Okay, first let me say that I really don’t want to clog up your thread space here with my thoughts, but I need to talk to people who actually care about their faith and not my IRL screwball friends. So I apologize for taking up a thread to just kinda wail at stuff. I’m just looking for a bit of support or something. At least some understanding would be nice.
As you guys may or may not know, I’ve been dealing with going to graduate school. Well, grad school and the other thing I’ve been kicking around….the seminary. I know, I don’t even feel like that could be me. It’s just a really tough decision, because I don’t know what I want to do—should I teach (easy route, people do it all the time) or preach (harder, possible family ostracization)? Okay, let me break it down a little bit and give you some backstory. I’m sure Trevor doesn’t need it, haha.
I’m a history major, theology minor. I’ve been on the Dean’s List for every semester except one (I had pneumonia for a month and was hospitalized and missed A LOT of work ) and can get many good letters of recommendation, so I’m not too worried about getting into whatever school I want to. I’ve also been a sometime Sunday School teacher (2 years), very close to the other pastors in my church (it made my ex freak b/c how many pastors I had as friends on Facebook, lol), and last summer I did an internship as an assistant student ministries pastor. I love to help, to serve, to love, to guide. I’m also a “people person” if that means anything. I’ve had many people at my church encourage me in my work in the ministry.
But there’s definite drawbacks if I become a pastor. First of which is my father. He’s about the most stubborn person I’ve ever met. Whenever we have phone conversations it always turns into a screaming match and near-physical altercations. He’s beaten me numerous times (when I was younger, of course) for simply wanting to go to church at all. It’s either going with the family or it’s nothing at all. I can’t do that church that he does….it’s the most droll thing I’ve ever experienced. He has never supported me going to church (with our Wesleyan people ), and this would only infuriate him enough to not help me out with tuition (which will probably be a lot) and never talk to me again. I also have my doubts at being a pastor….I’m not as holy as those guys are. Sure I got the talent to do what I do better than a lot of those guys out there, but it’s one little scandal and you’re done. I’m a pretty holy person, but that is like…I can’t do that I don’t think. People mess up, myself included. Idk, it’s something that bothers me. That’s why I have a backup.
I’m not exactly teacher material, but I’m good at history and I can get concepts across pretty easily. And there would be A LOT less scrutiny about my life, and I could just do what I wanted. I would certainly be a “personality” teacher, I can tell you that right now. I’m good at history and I’m good at helping people with their spiritual journeys. When I help others at church with their problems is one of the fewish times I feel the hand of God guiding me along, and telling me what to say, what to do, etc.
But the question is am I called? I don’t know if I’m truly called…..and could I deal with having my family hate me and be a castoff like my idiot cousin who’s the butt of everyone’s jokes? Is my calling that strong? I only got one chance…if it isn’t right for me, I’m screwed. I wish I knew, but God doesn’t seem to be helping me out in the picking process.
So yeah, I’m torn…..I’m broken () and I don’t know what to do. Except for pulling out my hair in not knowing, lol.
__________________ "When I speak, I don’t speak as a Democrat, or a Republican... I speak as a victim of America’s so-called democracy. You and I have never seen democracy; all we’ve seen is hypocrisy. When we open our eyes today and look around America, we see America not through the eyes of someone who have — who has enjoyed the fruits of Americanism, we see America through the eyes of someone who has been the victim of Americanism. We don’t see any American dream; we’ve experienced only the American nightmare. We haven’t benefited from America’s democracy; we’ve only suffered from America’s hypocrisy. And the generation that’s coming up now can see it and are not afraid to say it."
--Malcolm X
"Wherever Law ends, Tyranny begins."
--John Locke
"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."
--Lord Acton ------------------------
ESTJ
Wow! Alot of stuff going on in your head about now. My take on it is if you have serious doubts about being called to ministry then maybe you aren't called. But if you are, the pull will not go away.
Since you seem to have a knack for helping people unofficially, maybe you should be a counselor (sp?). You could also be a teacher or tutorer in history.
If at some point in the near or far future you feel called again to ministry you may be more ready to answer yes. If it is what God needs you to do you will do it sooner or later.
__________________ "If you keep on biting and devouring each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other." Galations 5:15
"...a vice does not lose its nature, though it becomes ever so fashionable" -John Wesley
"To study too much in retreat can become an inexcusable indulgence. It behooves us to share what we have learned, to practice in administering to others what we have gathered from our experience with books" -the Brother Superior of the Glauxian Brothers of the Northern Kingdoms
Wow! Alot of stuff going on in your head about now. My take on it is if you have serious doubts about being called to ministry then maybe you aren't called. But if you are, the pull will not go away.
