Romans 2:14 is just comparing Gentiles to Jews. If you look at the context, it seems to be saying that the Jews and the Gentiles are equally sinners. They can also both be obedient to the Law to an extent externally for conscience' sake.
The only people going to Heaven are people who have relied on the sacrifice of Jesus for their sin, repented, believed, and yielded their lives to the Lord. It is a gift of God, not as a result of works. Christians have received God's forgiveness. God gives them the belief. He is merciful and gracious and loving to people who do not deserve it.
Yes, everyone will stand before God one day for either salvation or judgment.
People who belong to the Lord will receive life, and people who do not will have eternal death...separation from God and the punishment of Hell.
This passage is talking about there being no partiality with God. People who are not under the law can also obey the law as much as a Jew, as God gave everyone a conscience.
Romans 2:12 says, "For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; "
Anyway, so yes, Christians should be doers of the law and not merely hearers, but they do it for the reason that God has given them the grace to obey and love and serve Him. Works in no way can earn salvation one bit, as it is all the work of the Lord.
Yes, one day every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus is Lord. The only thing is, that that will not save them when it is already too late.
Jesus claimed He is the only way, but if you reject Him here on earth you won't get another chance. As a Christian, I don't have a right to boast in myself, as I cannot in any way save myself. It is all the gift of God. Ephesians 2:8-9 is one of the places that makes that quite clear.
God can save a prospective suicide bomber or an atheist. He can bring them to repentance and show them His grace, love, and mercy.
After they are dead, it's not going to happen. They will believe, but they won't be able to be saved.
Demons believe and tremble, but they don't love God. Some people will feign being Christians even on earth, but God looks at the heart. He is the one who saves and the one who changes our will to His. He is most glorified in us when we are most satisfied in Him as a well known pastor says.
I hope one day that you will see God's love and mercy...all who read this forum and who do not yet know Jesus as their Savior and Lord.
Hi Carey, no the Bible does not suggest non-believers in Christ may go to heaven. What Romans 2:14 says if even if a person has not been exposed to God's written revelation, and so their behavior was in ignorance rather than willful violation of God's law, they will still be judged upon what they knew was right or wrong in their hearts. Say a guy treats others differently than he treats himself, divides shares so he gets the biggest portion, takes from the less powerful. He will be judged and punished for his misdeeds based on what he knew was right, not on what was written that he never saw. So the verse provides the basis for judgment of the Gentiles (non-Jews).
According to the Bible there is no way to be "good" enough to get into heaven, so only those who trust in the Savior will be saved and allowed to enter heaven because they have been made perfect (without sin) in Christ.
Hi Carey, no the Bible does not suggest non-believers in Christ may go to heaven. What Romans 2:14 says if even if a person has not been exposed to God's written revelation, and so their behavior was in ignorance rather than willful violation of God's law, they will still be judged upon what they knew was right or wrong in their hearts. Say a guy treats others differently than he treats himself, divides shares so he gets the biggest portion, takes from the less powerful. He will be judged and punished for his misdeeds based on what he knew was right, not on what was written that he never saw. So the verse provides the basis for judgment of the Gentiles (non-Jews).
According to the Bible there is no way to be "good" enough to get into heaven, so only those who trust in the Savior will be saved and allowed to enter heaven because they have been made perfect (without sin) in Christ.
What difference does our behaviour make, then? If what you wrote here were true, then judging a person based on his deeds is a collossal waste of time, as there is only one punishment and one way to escape it - which in turn isn't even remotely connected to the way we treat our fellow beings.
A Non-Christian may spend his life raping virgins and killing his neighbours, or toil away in a leper colony to selflessly alleviate the suffering of others - the result will be the same. There is but one judgment, and that depends wholly on religious affiliation, not on morality. The sociopathic mass murderer will be treated the same as the nurse, the thief will get the same "reward" as the policeman.
__________________ When man interferes with the Tao,
the sky becomes filthy,
the earth becomes depleted,
the equilibrium crumbles,
creatures become extinct.
--Lao-tzu, Tao Te Ching
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Hi Carey, no the Bible does not suggest non-believers in Christ may go to heaven. What Romans 2:14 says if even if a person has not been exposed to God's written revelation,( how could this person be a believer if they had not been exposed to what to believe in?? ) and so their behavior was in ignorance rather than willful violation of God's law, they will still be judged upon what they knew was right or wrong in their hearts.( and so will believers ) Say a guy treats others differently than he treats himself, divides shares so he gets the biggest portion, takes from the less powerful. He will be judged and punished ( punished how and where does it say ? ) for his misdeeds based on what he knew was right, not on what was written that he never saw. So the verse provides the basis for judgment of the Gentiles (non-Jews). ( yep and that is everyone regardless of their religion or non religion based on what they have been exposed toto believe in , right??)
