We were created to bring glory to God (Romans 11:36, 1 Cor. 10:31) and to fully enjoy Him forever (Psalm 73:24-28, John 17:21-23).
AMR
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(a.k.a., Patrick)
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TNARS Faculty Mentor Reformed Theology Institute Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips
If you had to answer in a questionnaire what God created us for, which would you say?
1) To have a personal one-on-one relationship with Him.
2) To have a collective relationship with Him through loving people.
3) Both.
4) Other (all replies welcome.)
IMO, the whole question needs reframing. One needs to ask first what God's purpose is for all creation, and then think about how we fit within that collectively, and finally how we fit within that individually. Starting with the individual is very tempting in our highly individualised culture, but completely upsidedown.
__________________ Goodness is stronger than evil,
love is stronger than hate,
light is stronger than darkness,
life is stronger than death,
victory is ours through him who loved us.
(++Desmond Tutu)
IMO, the whole question needs reframing. One needs to ask first what God's purpose is for all creation, and then think about how we fit within that collectively, and finally how we fit within that individually. Starting with the individual is very tempting in our highly individualised culture, but completely upsidedown.
I'll think about trying to re-do this question.
But, I'm mostly looking for answers as to whether the majority think our relationship with God is mostly individual or our relationship with God is mostly collective. (This thread is directed at the word "relationship".)
Let me ask you a question though Ebia, how can one have a relationship with God if it doesn't start with the individual?
But, I'm mostly looking for answers as to whether the majority think our relationship with God is mostly individual or our relationship with God is mostly collective. (This thread is directed at the word "relationship".)
Let me ask you a question though Ebia, how can one have a relationship with God if it doesn't start with the individual?
Why start one's thinking with the individual except for the modern western world's cultural bias?
__________________ Goodness is stronger than evil,
love is stronger than hate,
light is stronger than darkness,
life is stronger than death,
victory is ours through him who loved us.
(++Desmond Tutu)
Dear one11. When God created, put order into chaos, He also made Man in His image. Nothing in this Universe is quite like us, we are capable of great love, of knowing right from wrong, and also be tempted to do wrong. God created us because He loves,us and He wants to live with us for eternity. God made us Good, but sadly we had to learn tosay NO to Temptation. We are on Earth to learn to love God our Heavenly Father, with heart, soul, and mind. We also have to learn to love our fellow-men and fellow-women, as we love ourselves, or put it more easily to understand: we must learn to treat friend and foe, as we like to be treated ourselves. We are on Earth to learn to become worthy of living with our Heavenly Father and our brothers and sisters, in selfless Love, compassion and forgiveness. Our original home is in God`s House with many mansion. Jesus promised His disciples that He was going to prepare a place in God`s House for us, He is our Saviour and the Way back to God. The short answere to your question, one11, God created us to live with Him for all eternity. We are on Earth to learn to love selflessly and forgive, as God has forgiven us. I say this humbly and with love. Greetings from Emmy, sister in Christ.
Wouldn't a cultural bias lean towards the collective rather than the individual though?
Not necessarly, no. The extreme emphasis on the individual is a peculiarity of your (and my) culture.
__________________ Goodness is stronger than evil,
love is stronger than hate,
light is stronger than darkness,
life is stronger than death,
victory is ours through him who loved us.
(++Desmond Tutu)
Good question. I hadn't thought about it before. I'm going to go with your revised question about whether I think our relationship with God was intended to be individual or collective.
I guess I would say it's collective or a combination of both. The Bible preaches to love thy neighbor and the examples Jesus left us from His stay here on earth demonstrate care and concern for others and reaching out to others.
There's also the argument that if you have a personal relationship with God, then you would also have a collective one because if you are truly following Him, then it would show in your actions and the way you treat others as like I said above, the Bible calls us to serve and love.
__________________
"At least one-third of the Bible is poetry ... For example, the creation acounts of Genesis are liturgical poetry, not history or science. What is literal about poetry is that God did it, and because God created, the creation has meaning. When we insist, as some do, that the creation account be turned into a science of the origins of the world, we lose the heart and soul of the poetic message and turn a liberating imaginative poem into a dry intellectual fact that must be affirmed scientifically. This deadens truth."
~Robert Webber in "Ancient Future Worship"
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God created us because, being omniscient, He knew that loving us would best express His nature. But it's a two way traffic. His nature is best expressed in loving creatures that are themselves capable of love - love of Him, and love of each other. Really, the whole of creation should be a rather sickening love-fest of the type hippies thought they had invented. Fortunately, God had the sense to create evil also, which makes the whole life experience thing sufficiently challenging to stop us getting bored, or mistaking sentimentality for the real mccoy.
Best, 2ndRateMind.
PS. Your options are close to the truth, one11, as I perceive it, but in the end I plumped for 4, other.
__________________ Philosophy is questions that may never be answered: Religion is answers that may never be questioned.
Anon, quoted in 'Breaking the Spell', by Daniel Dennet.
Last edited by 2ndRateMind; 9th August 2009 at 04:27 PM.
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