But I don't understand why he is being looked to as the final authority on this or any issue. It is quite possible that Graham didn't have all the facts in regards to Finney.
I don't know. I do understand that he has a place of honor in the Billy Graham Center. I would expect nothing less than strict integrity from Billy Graham, and suspect that with his international standing and exposure whatever the info about Charles Finney would have been brought to his attention. but that is IMO.
Let's face it - based on what has been presented here in regards to Finney's teachings it can honestly be said that he led no one to a saving faith in Christ but to something completely different that is not the gospel.
And that is the key--'what has been presented here.' What has been presented here are snippets from both sides, and I long ago discovered the importance of reading the entire document or treatise. As it is said, there are always two sides. But I really don't feel driven to do so in this case, it is not that big a thing to me personally. I do, however, have an interest in fairplay.
Also - Graham taught the security of the believer - yet you don't agree on that. So why give credence to what he says about Finney but not this?
There are some things taught by a variety of Christian teachers which I do not agree with. There is wide disagreement between Christian teachers themselves on such matters. But God can use them all to accomplish good. I believe God works through a wide variety of teachers and believers, even though their knowledge may not be complete or correct in every detail. God will no doubt continue to guide them to a clearer understanding of Bible truth, whatever the issue may be.
__________________ "Study to show yourself approved unto God, a good workman who needs not be ashamed, rightly dividing the Word of truth." 2 Timothy 2:15
I don't know. I do understand that he has a place of honor in the Billy Graham Center. I would expect nothing less than strict integrity from Billy Graham, and suspect that with his international standing and exposure whatever the info about Charles Finney would have been brought to his attention. but that is IMO.
And that is the key--'what has been presented here.' What has been presented here are snippets from both sides, and I long ago discovered the importance of reading the entire document or treatise. As it is said, there are always two sides. But I really don't feel driven to do so in this case, it is not that big a thing to me personally. I do, however, have an interest in fairplay.
There are some things taught by a variety of Christian teachers which I do not agree with. There is wide disagreement between Christian teachers themselves on such matters. But God can use them all to accomplish good. I believe God works through a wide variety of teachers and believers, even though their knowledge may not be complete or correct in every detail. God will no doubt continue to guide them to a clearer understanding of Bible truth, whatever the issue may be.
Fairplay? Could have fooled me. There is enough documentation posted on Finney's erroneous teachings on this thread to fill up a novel. Hardly what I would call snipets. Rather than taking an honest look at them you say the guy is alright because Billy Graham says he's alright.
So how about Charles Spurgeon - one of the great Calvinist preachers of the 1800's. Billy Graham had a lot of good things to say about him as well. Since Billy Graham endorsed him does he get your nod of approval too?
Fairplay? Could have fooled me. There is enough documentation posted on Finney's erroneous teachings on this thread to fill up a novel. Hardly what I would call snipets.
To draw small quotes from here and there is not linking to the entire document. If someone were to do that, then it could be studied as a whole.
Rather than taking an honest look at them you say the guy is alright because Billy Graham says he's alright.
Rather than reach a conclusion based on selected quotes, I would reserve judgment until being able to examine the treatise as a whole. But if Billy Graham speaks favorably, that certainly does have some weight IMO.
So how about Charles Spurgeon - one of the great Calvinist preachers of the 1800's. Billy Graham had a lot of good things to say about him as well. Since Billy Graham endorsed him does he get your nod of approval too?
Indeed, Spurgeon without doubt had many inspiring and helpful thoughts to share. On these threads, I would raise questions if he or Finney or any other commentator were to be cited as a doctrinal authority or evidence of Bible truth.
__________________ "Study to show yourself approved unto God, a good workman who needs not be ashamed, rightly dividing the Word of truth." 2 Timothy 2:15
Last edited by archierieus; 18th September 2009 at 12:40 PM.
This is pathetic!!!! It is amazing how people ridicule others and act like they are the final word of God interpreters. I have seen almost no calvinist here to show Christ like love. All I see is hatred, aggressiveness and meanness to people who don't accept their theological views of predestination or free will.
Well, you'll just have to take that up with your cohorts, because none of you will listen to us. The pathos is fairly obviously that they're posting anti-Calvinists positions, and we're defending against them.
If you have a problem with allowing for all views, then you'll really need to talk to those who are attacking Calvinism.
__________________ "... not an unconcerned sitting of God in heaven, from which He merely observes the things that are done in the world; but that all-active and all-concerned seatedness on His throne above, by which He governs the world which He Himself hath made." John Calvin
To us, O LORD, belongs open shame, to our kings, to our princes, and to our fathers, because we have sinned against you.
To draw small quotes from here and there is not linking to the entire document. If someone were to do that, then it could be studied as a whole.
... while offending copyrights. Buy yourself a copy. The citation's there.
Originally Posted by archierieus
Rather than reach a conclusion based on selected quotes, I would reserve judgment until being able to examine the treatise as a whole. But if Billy Graham speaks favorably, that certainly does have some weight IMO.
But then there's ...
Originally Posted by archierieus
Indeed, Spurgeon without doubt had many inspiring and helpful thoughts to share. On these threads, I would raise questions if he or Finney or any other commentator were to be cited as a doctrinal authority or evidence of Bible truth.
Or Billy Graham? I think the question you're raising is against your own statement.
__________________ "... not an unconcerned sitting of God in heaven, from which He merely observes the things that are done in the world; but that all-active and all-concerned seatedness on His throne above, by which He governs the world which He Himself hath made." John Calvin
To us, O LORD, belongs open shame, to our kings, to our princes, and to our fathers, because we have sinned against you.
Once saved always saved! His rod.. and His staff, they comfort me!! I may not be perfect but He is, how then does His salvation, in me, fail? I may sometimes fall.. he picks me up.. that bump on my head from that fall takes some time to mend i will admit... But God never fails and will not fail me. I think after reading this thread i will not bother to read finney. thanks Deacon Dean!
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