Since you seem to have a knack for helping people unofficially, maybe you should be a counselor (sp?). You could also be a teacher or tutorer in history.
If at some point in the near or far future you feel called again to ministry you may be more ready to answer yes. If it is what God needs you to do you will do it sooner or later.
I've been having these feelings for a couple years now....but maybe you have a point.
I would never be a counselor though: the pay is pretty terrible. Teachers here get paid a somewhat decent wage, so I kinda had that in the back of my mind. I've been helping out people without a title forever, and I'm kinda tired of helping everyone and I don't even get any sort of recognition for what I do. Why should I serve others and keep getting stepped on the whole time?
Please forgive me...I'm a bit bitter today, so don't mind me all that much.
__________________ "When I speak, I don’t speak as a Democrat, or a Republican... I speak as a victim of America’s so-called democracy. You and I have never seen democracy; all we’ve seen is hypocrisy. When we open our eyes today and look around America, we see America not through the eyes of someone who have — who has enjoyed the fruits of Americanism, we see America through the eyes of someone who has been the victim of Americanism. We don’t see any American dream; we’ve experienced only the American nightmare. We haven’t benefited from America’s democracy; we’ve only suffered from America’s hypocrisy. And the generation that’s coming up now can see it and are not afraid to say it."
--Malcolm X
"Wherever Law ends, Tyranny begins."
--John Locke
"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."
--Lord Acton ------------------------
ESTJ
Okay, first let me say that I really don’t want to clog up your thread space here with my thoughts, but I need to talk to people who actually care about their faith and not my IRL screwball friends. So I apologize for taking up a thread to just kinda wail at stuff. I’m just looking for a bit of support or something. At least some understanding would be nice.
It's what we're here for!
I am a former teacher, former History major, currently taking classes towards ordination in the CotN. So, I can relate. Here are my 2 cents....
Both jobs are very stressful. I quit teaching in 2000 cuz of the stress related migraines and other stress related health issues. I hear that pastoring can be stressful as well, just a different kind of stress [won't have 160 tests and or quizzes to grade each week but will have other issues]. The phrase "those who can...do, those who can't...teach" should be thrown out as teaching requires a definite gifting/calling as well. Don't know about CA standards, but in PA I had to be certified in Social Studies, not History only. So, I had to be able to teach the other subjects. And don't know about CA, but in PA social studies teachers were a dime a dozen which is why I went back to school to get certified in Spanish as well. It was my third "major" but it was what got me my job. Now, in your area, that probably won't work...but the idea is that teaching isn't a sure thing, unless you want to sub alot first.
My issue with teaching was that my health couldn't take the stress and I also got tired of the discipline issues. Classes were large - the max allowed in the room was 35...one year I had 35 kids but only 32 seats. So one kid sat at my desk, one sat at the window and I forget where the other one sat. Thankfully, no one expected me to be a coach of something....social studies teachers are often expected to be coaches...at least in PA.
I am currently taking classes towards ordination. I also have been involved in ministry as a volunteer ever since I quit teaching while I try to heal from migraines. Like you, it is not like I have heard the VOICE from heaven saying be a pastor. But it is like I feel so much more comfortable in church than any place else [in spite of the problems at my old church]. God has lead me along in this but not given me a definite destination point. I just know that I finally feel comfortable in this area than I ever did as a teacher.
As for not being holy enough, or worried about one scandal and you are out ~ I don't think people are necessarily looking for perfection from you right at the beginning. I know for me, fellow pastors that I have shared my struggles with have been understanding. They haven't expected me to act like a seasoned pastor, but rather as a pastor in training. The seminary classes you take are part of forming you into a pastor, not just to teach you better theology. Also, depending on the seminary, you can get loans and jobs to help you out. Nazarene Theological Seminary is the only one I am familiar with but it provides loans and tries to find you jobs at headquarters to help you pay your way.
I would definitely suggest getting a mentor who is a pastor to help you sort out these issues, and just guide you spiritually. Again, I am only use to the CotN, but on my district there are support systems on the district to help pastors stay on track, be accountable, be mentored and guided as they grow into the ministry. I would think the Wesleyan Church would have something similar.
I do feel for you - and as God leads me, I will pray for you.
I will be praying for you, that you find and receive clear understanding of where you belong and what path to move forward with. I know situations like this can be tough.
Hang in there. And move slowly. It's better to move slow and steady, then rushed and regretful.
On a side note, to me it sounds like you'd make a great youth pastor or youth director.
Have you spoken with any of your pastor friends, whom would know you quite well, to seek their insight and/or prayer?
