Only Christians, but not the only Christians

godschild583 · #1 25th August 2009, 02:31 PM

Only Christians
This much is still true as we find all authority in Christ alone.
But no the only Christians
Is this still relevant or have we moved away from this? Do we leave it up to Jesus to decide who is added to the church?

DerSchweik · #2 25th August 2009, 05:31 PM

"Where 2 or 3 are gathered in my Name, there I am also..." so I think committees, at a minimum need to do the deciding...

JUST KIDDING!

I believe and trust in what the bible says about how to become a Christian and how to live as a Christian. It's what I teach when I study the bible with people and because those people will likely end up worshipping (or visiting) the same congregation where I worship, I need to be in a congregation that won't contradict either by doctrine or practice.

I confess, I used to judge other people's salvation based on their stated doctrine when I was a young Christian. I no longer do that. Yet I think there is a lot of poor teaching being propogated amongst modern Christians these days, much of it on the very basics - i.e. Christian identity in Christ, which basically means "who is and who isn't" in the church, which is His body. I know what I believe and why. Moreover, I can justify both on the basis of strong scriptural reference and perhaps as or more important - scriptural EXAMPLE - examples most modern Christian teachings on the topic of salvation simply cannot produce.

There is a serious lack of strong bible study and knowledge in the modern church today, which makes those weak in both very vulnerable to just about any wind of doctrine a person with a semblance of charisma may wish to promote (and there are many out there, unfortunately).

Having said that, I know there are Christians out there who do not believe exactly as I do - even on the subject of salvation - people who were taught differently than I was, who are in congregations who support and promote those teachings, yet whose lives are otherwise in concert with scriptural teachings. Just as vengeance is reserved strictly for the Lord - so too is the act of judging someone's heart. Both are terrible burdens to assume and I have determined to shed myself of both. And until such a time as someone can demonstrate the contrary, I will continue to teach and promote what I believe to be the truth, what I believe God would have me teach, what I believe God desires me to teach.

ConqueredbyLove · #3 25th August 2009, 05:50 PM

Originally Posted by DerSchweik

There is a serious lack of strong bible study and knowledge in the modern church today, which makes those weak in both very vulnerable to just about any wind of doctrine a person with a semblance of charisma may wish to promote (and there are many out there, unfortunately).

I have been very blessed to be in churches where there has been strong Biblical teaching.

But even amongst those churches what I find dramatically lacking is a teaching about Christ and His ways with us, Christ and His beautiful Character, Christ, Christ, Christ....where is the teaching about.....Him???

For the most part, it is not out there. It just isn't. I have been a Christian for 31 years, been to many, many Churches and yet, even amongst the best teaching churches I often leave hungry for more of Him!

Have we enough knowledge of Him that we need not learn anymore? I think not!

I feel safe to post this here because I know nothing of the poster I quoted. I have no idea what you teach so please don't take this personally.

But just walk into any church and....listen....Is anyone talking about Christ? Not just what He has done for us but about Him? And His ways with us?

No...It is just not there.

People are still hungry for God! But, for the most part they are not being fed the Bread of Life....

DerSchweik · #4 26th August 2009, 04:25 PM

Originally Posted by ConqueredbyLove

I have been very blessed to be in churches where there has been strong Biblical teaching.

But even amongst those churches what I find dramatically lacking is a teaching about Christ and His ways with us, Christ and His beautiful Character, Christ, Christ, Christ....where is the teaching about.....Him???

For the most part, it is not out there. It just isn't. I have been a Christian for 31 years, been to many, many Churches and yet, even amongst the best teaching churches I often leave hungry for more of Him!

Have we enough knowledge of Him that we need not learn anymore? I think not!

I feel safe to post this here because I know nothing of the poster I quoted. I have no idea what you teach so please don't take this personally.

But just walk into any church and....listen....Is anyone talking about Christ? Not just what He has done for us but about Him? And His ways with us?

No...It is just not there.

People are still hungry for God! But, for the most part they are not being fed the Bread of Life....

Amen.

I'm not sure what you think I said or whether you are disagreeing or agreeing with it or not. I guess all I'd add to this is clarification by way of saying I am a firm believer that the Bible, being God's Word, that Jesus, being Himself The Word (John 1, etc.) - that the Bible is God's revelation of Himself to us. There is no way we can know Christ without knowing His Word for knowledge of Him comes via His Word.

I suspect what you may be intimating is that some churches speak too much on, and perhaps stress the more sterile, impersonal doctrinal topics almost to the complete exclusion of Him - His person, His nature, His personality, His grace and love? I wouldn't argue with that necessarily, having myself been fed with a strong diet of faith, repentence, confession, discipleship, obedience, etc. - and less on the OBJECT and PERSON of my faith - and felt starved at times as a result to know Him.

I think you suggest it's far easier (for some) to emphasize and teach Galatians 5:19 (for example) than it is I Corinthians 13 - kwim? I do agree as well that whatever the reason, people ARE hungry for God - and to the degree we're teaching legalism versus teaching Him is, I believe the degree to which we are more focused on appeasing God rather than pleasing Him. And per Hebrews 11:6, it's impossible to please Him unless we first believe He Is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him - and I would add that to seek Him, to be motivated to want to know Him, return to Him, we must first value Him - like a pearl of great price, as a treasure. Per Romans 5:10ff, we were once His enemies - NOT by virtue of His enmity for us, but BY VIRTUE OF OUR ENMITY FOR HIM (evidenced by our sinful behavior). We don't get rid of that enmity by changing our (or other's) behavior, but behavior is changed by getting rid of the enmity - and that is soley Christ's work, not ours - other than we accept it. And teaching us how to value Him and His work, I would agree, is missing from many sermons and classes these days.

