Needed Assistance on Greek Interpretation!!

lego_agape · #1 14th June 2009, 10:18 PM

Hey everyone. This is a question for those more skilled than I in Greek (I am only 1 semester deep in it). BTW i am not sure this thread is in the right section. feel free to move it.

I am preparing a sermon for July 5 and am using Hebrews 11:1 as a key text. I have been looking at the word translated "being sure" in the NIV and "assurance" in the ESV and "substance" in the KJV. The word is hypostasis. In the Lexicon I am using (ed by Walter Bauer, updated by Gingrich and Danker) is difficult for me to understand.

Here is the part that is confusing me... It says, "The sense 'confidence', 'assurance' must be eliminated, since examples of it cannot be found (acc. to Dorrie and Koster [below]). It cannot, therefore, play a role in 3. Hb 11:1, where it has enjoyed much favor since Luther (also Tyndale, RSV; not KJ). Among the meanings that can be authenticated the one that seems to fit best here is realization.... Jos., C. Ap 1, 1 that of the Jewish people, both by a divine act): estin pistis elpizomenon hypostasis= in faith things hoped for become realized, or things hoped for become reality."

Is it telling me that the Heb 11:1 could be translated to say that Faith is when the things hoped for start becoming realized?????? for example, that the kingdom of God coming in fullness (which is our hope) can be inaugurated in some ways now through faith???

i realize that may not be the case at all. haha, but if so, this verse could be quite helpful for a sermon based around inaugurated eschatology... just thinking....

what are your thoughts, insights, helps????
god bless,
LA

wildboar · #2 15th June 2009, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by LEGO_AGAPE

Is it telling me that the Heb 11:1 could be translated to say that Faith is when the things hoped for start becoming realized?????? for example, that the kingdom of God coming in fullness (which is our hope) can be inaugurated in some ways now through faith???

BDAG seems to be saying that the verse is saying that through faith we realize that the kingdom of God is a present reality. I don't think it is saying that the kingdom of God is inaugurated through our faith but that we realize its present existence through faith. I think you are using the term "realized" in a different sense than BDAG is.

Ellingsworth in his commentary translates this as "Fath guarantees what believers hope for." I would have to look at this more to reach a conclusion as to what is specifically meant.

lego_agape · #3 15th June 2009, 02:49 PM

AH! brilliant. That certainly helps sort things out. Thank you!

thersites · #4 7th July 2009, 08:26 PM

"Is it telling me that the Heb 11:1 could be translated to say that Faith is when the things hoped for start becoming realized?????? for example, that the kingdom of God coming in fullness (which is our hope) can be inaugurated in some ways now through faith??? "

I think that reading might flip the noun and participle. The reality is the concept, our hope is the process. I'm not a big KJV fan, but "substance" as a translation of hypostasis is far better attested in classical authors than any modern translation's alternative, and the greek of Hebrews is way more like the LXX and classical greek than any other NT book.

jpr7 · #5 2nd September 2009, 05:11 AM

Originally Posted by lego_agape

Hey everyone. This is a question for those more skilled than I in Greek (I am only 1 semester deep in it). BTW i am not sure this thread is in the right section. feel free to move it.

I am preparing a sermon for July 5 and am using Hebrews 11:1 as a key text. I have been looking at the word translated "being sure" in the NIV and "assurance" in the ESV and "substance" in the KJV. The word is hypostasis. In the Lexicon I am using (ed by Walter Bauer, updated by Gingrich and Danker) is difficult for me to understand.

Here is the part that is confusing me... It says, "The sense 'confidence', 'assurance' must be eliminated, since examples of it cannot be found (acc. to Dorrie and Koster [below]). It cannot, therefore, play a role in 3. Hb 11:1, where it has enjoyed much favor since Luther (also Tyndale, RSV; not KJ). Among the meanings that can be authenticated the one that seems to fit best here is realization.... Jos., C. Ap 1, 1 that of the Jewish people, both by a divine act): estin pistis elpizomenon hypostasis= in faith things hoped for become realized, or things hoped for become reality."

Is it telling me that the Heb 11:1 could be translated to say that Faith is when the things hoped for start becoming realized?????? for example, that the kingdom of God coming in fullness (which is our hope) can be inaugurated in some ways now through faith???

i realize that may not be the case at all. haha, but if so, this verse could be quite helpful for a sermon based around inaugurated eschatology... just thinking....

what are your thoughts, insights, helps????
god bless,
LA

Louw-Nida, a lexicon based on semantic domains, defines it as: "that which provides the basis for trust and reliance." I think that definition is pretty much on the money.