the American 2 Party System

Call me a cynic but when it comes right down to it, i dont see a bit of differance between the republican and democratic parties, with the possible exception of abortion

Both head us toward centralization, strengthing the federal reserve, moving us toward a north american union AND a new world order.

They both increase the size of the government and its power, they both have militarized our police forces, both have passed legislation trashing our constitution...

I have a theory though... its the same money from corporations and banks that fund both sides... these people are NOT working an agenda fit to benefit Americans, they are working agendas benefitting their corporate benefactors.

We need to get the corporate money back out of the election system

Originally Posted by WolfBitnGodSmittn

I have a theory though... its the same money from corporations and banks that fund both sides... these people are NOT working an agenda fit to benefit Americans, they are working agendas benefitting their corporate benefactors.

We need to get the corporate money back out of the election system

How would you suggest removing the corporate money, bearing in mind that any legislation to do so would have to be passed by a Congress made up of Republicans and Democrats dependent on said corporate money? And could that be done without infringing on the First Amendment? IMO all federal campaign financing plans have basically amounted to incumbent protection plans.

We have recently had a couple threads on the proposition that conservative Christians should support the Libertarian Party. That works for me, but I'm biased, having been an LP member since 1972, the first year I was old enough to vote,

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Good stuff there for real...

I am not much for parties, but i do define myself by political definition. By this i mean that im not a member of a party but i am a conservative libertarian constitutionalist. By this i mean that im hard core set on the US constitution, and i see no need to amend it or disregard it by way of new legislation like the patriot act. I believe in the liberty and soveriegnty of the individual, the home, the city, then the state. I dont believe in a strong centralized government because this makes it too easy to buy out our government

You ask some great questions too

Youre right, everything is controlled by congress and the senate, and the oval office. HOW do we get corporate money out of the mix, and is it even constitutional?

I believe in keeping with the spirit of the constitution, we must come to the conclusion that the founding fathers WOULD NEVER have sanctioned a government ruled by corporation... this by the way, is exactly what fascism is... a joint partnership between government and large corporations.

The founders of this nation secured for us a system that allowed OUR VOICE to be heard... not the voices of the rich and powerful who would usurp international power over us.

So yes i believe its very constitutional... as is the little man has no say.

A good case in point is Ron Paul... former libertarian turned republican, he's one of he very very few there who are actually trying to represent us and save the constitution. He was running for pres in 08. In the very first republican debate, they tried to embarrass him with senseless questions but Paul put on a good show, standing strong, coming against the infringement on our rights, the wat in iraq and all other foerign entanglements. The abolishment of the federal reserve and the irs. At the end of the debate the audience was polled and Ron Paul won the debate, by popular vote, by a large margin. He also set a record for the most money raised in a day, but this didnt come from corporations, this came from american citizens... individual supporters.

The candidates and the media excluded Ron Paul from participating in every debate thereafter

My point is they only give us 2 choices and these choices are bought and paid for... they are serving the people who put them there.

The first step in correcting this is to create public awareness.

The second step is to use that public awareness, to build public support

3, use the public support to build public pressure

We need to elect a president who will stand against the flow and do the things neccessary to restore us to our former strength, which is the individual, not policing the world as well as our own citizens. Then we need to put public pressure on ALL our representatives, demanding they step down for breaching their contract if they dont represent the desires of the people in their votes to eliminate corporate money form the system... will we DO IT? ehh i have my doubts because i believe in the modern day laziness and sleep of the average american, BUT... i still have hope... at least in allowing individuals to see whats going on around them

but even if it were a losing battle, its a worthy one to fight and one that should nt remain UNfaught.

Public awareness, and work toward raising up someone who will actually work for us

Good points in this thread. And I agree. Personally....I think the agenda goes much deeper than simply individual corporate interests though.

I would like to add another important point for consideration....

....appointments to the Supreme Court.

IMHO....that is where the rubber hits the road regarding our Constitution.

And public awareness.......sadly we're being spoon fed by the shovel full biased info....there is no such thing as "reporting" the news any more...it's all geared toward telling us what we should think according to said agenda.

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Joh 16:33 These things I have spoken to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world."











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<--I take myself very seriously...

Although I certainly don't agree with the republican party on many issues I can't agree with your statement either. Perhaps you should look a little closer.

Dems Anti-family
Anti-God (despite what some may say)
Pro government
Pro taxation to the detriment of the people
Pro government hand outs (our money)
Pro homosexual
And shoving an agenda down the throats of the people that most do not want.

Sealacamp

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John 15:5 “Yes, I am the vine; you are the branches. Those who remain in me, and I in them, will produce much fruit. For apart from me you can do nothing."

Exactly! The Democrats are all of those things and quite frankly, it is disgusting.