According to the Bible there is no way to be "good" enough to get into heaven, so only those who trust in the Savior ( yes but they will trust in the svaior after the resurrection if their heart was good before they had a chance to be exposed to him. Hence the thread title. )will be saved and allowed to enter heaven because they have been made perfect (without sin) in Christ.
See my response in the main body fo your post in red since IO cannot multiquote
__________________ 2 Timothy 2 : 23Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25Those who oppose him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.
The Good News or "Evangelion" is: God has saved us, unconditionally, through no action on our own part. "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do." It has already happened.
Christianity is not about earning your place in heaven, either through specific deeds or by adhering to a specific creed - it's about loving God to your fullest potential. Not in order to earn rewards or save your own behind. Just out of gratitude.
__________________ When man interferes with the Tao,
the sky becomes filthy,
the earth becomes depleted,
the equilibrium crumbles,
creatures become extinct.
--Lao-tzu, Tao Te Ching
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Hi Carey, no the Bible does not say a non-believer may enter heaven.
The person in Romans 2:14 is not a believer, but is someone who never had the chance to believe.
No, believers will not be judged for their misdeeds, they are forgiven. Their works will be judged to authorize rewards. 1 Corinthians 3:14-15.
Where does the Bible say those who die in unbelief will be judged and punished for their misdeeds? Revelation 20:12
The idea of a second chance, after death, to obtain salvation has no basis in scripture.
What difference does our behavior make then? There is an old sayings, you cannot work your way to heaven, but you can dig yourself a deeper pit in hell. Believers obtain mercy, but those who die in unbelief obtain perfect justice, no more and no less. Be as good as you can be and thus pile up less wrath, that is the best that a person who rejected salvation in Christ Jesus.
The Good News or "Evangelion" is: God has saved us, unconditionally, through no action on our own part. "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do." It has already happened.
Christianity is not about earning your place in heaven, either through specific deeds or by adhering to a specific creed - it's about loving God to your fullest potential. Not in order to earn rewards or save your own behind. Just out of gratitude.
mmmmm. Why does a Pagan seem to understand the Gospel better than a whole lot of Christians?
Now we just have to get you back on board with the whole "who was Jesus" thing.
Hi Carey, no the Bible does not say a non-believer may enter heaven.
The person in Romans 2:14 is not a believer, but is someone who never had the chance to believe.
No, believers will not be judged for their misdeeds, they are forgiven. Their works will be judged to authorize rewards. 1 Corinthians 3:14-15.
Where does the Bible say those who die in unbelief will be judged and punished for their misdeeds? Revelation 20:12
The idea of a second chance, after death, to obtain salvation has no basis in scripture.
What difference does our behavior make then? There is an old sayings, you cannot work your way to heaven, but you can dig yourself a deeper pit in hell. Believers obtain mercy, but those who die in unbelief obtain perfect justice, no more and no less. Be as good as you can be and thus pile up less wrath, that is the best that a person who rejected salvation in Christ Jesus.
Where does Revelations 20: 12 say these are people who died in unbelief.??
Revelations 20 : . 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
Revelations 20 would also include these in Matthew 7 , who do believe , right??
Matthew 7 : 21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'
Since these are obviously believers who will go to hell.
It stands to reason some Muslims and Atheists who never had a chance to hear the truth and really read and know the Bible , may have their name written in the book of life. These would also be the Gentiles written in
Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles,( this could include Muslims and Atheists ) who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
__________________ 2 Timothy 2 : 23Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25Those who oppose him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.
Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
There is a contradiction: In Muslim religion, they also claim to believe in Jesus, but they follow a different gospel/good news, believing He did not die for our sins nor believe that He was the Son of God. They are told to deny Jesus' Sonship and resurrection.
That would mean Mohammad is one of those antichrists that John spoke about in one of his epistles.... and that would also mean that they are following a faith that perverts the gospel and are accursed for it (as Paul said to those who follow false gospels in his epistle to the Galatians).
__________________
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why not live a life of sin and repent after?? well for one you don't know when you will stand before God and if you are standing before God then it is to late to repent..
There is a contradiction: In Muslim religion, they also claim to believe in Jesus, but they follow a different gospel/good news, believing He did not die for our sins nor believe that He was the Son of God. They are told to deny Jesus' Sonship and resurrection.
That would mean Mohammad is one of those antichrists that John spoke about in one of his epistles.... and that would also mean that they are following a faith that perverts the gospel and are accursed for it (as Paul said to those who follow false gospels in his epistle to the Galatians).
I dont see the contradiction
Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,( because they are Muslim and have always been taught false things and have never heard the truth ) do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
__________________ 2 Timothy 2 : 23Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25Those who oppose him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.
)will be saved and allowed to enter heaven because they have been made perfect (without sin) in Christ.
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