God doesn't count Christ's righteousness to us, He counts faith as righteousness.
i see where you are coming from, but remember, our righteousness is no righteousness at all apart from the perfection of Christ' righteousness encompassing us. When you first reach out in faith to God through Christ, God gives you the righteousness of Christ. In other words, He clothes you in His own righteousness. From that moment and throughout eternity, whenever God looks at you, He sees the righteousness of Jesus Christ. 2 Corinthians 5:21 says, “He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.” Theologians call that imputed righteousness. God doesn’t see our transgression as we stand clothed in Christ’s righteousness.
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“Saving Faith lives in a broken heart. Always grows in a heart humbled for sin, in a weeping eye and a tearful conscience"
i see where you are coming from, but remember, our righteousness is no righteousness at all apart from the perfection of Christ' righteousness encompassing us. When you first reach out in faith to God through Christ, God gives you the righteousness of Christ.
He doesn't give you the Righteousness of Christ, He gives you the Spirit of Jesus.
You can do with Him what you will;
Quench Him, grieve Him or abide in Him.
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Can the will at the same time make opposite choices? Can it choose the highest good of being as an ultimate end, and at the same time choose any other ultimate end, or make any choices whatever inconsistent with this ultimate choice?
He doesn't give you the Righteousness of Christ, He gives you the Spirit of Jesus.
Hm. Is the Spirit righteous? And is He ours?
that I may gain Christ, and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith Pp 3:9
He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him. 2 Cor 5:21
But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption 1 Cor 1:30
Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, is never to die again; death no longer is master over Him. For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Rom 6:8-11
__________________ "... not an unconcerned sitting of God in heaven, from which He merely observes the things that are done in the world; but that all-active and all-concerned seatedness on His throne above, by which He governs the world which He Himself hath made." John Calvin
To us, O LORD, belongs open shame, to our kings, to our princes, and to our fathers, because we have sinned against you.
How do you know the righteousness of Christ is not given?
Righteousness is a character trait, and God is now in the process of perfecting our characters for Heaven.
Characters that were twisted at one time, persons who used to submit to sin and ever increasing wickedness.
Characters that were damaged by chosing sin over God that can now be in the process of healing by turning to Christ in God for Righteousness.
Acts 10:33-35
Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
Originally Posted by Tzaousios
How does one "quench" the Holy Spirit (I am assuming that us what you mean by "the Spirit of Jesus")?
1 John 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 2:6
He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.
1 John 2:28
And now, little children, abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and notbe ashamed before him at his coming.
1 John 3:5
And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
1 John 4:13
hereby we know that we abide in him and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.
Originally Posted by heymikey80
Hm. Is the Spirit righteous? And is He ours?
that I may gain Christ, and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith Pp 3:9
He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him. 2 Cor 5:21
But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption 1 Cor 1:30
Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, is never to die again; death no longer is master over Him. For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Rom 6:8-11
Galatians 2:16-21 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
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Can the will at the same time make opposite choices? Can it choose the highest good of being as an ultimate end, and at the same time choose any other ultimate end, or make any choices whatever inconsistent with this ultimate choice?
Righteousness is a character trait, and God is now in the process of perfecting our characters for Heaven.
Characters that were twisted at one time, characters who used to submit to sin and ever increasing wickedness.
Characters that were damaged by chosing sin over God.
1 John 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 2:6
He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.
1 John 2:28
And now, little children, abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and notbe ashamed before him at his coming.
1 John 3:5
And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
1 John 4:13
hereby we know that we abide in him and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.
Honestly, I fail to see how any of these verses say that God does not apply the righteousness of Christ to believers and that the Holy Spirit can be quenched.
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I don't mean to debate the theoretical possibility of attaining a state in which one no longer sins or discount that others may have attained this state by saying this... but... I believe we should always consider ourselves the "first among sinners" to maintain a sense of humility before God and to avoid spiritual pride. To tell other people that we are "pretty close to being sinless" could be very dangerous to our humility and puff one up don't you think?
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"Only love overcomes the fragmentation of human nature."
St Maximus the Confessor
"For one who loves transforms all that he loves into himself, while one who hates loses even what he has. One who loves belongs to the loved one while one who hates does not even belong to himself. "
Honestly, I fail to see how any of these verses say that God does not apply the righteousness of Christ to believers and that the Holy Spirit can be quenched.
Ezekiel 18:24
"But if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits sin and does the same detestable things the wicked man does, will he live? None of the righteous things he has done will be remembered. Because of the unfaithfulness he is guilty of and because of the sins he has committed, he will die.
Originally Posted by Christos Anesti
LST 1154,
I don't mean to debate the theoretical possibility of attaining a state in which one no longer sins or discount that others may have attained this state by saying this... but... I believe we should always consider ourselves the "first among sinners" to maintain a sense of humility before God and to avoid spiritual pride. To tell other people that we are "pretty close to being sinless" could be very dangerous to our humility and puff one up don't you think?
Humility is not that of being found a sinner, it is a state of being, a willful choice to humble yoursef before the Allmighty, that He may sustain you.
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Can the will at the same time make opposite choices? Can it choose the highest good of being as an ultimate end, and at the same time choose any other ultimate end, or make any choices whatever inconsistent with this ultimate choice?
If Paul believed God ignored his sins and only saw Christ's perfect righteousness in him, Paul would not have said:
Philippians 3:12 Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already been made perfect, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me.
Nor would John have said:
1 John 3:2-3 Beloved, we are God's children now; it does not yet appear what we shall be, but we know that when He appears we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. And every one who thus hopes in Him purifies himself as He is pure.
If God only sees Christ's righteousness after justification, there would be no "what we shall be" nor would any child of God need to purify himself any further.
I wasn't talking about God finding us to be a sinner. I was talking about how we view ourselves . Even the great Saint Paul called himself "chief among sinners"(1 Timothy 1:15).
In the Divine Liturgy of my Church we pray before communion : " I believe, O Lord, and I confess that Thou art truly the Christ, the Son of the Living God, Who camest into the world to save sinners, of whom I am first."
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To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. love is the fulfillment of the law. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.
"Only love overcomes the fragmentation of human nature."
St Maximus the Confessor
"For one who loves transforms all that he loves into himself, while one who hates loses even what he has. One who loves belongs to the loved one while one who hates does not even belong to himself. "
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