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let me show you why i disagree


The republicans arent doing a thing for families. Republicans instituted the patriot act which trample on the rights of the individual, the family and the home.

I dont see the republicans as PRO God except for a small faction and i submit this same faciton exists in the dem party, for instance, dennis kucinich... 8 years of republican rule has dont nothing to remove the stiflings on the individual and how he may conduct his religion


under the bush administration, the government became larger and more powerful than it ever was in its history

read my lips, no new taxes ...Bush sr did this right before he raised them... Republican, and bush squandered our living on a war that only profited corporations
[quotePro government hand outs (our money)[/quote]

bailouts, need i say more? Id frankly prefer a socialism that profits the people, not corporate socioalism that breaks our backs to feed the corps.

bush had a homosexual stripper at the white house on several occasions as an overnight guest. He also allowed the folly of the courts in california to legalize gay marriage.

the iraqi war...


So you see my friend you only serve to make my point... theres no differance at all with the possible exception of abottion and even thats questionable

Not arguing--commenting on the political process.

If you want a political party to have any success, you have to be willing to do the work on the ground at the lowest level of elected offices for a long time. You can't start at the top with Congress and the President. You have to start at the bottom with city councils and county boards.

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There are many differences between the two parties. But apparently, someone has allowed the eight years of mainstream media attacks against the Republicans to cause him to not see the differences between the two major parties. Now, I will admit that the Republican party is not as conservative as I want it to be, and I will admit that they made mistakes from 2000 to 2008.
However, all one has to do to start seeing the differences is look at Obama, Pelosi, Reid, and the rest of the far-left wing liberal leaders of the Democrat party. Thanks to them, America is on the March to Socialism. In my opinion, only the most jaded or skeptical of conservatives and liberatarians can say America was on the March to Socialism under the Republican years of 2001 through 2006.

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"If you were the only one needing Salvation from Sin, Jesus still would have died for your salvation."

Well i can assure you that a few years in service to my country in the field of military intelligence, serving my time in central america in the early 80's, a conservative ALL my life, and a republican for a good portion of my life, i can assure you im quite impervious to media attack.

I WOULD though offer that if one still believes the conservative party is even remotely within the realms of conservatism, they themselves may be victim to media manipulation. Let me lay this out for you

What is a conservative?

NOUN:

1)The inclination, especially in politics, to maintain the existing or traditional order.
2)A political philosophy or attitude emphasizing respect for traditional institutions, distrust of government activism, and opposition to sudden change in the established order.
3)Conservatism The principles and policies of the Conservative Party in the United Kingdom or of the Progressive Conservative Party in Canada.
Caution or moderation, as in behavior or outlook.
By definition a conservative should seek to preserve or maintain a traditional order, therefore a 'conservative party' should be a party seeking to maintain and protect an original status quo.

What WERE the concepts that founded this nation?

1) a small central, or federal government.

a. no leveraging the states, bullying or bribing. each state was pretty much soverign

b. the NSA FBI BATF HOMELAND SECURITY etc, ALL UNNECCESSARY, oppressive to the state, and add to the size and scope and power of the central federal govt

2) NONintervention in foreign affairs

a. foreign aid... no, this takes from the citizen. This is where charities came in, they would fill the need for foreign aid and historicly americans were quite generous. It is NOT up to the federal government to tell us we HAVE to give to this or that nation, but rather this is a thing of individual conscience

b. policing affairs of other nations of the world... no... none of our business and WAY too expensive, sucking our economy dry. let other nations police themselves. if the citizens are oppressed, let them rise up and win their freedom as we did.

c. pre-emptive war... definately out

d. forget nation building abroad

e. George Washington encouraged that the ONLY way we entangle ourselves is by allowing importing and exporting, with high import tarrifs, seeking the best deals to secure american profits for the little man...

3) NO CREDIT if at all possible... back in the day credit was almost regarded as sin... it was a shame to go into debt. We lived according to our means and actually worked and saved to get what was wanted. The conservative party now obviously has turned this conservative concept on its head. We are paying the price for it now and will pay a much larger price in the future


Actually the federal govt had ONE purpose and ONLY one in a nutshell... PROTECT the inalienable rights of EVERY American citizen equally, that God Himself granted to every man on earth

Conservatism is dead in the so called conservative party. The conservative party has been hijacked by a faction within it who call themselves "Neocons" If you dont know about this group you should read their philosophy... check out pnac or project for a new american century. PNAC is a neocon organization. Neoconservatives include Both president Bush's, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Ollie North and more.

They are a war mongering faction of the conservative party and theres not a single thing conservative about them, and they have hijacked the party and its agendas

They are the ANTITHISIS of conservative