I came across some people that said that Christians do not believe that Christ could have sinned and failed in his mission on earth. Well then how could he be 'tempted in the desert?"Where does this idea come from?
__________________ And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also......
I came across some people that said that Christians do not believe that Christ could have sinned and failed in his mission on earth. Well then how could he be 'tempted in the desert?"Where does this idea come from?
It probably came for the same minds that believe Mary was without sin.
__________________ John 14:21 The person who accepts my commands and obeys them is the one who truly loves me. My Father will love the person who loves me, and I will love him and make myself known to him.''
I came across some people that said that Christians do not believe that Christ could have sinned and failed in his mission on earth. Well then how could he be 'tempted in the desert?"Where does this idea come from?
Where did you "come upon" these people and "who" are they? Are you sure you didn't post the argument "those" people gave for why they teach Christ was PECCABLE? I say this because you just quoted the argument used by groups who maintain Christ was peccable. And I mean to a "T".
The only denominations I know of that teach Christ was peccable are those who hail from an Adventist source such as the Jehovah's Witnesses, Christadelphians, WWCOG, etc, etc.
The Catholic Church, Orthodox Church, Lutheran, Baptist, Methodist all reject the notion that Christ was peccable (could have sinned) and claim it is heresy.
The Fifth General Council of Constantinople in 553 openly CONDEMNED the teaching that Christ only became impeccable after the Resurrection. This means that every denomination that sprang from Orthodox sources would reject the notion that Christ was Peccable as heresy of the worst sort.
Originally Posted by Anathema 12
If anyone defends the heretical Theodore of Mopsuestia, who said that
God the Word is one, while quite another is Christ, who was troubled by the passions of the soul and the desires of human flesh, was gradually separated from that which is inferior, and became better by his progress in good works, and could not be faulted in his way of life, and as a mere man was baptized in the name of the Father and the Son and the holy Spirit, and through this baptism received the grace of the holy Spirit and came to deserve sonship and to be adored, in the way that one adores a statue of the Emperor, as if he were God the Word, and that he became after his resurrection immutable in his thoughts and entirely without sin.let him be anathema
It would be interesting if you could direct me to the those individuals who claim that if Christ "couldn't sin" then He failed. I would really like to have the chance to discuss this with them.
Last edited by Pythons; 13th October 2009 at 07:12 PM.
Matthew 4:1Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.
Mark 1:13And he was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted of Satan; and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered unto him.
Luke 4:2Being forty days tempted of the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing: and when they were ended, he afterward hungered.
If Christ could not sin, then there was nothing He could do to prove Satan wrong when he came in the flesh, as temptation was not possible.
Hebrews 2:14-18
Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. 16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. 17Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. 18For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
__________________ And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also......
Last edited by reddogs; 13th October 2009 at 10:05 PM.
Matthew 4:1Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be temptedof the devil.
Mark 1:13And he was there in the wilderness forty days, temptedof Satan; and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered unto him.
Luke 4:2Being forty days temptedof the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing: and when they were ended, he afterward hungered.
If Christ could not sin, then there was nothing He could do to prove Satan wrong when he came in the flesh, as temptation was not possible.
Hebrews 2:14-18
Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. 16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. 17Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. 18For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
Hi Reddogs, I've taken the liberty of making BOLD and coloring red the context of your quoted scriptures above. Read them and let me know what you think.
Do you really believe that God can sin? Or do you believe Christ wasn't/isn't God?
In Christ alone...
__________________ Freeindeed So if the Son makes you FREE, you will be FREE INDEED. Jn 8:36
So Christ has truly set us FREE. Now make sure that you stay FREE, and don’t get tied up again in slavery to the law. Gal 5:1
Do you really believe that God can sin? Or do you believe Christ wasn't/isn't God?
In Christ alone...
If I could change anything about what you wrote above I would; Just add the word "WHY" to the first sentence and replace the first two words of the second sentence with another "WHY".
Not at all. I would affirm that Christ was never 'not God' and that God cannot sin.
__________________ Freeindeed So if the Son makes you FREE, you will be FREE INDEED. Jn 8:36
So Christ has truly set us FREE. Now make sure that you stay FREE, and don’t get tied up again in slavery to the law. Gal 5:1
Not at all. I would affirm that Christ was never 'not God' and that God cannot sin.
Yes, agreed.
However Jesus was fully divine, yet fully human at the same time in the same being. While the divinity could not have sinned, the humanity was fully capable.
When Jesus was tempted, He did not use His own divine power, He relied on the power of the Father.
Hebrews 5:7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;
It was the Father who delivered Him from temptation so He did not sin, not by His own. His own human nature was fully capable of sinning. Notice the following verse.
Hebrews 5:8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
Though He was the Son of God, He had to learn obedience from the things He suffered because He didn't naturally know to obey.
__________________ John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
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