No. There is no change of forum access across the board nor do I think that the owner's site vision supports such a change if suggested.
It is now, for all intents and purposes, as far as I'm concerned, with one or two minor exceptions. There is no forum where Christians and non-believers can have frank discussions regarding Theology and Apologetics. Do not direct me to Exploring Christianity - that was designed as a shooting gallery aimed at conversion, not a place for discussion, and does not attract the Christian scholars who used to post in GA, and who had a great deal of knowledge to share.
No. There is no change of forum access across the board nor do I think that the owner's site vision supports such a change if suggested.
What suggestions would you provide, then?
The same suggestions I have been making here and there since GA was destroyed: there is a strong desire among both Christians and agnostics/atheists for some place where we can discuss theology and apologetics and Christian history on a relatively even footing. Provide one.
There is a kneejerk reaction on the part of some that 'most atheists/agnostics just want to bash Christians/Christianity'. That is false. A good many of us are genuinely interested in religion. By that I do not mean we are interested in converting to Christianity, though that has happened and may happen. I mean that unbelievers like myself are a tiny minority compared to the number of believers in the world and as such would like to understand what it is that, in this case, Christians, experience that causes them to believe, how beliefs have changed, how different groups interpret scripture, and so on.
There are plenty Christians who are members of CF who would welcome the opportunity to converse with us on those forbidden subjects. There is no need to open the current CO areas to agnostics/atheists. Just provide one place where we can talk. One place where an errant question about the whys and hows and whens of Christianity is not deleted because it is 'apologetics and cannot be discussed'. Society has actually had to place an ALL CAPS warning on the front page to remind people not to talk about apologetics. This is beyond absurd.
CF lost members who were educated and knowledgeable Christian scholars because of this peculiar method of 'protecting' vulnerable Christians. I would argue other areas of the board are far more likely to disturb beliefs than a frank discussion of the actual subject of belief.
I ask that you at least consider this carefully, without prejudice over the fact of my being an agnostic member of CF - since 2006.
I ask that you at least consider this carefully, without prejudice over the fact of my being an agnostic member of CF - since 2006.
Start a thread here next week: Suggest New Forums - Christian Forums and send me a PM to remind me once you do. I've got to spend some time getting smart on the whole GA situation (I only have a hazy memory of GA given the fact that I wasn't involved in that change at all). My mental bandwidth is rather tied up with everything in the OP and I simply don't have the time to look into it at the moment. That way I can give the discussion the time it deserves while concentrating on all of this thread's stuff presently.
Plus I plan on enjoying my long weekend as it is sunny and warm in DC.
6) Forum Specific Guidelines are being removed. Each forum will retain a basic outline regarding the purpose of the forum.
This is fine as long as we are all clear what is allowed and what is not.
I have found to my cost that if any denomination other than my own decides to regard even the friendliest of interchanges as 'non fellowship', or as 'debating their denomination', then I end up with warnings. They use these 'rules' as a way of keeping strangers out.
Ditto if someone else decides that what I post is blasphemous. I had a very meaningful, very loving prayer thread in WWMC closed because some troll decided to disrupt it, and accuse me of blasphemy, and it is still closed. This is not acceptable.
This gets so tiresome that the only solution is a) not to ever venture out of one's own home areas, and b) post only about the weather.
Surely that is not what this forum is intended for?
__________________
A bruised reed shall He not break, and the smoking flax shall He not quench.
This is fine as long as we are all clear what is allowed and what is not.
I have found to my cost that if any denomination other than my own decides to regard even the friendliest of interchanges as 'non fellowship', or as 'debating their denomination', then I end up with warnings. They use these 'rules' as a way of keeping strangers out.
Ditto if someone else decides that what I post is blasphemous. I had a very meaningful, very loving prayer thread in WWMC closed because some troll decided to disrupt it, and accuse me of blasphemy, and it is still closed. This is not acceptable.
This gets so tiresome that the only solution is a) not to ever venture out of one's own home areas, and b) post only about the weather.
Surely that is not what this forum is intended for?
I'm sort of speaking off the cuff here so this is merely my opinion though I do think it is fairly representative...plus we Advisor types have been discussing this for about two months (in many cases to the exclusion of other things)...so I'd like to be able to say that we've thought a good deal regarding what we're trying to achieve.
I would say broadly with respect to FSGs the implementation (or removal) will be one of a rolling process. There are simply too many places on the site to do it at once. The expectation is, however, that the only thing people should be hearing from staff should be related to the site rules at large. There may be some rule tweaks along the way but they'll most likely be functional. Such as: forum restrictions. We have several which are restricted by age and gender. Gender is easy because there are only two choices and we can hard code to the selection. Age is not...we're not going to have a usergroup for everyone 10-100...I'd do nothing but make manual moves all day long and I'd go insane. So we'll probably make that more explicit in the rules with respect to profile elements that are not hard coded to forum access.
But that really isn't what you're asking, I think. If I were a betting man I'd say that the last to be implemented will be the Congregational ones because they're the most difficult set. We'll probably be approaching the relevant groups and soliciting their input (though with a set template). I'm certainly not going to write / provide links for "what we believe" for OBOB or STR, for example.
To be perfectly frank...all of these guidelines which state "we can't discuss, you won't discuss, you must hold this opinion" really bug the hell out of me and I don't find them particularly welcoming. I'd rather have something which states: this is what we believe.
This bit:
I have found to my cost that if any denomination other than my own decides to regard even the friendliest of interchanges as 'non fellowship', or as 'debating their denomination', then I end up with warnings. They use these 'rules' as a way of keeping strangers out.
I tend to concur with...I refer to it as the "ghettoization of CF" something which I'm not a fan of...ditto with blasphemy. I think that people define it poorly. We've actually been working on a whole big internal guidance document on blasphemy for the last month or so...sort of "what is and what is not" as I think it has gone a bit off the rails.
I agree with Catherineanne and you. Ethnocentrism and parochial religiosity do not build up the Body of Christ, but only divide it. There is only one Faith, one Baptism, one Lord, Jesus Christ.
A lot of good CF folks that I used to correspond with are now agnostic and atheists, and people have to ask why? CF should be drawing people toward Christ and not away from Him.
__________________ Virgin Theotokos, rejoice!
O Mary, Full of Grace;
The Lord is with thee.
Blessed art thou among women,
And blessed is the fruit of thy womb,
For thou hast borne the Savior of our souls.
+ + + + +
Glory to Jesus Christ!
Glory Forever!
O Giver of Life, Glory to Thee!
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Forum Specific Guidelines are being removed. Each forum will retain a basic outline regarding the purpose of the forum. The Congregational Areas will be a given a bit more leeway to include posting a statement of faith / documents about what group x believes etc.
Will the Congregation-Wide Guideliens stay put, as-is? With the SoF and the CWG still in place, I have no objections. My only concern in the integrity of the "safe haven" rule.
__________________
Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.
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"No matter how "right" you may be on various points, you must be diplomatic also. The first and important thing is not "rightness" at all, but Christian love and harmony. Most "crazy converts" have been "right" in the criticisms that led to their downfall; but they were lacking in Christian love and charity and so went off the deep end, needlessly alienating people around them and finally finding themselves all alone in their rightness and self-righteousness. Don't you follow them!..."
-Father Seraphim (Rose)
"Personal opinions have no role in ministry of any kind. When we represent the Church, then we ought only say and do what the Church has asked us to do. All else is wasted energy and an opportunity for sin. It is when we lapse into personal opinions, even when we dress them in the language of the Church, that conflict will arise."
- His Grace, Bp. JOSPEH
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