I will be praying for you, that you find and receive clear understanding of where you belong and what path to move forward with. I know situations like this can be tough.
Hang in there. And move slowly. It's better to move slow and steady, then rushed and regretful.
On a side note, to me it sounds like you'd make a great youth pastor or youth director.
Have you spoken with any of your pastor friends, whom would know you quite well, to seek their insight and/or prayer?
I've been wrestling with this for about 3 years now....it's not been fun. I've gone through this over and over in my head, and finally today I talked to my dad about it and he seems like he can deal with it.
All of my pastor friends/people in leadership at my church love that I want to do this, and are praying for me and supporting me in getting my studies done. My friends even think that I'm doing something that is good (one of them came up to me this summer and told me "dude, you can't be a pastor.....you're too cool to be a pastor!" It still makes me smile. ). It's just some other people, like my dad and a few friends that don't know me so well, they don't think it's a good idea (for a variety of different reasons). I always pay attention more to those who hate me than those who love me, to try and do better....but I guess I can't please everybody.
I'm still rather lost, but I'm feeling more and more compelled to go in this direction. I think. That's the problem about vocations....you don't get a voice from God, you get a LOT of little nudges scattered about.
__________________ "When I speak, I don’t speak as a Democrat, or a Republican... I speak as a victim of America’s so-called democracy. You and I have never seen democracy; all we’ve seen is hypocrisy. When we open our eyes today and look around America, we see America not through the eyes of someone who have — who has enjoyed the fruits of Americanism, we see America through the eyes of someone who has been the victim of Americanism. We don’t see any American dream; we’ve experienced only the American nightmare. We haven’t benefited from America’s democracy; we’ve only suffered from America’s hypocrisy. And the generation that’s coming up now can see it and are not afraid to say it."
--Malcolm X
"Wherever Law ends, Tyranny begins."
--John Locke
"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."
--Lord Acton ------------------------
ESTJ
I read on one of the other threads that you've talked about this with your mom and she is happy for you. That's good, because even if your dad doesn't end up happy, you know that you can make your choice that YOU need to make and it won't mean ostracisim from the family. Maybe a little tenseness at first, but everyone will come around to at least tacit acceptance even if it is never outright encouragement. And really, while encouragement would be nice, that isn't the biggest question as to whether or not you should pursue seminary and eventually pastoring a church.
The question of calling on the other hand is a big one. What I would like you to think about is that you have to settle the question of calling regardless what you do. As a person of faith, I believe that God calls all of us into ministry in life. For some of us it is the pastoral ministry. But others are called into a variety of other ministries from feeding the homeless to teaching in schools to driving a truck and being a witness for Christ whereever it is that God sends us.
So, here is what helped me when I was facing similar decisions years ago. I asked myself, given that there are 24 hours in every day and 168 hours in every week, what would I most want to do with my time if I didn't have to worry about how I was going to make ends meet. I wasn't talking about what job or profession I would do, just what did I want to spend my time doing. And the answer came back to me so clearly -- telling other people about Jesus and especially helping youth to grow in their faith. When I thought about what sort of profession I could find that would allow me to do that, what came to my mind then was the ministry. Now, honestly, today I can see how I could do that in a number of other settings as well because I don't really spend all of my time telling people about Jesus. In fact, I spend a lot of my time holding people's hands who already know about Jesus and just need some reassurance. I also spend a lot of time in meetings where we plan for ways that others are going to share the good news of Jesus with the world. But still, I know that I am right where God wants me because when I attend the ordination of another pastor it, every time, takes me right back to the days in which I first felt God's call on my life to be a pastor and cofirms that this is where God wants me all over again.
I can't tell you want process you need to go through to find this answer in your life. Maybe what I did would speak to you. Maybe something else will. But whether you should teach or preach or something else entirely is something that I believe you should seek to discern by discerning where it is that God would employ you if you were totally at his disposal. Because, as followers of Christ, at his disposal is where I believe we are supposed to be.
I’m just looking for a bit of support or something. At least some understanding would be nice.
), and this would only infuriate him enough to not help me out with tuition (which will probably be a lot) and never talk to me again. I also have my doubts at being a pastor….I’m not as holy as those guys are. Sure I got the talent to do what I do better than a lot of those guys out there, but it’s one little scandal and you’re done. I’m a pretty holy person, but that is like…I can’t do that I don’t think. People mess up, myself included. Idk, it’s something that bothers me. That’s why I have a backup.
). It's just some other people, like my dad and a few friends that don't know me so well, they don't think it's a good idea (for a variety of different reasons). I always pay attention more to those who hate me than those who love me, to try and do better....but I guess I can't please everybody.
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