In Him,

ConqueredbyLove · #5 26th August 2009, 10:22 PM

Originally Posted by DerSchweik

Amen.

I suspect what you may be intimating is that some churches speak too much on, and perhaps stress the more sterile, impersonal doctrinal topics almost to the complete exclusion of Him - His person, His nature, His personality, His grace and love? I wouldn't argue with that necessarily, having myself been fed with a strong diet of faith, repentence, confession, discipleship, obedience, etc. - and less on the OBJECT and PERSON of my faith - and felt starved at times as a result to know Him.

I think you suggest it's far easier (for some) to emphasize and teach Galatians 5:19 (for example) than it is I Corinthians 13 - kwim? I do agree as well that whatever the reason, people ARE hungry for God - and to the degree we're teaching legalism versus teaching Him is, I believe the degree to which we are more focused on appeasing God rather than pleasing Him. And per Hebrews 11:6, it's impossible to please Him unless we first believe He Is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him - and I would add that to seek Him, to be motivated to want to know Him, return to Him, we must first value Him - like a pearl of great price, as a treasure. Per Romans 5:10ff, we were once His enemies - NOT by virtue of His enmity for us, but BY VIRTUE OF OUR ENMITY FOR HIM (evidenced by our sinful behavior). We don't get rid of that enmity by changing our (or other's) behavior, but behavior is changed by getting rid of the enmity - and that is soley Christ's work, not ours - other than we accept it. And teaching us how to value Him and His work, I would agree, is missing from many sermons and classes these days.

In Him,

You do understand what I was trying to communicate and I thank you so for reading and responding.

The churches I have attended the most during my journey have been very strong in teaching the Word of God. That has been their "distinctive" if I may call it that. And I have learned so much and been blessed more than most in that I have sat under some great teachers. I will forever be grateful for the grace gift of these men.

But is that what we are to be placing our emphasis on? It is a very seemingly small twist to go from teaching the Word of God instead of teaching about the God of the Word...

As you obviously know, all Scripture should point to Him. And, if in our teaching/preaching we are not pointing people to Him then, IMHO we have missed it.

Also, where is the teaching from the pulpit about how to develop a closer relationship with the One Who loves us so? We say that Christianity is about a personal relationship with God, but why aren't the Pastors teaching about how to deepen that relationship with the Lord?

I don't know why I am telling you all these concerns...I guess it has been bottled up in me for so long and the topic of this folder lends me to open up....

Thanks for reading

ModestGirlsRock · #6 30th August 2009, 07:27 PM

I've been taught about The Word and God Himself. Blessed me :-)
I was actually discussing this with someone I met on my college campus last night. I told him simply this...Read the Word, Believe the Word, Obey the Word. It's Truth. Those who know the Truth and do not follow it aren't going to be a part of the kingdom. Jesus said it was only through Him are we saved, He is our Gospel aka Good News. Is He not our Truth?

ProfessorJ · #7 27th November 2009, 01:16 AM

I like to think we've moved away from that. Personally, I say "whosoever believes in him shall have everlasting life." Most of the things that split churches aren't salvation issues, it's stuff like instrumental music or one cup communion. If God will bar me from Heaven because of having a piano or guitar in my worship, I'd say there's a lot of other, more important things that are actually keeping me out.

HisLittleHazelnut · #8 2nd January 2010, 03:47 AM

My husband grew up in a coC and a family that strongly believed that only people in coC were going to be saved. I grew up in a coC that said that only those who practiced their kind of worship service (mutual edification coC, look it up) were going to be saved, because having a paid minister was unscriptural.

Needless to say, we eschewed coC. We haven't found our place yet (and we're in the process of moving) so I don't know what we'll end up, besides Christians.

Tammy · #9 2nd January 2010, 06:40 AM

Originally Posted by ConqueredbyLove

I have been very blessed to be in churches where there has been strong Biblical teaching.

But even amongst those churches what I find dramatically lacking is a teaching about Christ and His ways with us, Christ and His beautiful Character, Christ, Christ, Christ....where is the teaching about.....Him???

For the most part, it is not out there. It just isn't. I have been a Christian for 31 years, been to many, many Churches and yet, even amongst the best teaching churches I often leave hungry for more of Him!

Have we enough knowledge of Him that we need not learn anymore? I think not!

I feel safe to post this here because I know nothing of the poster I quoted. I have no idea what you teach so please don't take this personally.

But just walk into any church and....listen....Is anyone talking about Christ? Not just what He has done for us but about Him? And His ways with us?

No...It is just not there.

People are still hungry for God! But, for the most part they are not being fed the Bread of Life....

I agree with you....I have read a book, called, "The Desire of the Ages", it is the BEST book on the life of Christ that I've ever read....My husand, years ago, before we were married, someone gave him this book, and he read it. He was in the world, deep in the world, and he said when he read the book, it was like reading a love story....and it helped him so much, to come to know and love Jesus. We buy this book by the case now...if you would like a copy, let me know and I'll gladly send it for free.

Happy New Year!
Tammy