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26th October 2009, 06:37 PM
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Reps: 2,507,084,308,916,044 (power: 2,507,084,308,930) | | Originally Posted by lordbt  What type of law? The type that moves toward the free market or toward socialized medicine?
Why is the left so reluctant to use the word socialism or socialized medicine anyway? Every other western country that has socialized medicine calls it socialized medicine, why dont those who want to see it here call it what it is? If people are ashamed of socialism then maybe they shouldnt advocate it.
They don't use socialism because that is not what the plan is.
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26th October 2009, 06:50 PM
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Reps: 4,764,076,357,041,536,000 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by JoyJuice They don't use socialism because that is not what the plan is.
Then what is it? The US healthcare system is already partially socialized through Medicare and Medicaid. The plan is basically to cover people who cant afford insurance by charging those who can. Sounds like socialism to me. My problem is with those who want European style socialized medicine here in the US but get upset when someone calls it socialism. If there is a different word that would accurately describe the proposed system I would like to hear it. |
26th October 2009, 07:07 PM
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Reps: 2,507,084,308,916,044 (power: 2,507,084,308,930) | | Originally Posted by lordbt Then what is it? The US healthcare system is already partially socialized through Medicare and Medicaid. The plan is basically to cover people who cant afford insurance by charging those who can. Sounds like socialism to me. My problem is with those who want European style socialized medicine here in the US but get upset when someone calls it socialism. If there is a different word that would accurately describe the proposed system I would like to hear it.
Socialism means a society where the means of production are owned and controlled by Government. If it was single payer, you may have a point. But it's not. It's called exactly what it is, a public option. It is the Government administrating an option where among existing private insurance policies, Government through pooling potention insurees will create an exchange program and through private insurers will provide options for selection. To say that it is socialism would be like calling our system of package delivery socialism, despite there being UPS, DHL, Federal Express, and a whole lot of other companies I can't name, just because the public has the option of the US Postal service.
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"Let the local communities decide how to pay the cost. They could decide on a local tax, just as an example.
Some will say that poor communities could not afford good schools.
Wake UP people! That's the idea, people would have good reason to build a better community." -a poster here. |
26th October 2009, 07:15 PM
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Reps: 432,640,816,575,563,648 (power: 432,640,816,575,582) | | Originally Posted by JoyJuice I can only find summarization bullet point ideas, but not a plan?
Where's that plan they were holding up to Obama when he made his joint session speech?
Let's start with the paradigm that we need a government run plan. There are other alternatives that have merit, but because they don't involve taxing us into oblivion and the gov. running it, the liberals won't consider it.
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26th October 2009, 07:18 PM
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Reps: 2,507,084,308,916,044 (power: 2,507,084,308,930) | | Originally Posted by Veritas Let's start with the paradigm that we need a government run plan. There are other alternatives that have merit, but because they don't involve taxing us into oblivion and the gov. running it, the liberals won't consider it.
..moving right along....
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Please construct a rational argument and leave the report button alone.
"Let the local communities decide how to pay the cost. They could decide on a local tax, just as an example.
Some will say that poor communities could not afford good schools.
Wake UP people! That's the idea, people would have good reason to build a better community." -a poster here. |
26th October 2009, 07:22 PM
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Reps: 2,507,084,308,916,044 (power: 2,507,084,308,930) | | Originally Posted by lordbt Then what is it? The US healthcare system is already partially socialized through Medicare and Medicaid. The plan is basically to cover people who cant afford insurance by charging those who can. Sounds like socialism to me. My problem is with those who want European style socialized medicine here in the US but get upset when someone calls it socialism. If there is a different word that would accurately describe the proposed system I would like to hear it.
Hey lordbt, let me ask you this question.
You know all those GOP Congressional people who are against the Democratic Healthcare reform plan and blatantly call it socialism, those who they and their families enjoy plans provided by the Government, are those socialist plans?
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You know who you are.
I know who you are.
Please construct a rational argument and leave the report button alone.
"Let the local communities decide how to pay the cost. They could decide on a local tax, just as an example.
Some will say that poor communities could not afford good schools.
Wake UP people! That's the idea, people would have good reason to build a better community." -a poster here. |
26th October 2009, 07:33 PM
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Reps: 323,833,949,233,120,320 (power: 323,833,949,233,133) | | | Silly question.....Leading question.....but no impeachment on the stand this time sorry
First, the thing of which its ",means of production" are in question is healthcare, so lets not get hung up on the sort of factory-esque sound of that definition. IF the govt is the ONLY source of healthcare...indeed, it meets the definition of socialized...absolutely.
I know in the beginning its an "option"....and when I retire there will be money in the SS lockbox....please can we not walk blindly, at least, into this? At least admit where it leads, THEN support it, or go on record saying you are nor in favor of a single payor. If you are in favor of single payor, then why are you dancing through this argument in this manner? |
26th October 2009, 08:47 PM
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Reps: 4,764,076,357,041,536,000 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by JoyJuice Hey lordbt, let me ask you this question.
You know all those GOP Congressional people who are against the Democratic Healthcare reform plan and blatantly call it socialism, those who they and their families enjoy plans provided by the Government, are those socialist plans?
I dont know what sort of plans they have, but I suppose they are like most government and non government employees' plans... a benefit of employment, a form of compensation. So the answer is no. |
26th October 2009, 09:27 PM
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Reps: 46,305,083,762,897,352 (power: 46,305,083,762,919) | | Originally Posted by JoyJuice Hey lordbt, let me ask you this question.
You know all those GOP Congressional people who are against the Democratic Healthcare reform plan and blatantly call it socialism, those who they and their families enjoy plans provided by the Government, are those socialist plans?
Sorry they are working for their healthcare just like any other employee. It is when you start giving government healthcare to people that don't work for the government that it becomes socialistic.
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26th October 2009, 09:34 PM
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Reps: 1,124,203,120,182,954 (power: 1,124,203,120,192) | | Originally Posted by Veritas There are other alternatives that have merit,
And the other alternatives are.........?
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