| Origins Theology Forum for the discussion of Creation Science (Young/Old) vs Theistic Evolution. Discussion of Atheistic Evolution should be taken to the Discussion and Debate forums. |
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12th June 2009, 06:54 AM
|  | The Rapture can take a hike
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Reps: 5,038,481,752,567,930 (power: 5,038,481,752,583) | | Originally Posted by vossler  Wow, I'm gone for a few weeks and someone new comes in and takes on the fight.  Great to have you here, however take it from someone who's been here awhile, you're wasting your breath. Most TEs don't seek knowledge they're just here to defend their ideas, certainly not God's Word. Welcome to the mayhem! 
What a shame you feel the need to bear false witness against your brethren. You bring the gospel into disrepute in doing so.
__________________ simul justus et peccator |
12th June 2009, 10:52 AM
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Reps: 10,818,175,665,014,668 (power: 10,818,175,665,020) | | Originally Posted by vossler If only you truly believed this. If you did you would be a YEC.
First of all, I just explained why that is not the case. YEC is an attempt to justify God's word in the face of rationalism. I don't believe it needs to be justified.
What I see in this thread an elsewhere is an attitude of "take the bible at its plain word" for Genesis and then a lot of work to justify why it should not be taken at its plain word elsewhere. YEC fails because it cannot be consistently applied through scripture. Of course you have faith in man's science, you just have allowed it to blind you for so long that you no longer recognize it.
Second, don't put words in my mouth. I put no faith in science nor do I put my faith in any man's interpretation of scripture. I put my faith into the pure Word of God and the guiding hand of the Holy Spirit. |
12th June 2009, 01:22 PM
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Reps: 316 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by juvenissun Give a long list is a very poor way to argue about anything (it is be a good reference, though. Thanks for that).
Take the first one of the list: I can see it is a perfect way to explain the shape of the earth. It is formed (made) under a general physics law (the seal): gravity force. The same force (seal) made all celestial bodies of this universe. No one can describe the origin and the shape of the earth any better and any more precise than this one.
Same type of argument can be applied to EVERYONE on the list.
Evolutional scientist could misinterpret God's word whenever they like to. Creational scientist can always see God's beautiful creation in His words.
The seal described in Job is actually gravity....Now there is a non-literal translation if ive ever heard one. Come on now. |
12th June 2009, 02:08 PM
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Reps: 10,818,175,665,014,668 (power: 10,818,175,665,020) | | Originally Posted by Gus2009 The seal described in Job is actually gravity....Now there is a non-literal translation if ive ever heard one. Come on now.
That's exactly the kind of thing I mean when I say "retrofitting God's word to a rationalistic view". |
12th June 2009, 03:17 PM
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Reps: 18,889,155,825,852,136 (power: 18,889,155,825,864) | | Originally Posted by vossler I'm not surprised by this response. Thanks for being consistent. 
vossler, I have made just one point from the outset of this thread: That any YEC who scoffs at evolutionary creationists for operating under an accommodationist hermeneutic are themselves being hypocritical because they, too, selectively chose to use the same hermeneutic in light of how the Bible describes the flat-earth, geocentric universe. You have said nothing to refute this. Your various responses so have consisted of two things:
1) Statements to the effect that I am wrong about the Bible's description of the earth, without actually demonstrating, with reference to the Bible, how I am wrong.
2) More scoffing at me for operating under an accommodationist hermeneutic.
It's almost as though you don't understand the point I am making because you never actually address the core of my argument. This is why I "blah, blah, blahed" over your last reply to me because none of it actually addressed my point that accommodationism works. If you put more thought into your posts beyond simply telling me that I am wrong, I'd spend more time giving you the response that you deserve.
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"There is evidence for evolution, gobs and gobs of it. It is not just speculation or a faith choice or an assumption or a religion. It is a productive framework for lots of biological research, and it has amazing explanatory power. There is no conspiracy to hide the truth about the failure of evolution. There has really been no failure of evolution as a scientific theory. It works, and it works well." -- creation scientist Dr. Todd Wood |
12th June 2009, 08:08 PM
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Reps: 17,483,847 (power: 17,493) | | Originally Posted by Mallon
vossler, I have made just one point from the outset of this thread: That any YEC who scoffs at evolutionary creationists for operating under an accommodationist hermeneutic are themselves being hypocritical because they, too, selectively chose to use the same hermeneutic in light of how the Bible describes the flat-earth, geocentric universe. You have said nothing to refute this... It's almost as though you don't understand the point I am making because you never actually address the core of my argument.
Given that my point had nothing to do with your flat earth geocentric universe argument, I would hope you could see why I didn't respond to it. My initial post was to concur and commiserate wth peace4ever's point, not address anything you said. You then decided to address me and I chose not to go down the path of discussion you wished to entertain.
My point has been and will continue to be that TEs typically don't defend God's Word here in OT or even the rest of CF, instead they're constantly attempting to tear it down. So rather than addressing your point and getting lost in an endless discussion which wasn't fundamental to my accusation, I addressed the root of the issue with my post and you chose to, which you're free to do, dismiss it.
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David Cooper: "When the plain sense of Scripture makes common sense, seek no other sense;therefore, take every word at its primary, ordinary, literal meaning, unless the facts of the context indicate clearly otherwise." |
12th June 2009, 08:18 PM
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12th June 2009, 08:58 PM
|  | Basically pulling an Obama (Thanks Calminian!)
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Reps: 1,984,022,293,840,305,920 (power: 1,984,022,293,840,324) | | Originally Posted by vossler My point has been and will continue to be that TEs typically don't defend God's Word here in OT or even the rest of CF, instead they're constantly attempting to tear it down.
Scripture is like a lion. Who ever heard of defending a lion? Just turn it loose; it will defend itself.
- C.H. Spurgeon
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When you come to the Ammonites, do not
harass them or provoke them. Deut 2:19
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12th June 2009, 09:08 PM
| | Senior Veteran
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Reps: 17,483,847 (power: 17,493) | | Originally Posted by Assyrian Scripture is like a lion. Who ever heard of defending a lion? Just turn it loose; it will defend itself.
- C.H. Spurgeon
I like that quote a lot, probably because it's so true.
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David Cooper: "When the plain sense of Scripture makes common sense, seek no other sense;therefore, take every word at its primary, ordinary, literal meaning, unless the facts of the context indicate clearly otherwise." |
12th June 2009, 09:37 PM
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Reps: 18,889,155,825,852,136 (power: 18,889,155,825,864) | | Originally Posted by vossler My point has been and will continue to be that TEs typically don't defend God's Word here in OT or even the rest of CF, instead they're constantly attempting to tear it down.
If trying to understand Scripture the way God intended is wrong, then I don't want to be right.
Sorry you didn't feel like discussing the merits of concordism and accommodationism, vossler. If ever you do feel like wrestling over these important issues, I'll be around.
__________________
"There is evidence for evolution, gobs and gobs of it. It is not just speculation or a faith choice or an assumption or a religion. It is a productive framework for lots of biological research, and it has amazing explanatory power. There is no conspiracy to hide the truth about the failure of evolution. There has really been no failure of evolution as a scientific theory. It works, and it works well." -- creation scientist Dr. Todd Wood | | |
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