back to heaven (rather than welcoming him) is purely an invention of later interpreters who were unfamiliar with the context that the original audience would have clearly understood. The sort of rapture theology that the OP describes completely misses the point of what Paul's getting at in this passage.
(All scripture quotes in my posts are from the Holy Bible English Standard Version (ESV) unless otherwise indicated.) Daily return to the waters of Holy Baptism that the old man might be drowned and die. Daily, for he is a good swimmer. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
What would your emotional reaction be if you found out that Jesus Christ was returning in 30 minutes to take the faithful to Heaven? What would you do for that 30 minutes?
I can't help but notice that no one has actually answered the OP's question, which I think is an interesting one, whether you believe in a rapture or not. I think we can all agree that some day the world as we know it is gonna end, and the devil will be destroyed, and that Christ will one day set up His kingdom on earth. That being said...
At first, I would be extremely excited because the idea of living in heaven forever with Jesus would be more wonderful than words could say. But on second thought, I would be very sad, because there are so many people who are still hurting, and still separated from God. What will happen to them? I'd beg for forgiveness of all my sins, and try to reconcile myself with the people I've wronged. Come to think of it, I should do that now.
(I know I'm not DaRev or Filo, but I'll throw my $0.02 in here anyway.)
I know that conservative Christians don't have any truck with John Dominic Crossan, but he gives what seems to be a pretty sound exegesis of this passage in his latest book, God & Empire.
Crossan's exegesis focuses on two words in the passage, parousia (usually translated as being "caught up") and apantesis (meeting or, more specifically, greeting). Apantesis is a word used to describe going out and greeting a dignitary; this was the custom in the walled cities of Paul's day. If someone important was coming to a city, emissaries would be sent out to greet that dignitary. How do the emissaries who greet Jesus at his return "go out" to meet him when he's returning not to a particular city but to the earth as a whole? By being caught up (parousia) in the air! If Jesus is returning from heaven (somewhere up in the sky, according to the cosmology that Paul's working with), then meeting him in the air before he touches down on the ground would be the equivalent of meeting him outside the earth's "city gates." Crossan takes it for granted that Paul's original intended audience would have understood that he was referring to this common practice. The notion that believers would greet Jesus upon his return in order to follow him back from whence he came wouldn't have occurred to that audience. If a dignitary comes to a city and is received outside its gates by the city's emissaries, they'd invite the dignitary in! That's the whole point of their going out for the apantesis! Meeting Jesus for the purpose of following him back to heaven (rather than welcoming him) is purely an invention of later interpreters who were unfamiliar with the context that the original audience would have clearly understood. The sort of rapture theology that the OP describes completely misses the point of what Paul's getting at in this passage.
Originally Posted by CantateDomino
Joe - I've heard this same exegesis from conservative theologians as well. I think it's rock solid.
If you read Paul's passage in 1 Thessalonians 4 along side Jesus' teaching of the Last Day in Matthew 24 & 25, you will see that they are speaking of the same event. Compare the "rapture" passage with Jesus' parable of the wise and follish virgins, it makes the "rapture" passage clear. It is not, as the premillenialists say, a secret return where Jesus takes the faithful back to heaven with Him, but rather the faithful are "caught up" to meet the Lord in the air and then accompany Him to the Judgement.
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Just to point out: I agree with DaRev and the exegesis JoeCatch showed concerning the "rapture". Now, to answer the question the OP asked:
I'd pray... and eat.
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(All scripture quotes in my posts are from the Holy Bible English Standard Version (ESV) unless otherwise indicated.) Daily return to the waters of Holy Baptism that the old man might be drowned and die. Daily, for he is a good swimmer. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
I can't help but notice that no one has actually answered the OP's question, which I think is an interesting one, whether you believe in a rapture or not. I think we can all agree that some day the world as we know it is gonna end, and the devil will be destroyed, and that Christ will one day set up His kingdom on earth. That being said...
At first, I would be extremely excited because the idea of living in heaven forever with Jesus would be more wonderful than words could say. But on second thought, I would be very sad, because there are so many people who are still hurting, and still separated from God. What will happen to them? I'd beg for forgiveness of all my sins, and try to reconcile myself with the people I've wronged. Come to think of it, I should do that now.
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