Sin entered in the world when eve sinned! 1 tim 2:
13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
This scripture passage, establishes two things.#1, Federal Headship of the man, and # 2 that adam because of his headship was guilty of eves transgression, so much as so, it is said to be his rom 5:
14Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
You see, God called their name Adam gen 5:
1This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him; 2Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
So eves transgression was adams transgression..
Some will object to this, but its still true..
as soon as eve ate of the fruit, death pervaded their beings, Just as God said to adam gen 2:
16And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: 17But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surelydie.
You see, some erronously believe that adam had a choice as to wether or not he could have not eaten of the fruit his wife ate of and gave of him to eat.
Well the truth of the matter is, adam was already dead from the immediate effects of eves transgression, so he yielded himself as a servant of sin..
rom 6:
16Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
You see, adams unhestitant compliance to eves giving to him of the fruit to eat also, goes to prove that he was already dead to God, and alive to sin..sin had begun its rule over him and mankind at this time..
Sin entered in the world when eve sinned! 1 tim 2:
13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
This scripture passage, establishes two things.#1, Federal Headship of the man, and # 2 that adam because of his headship was guilty of eves transgression, so much as so, it is said to be his rom 5:
14Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
You see, God called their name Adam gen 5:
1This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him; 2Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
So eves transgression was adams transgression..
Some will object to this, but its still true..
as soon as eve ate of the fruit, death pervaded their beings, Just as God said to adam gen 2:
16And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: 17But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surelydie.
You see, some erronously believe that adam had a choice as to wether or not he could have not eaten of the fruit his wife ate of and gave of him to eat.
Well the truth of the matter is, adam was already dead from the immediate effects of eves transgression, so he yielded himself as a servant of sin..
rom 6:
16Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
You see, adams unhestitant compliance to eves giving to him of the fruit to eat also, goes to prove that he was already dead to God, and alive to sin..sin had begun its rule over him and mankind at this time..
God did not hold Adam guilty of Eve’s sin: Gen. 3: 17</SPAN> To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,'
"Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat of it
all the days of your life.
Adam and Eve had different punishment (Eve’s was more suffer). Historically, women are often excluded in scripture, so to talk about the Adams to include Adam and Eve would not be unique. They both sinned by both eating, people had only one way of sinning at the time, with nothing mentioned about Adam sinning by Eve eating. The Adam and Eve story is the original Romeo and Juliet story with Adam knowing Eve would die and not able to live without her.
God did not hold Adam guilty of Eve’s sin: Gen. 3: 17</SPAN> To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,'
He did, adam died the moment eve ate, thats why he ate after her..because he was a sinner, He sinned too because he was made a sinner when eve ate.
The elect even now, when we are born, we are sinners before individual personal transgression..so it was with adam, he was constituted a sinner before his personal transgression, because of eve's transgression..scripture says:
13For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
He did, adam died the moment eve ate, thats why he ate after her..because he was a sinner, He sinned too because he was made a sinner when eve ate.
The elect even now, when we are born, we are sinners before individual personal transgression..so it was with adam, he was constituted a sinner before his personal transgression, because of eve's transgression..scripture says:
13For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
I'm sorry beloved but you are incorrect. Saying that adam sinned when eve did is like saying that a man is guilty of adultury if his wife has an affair. Eve sinned when she, now catch this, touched the fruit. For the command was for them to neither touch it nor eat it. As soon as she touched the fruit she had sinned.
Adam did not commit sin unti he took the fruit from his wife and ate of it also. Only than, once adam sinned, did they both realize that they were naked, and than hide themselves from God upon his arrival.
Before Eve ate the fruit from the tree of good and evil, she told the serpent that you must not touch the tree or you will die. So before Eve sinned she already told a lie, which is not possible because she had not yet sinned. Or Eve was just plain stupid for misquoting God, but than God doesn't create stupid people.
So Adam and Eve could have picked all the fruit from the tree of good and evil and give it to the animals to eat. No sin if you take the Word literally. Or Adam and Eve could have burned down the tree, get rid of it by chopping it down and make a chair out of it. Or make pie out of the fruit of the tree of good and evil. Still no sin.
Last edited by ristretto; 20th January 2009 at 01:02 AM.
Reason: typo
He did, adam died the moment eve ate, thats why he ate after her..because he was a sinner, He sinned too because he was made a sinner when eve ate.
The elect even now, when we are born, we are sinners before individual personal transgression..so it was with adam, he was constituted a sinner before his personal transgression, because of eve's transgression..scripture says:
13For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
I think you are trying to extrapolate and show people can be guilty of another person’s sin without doing anything. Just as Adam was not guilty of Eve’s sin we today are not held accountable for Adam/Eve’s sin(s). Paul in 1Tim. 13-14 is not showing Adam to be at fault for Eve’s sin, read the context: 1 Tim. 2: 9I also want women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes, 10but with good deeds, appropriate for women who profess to worship God. 11A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. 12I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. 13For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. 15But women[a] will be saved[b] through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety. Paul is showing why women should hold a non leadership religious worship position over men. It is because the women was deceived and sinned first.
I'm sorry beloved but you are incorrect. Saying that adam sinned when eve did is like saying that a man is guilty of adultury if his wife has an affair. Eve sinned when she, now catch this, touched the fruit. For the command was for them to neither touch it nor eat it. As soon as she touched the fruit she had sinned.
Adam did not commit sin unti he took the fruit from his wife and ate of it also. Only than, once adam sinned, did they both realize that they were naked, and than hide themselves from God upon his arrival.
The question is where did Eve get the idea: “you can not touch the tree”? There are three sources: God, Adam or Eve herself. Why would God or Eve add the requirement of not touching the tree? Adam may have had a reason: Eve comes on the seen after Adam is given the instruction concerning the tree. Adam seems to understand the tree and in typical male fashion leaves in alone and goes on about his business, but as soon as Adam explains the tree to Eve, in typical female fashion, she has a thousand questions. She would keep bringing it up to the point Adam might say: “Listen you are not to go near that tree and God does not want you to touch it, so forget about it…” Adam extrapolated God’s commands, which is not good. Eve may have seen animals touching the tree or maybe even Adam touched a branch since it was in the middle of the Garden. I have both sons and daughters that act this way.
I'm sorry beloved but you are incorrect. Saying that adam sinned when eve did
eve was Adam gen 5:
1This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
2Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
If indeed Adam was "the figure of him who was to come", referring to Christ, then all you have to do is study the relationship of Christ and the church to (somewhat) understand what happened in the garden. Christ=Adam, Eve=the church. Who sinned, and who must pay the penalty as if he were the sinner?
God did not put them to death but instead instituted substitutionary sacrifice to 'cover' their sin. The sacrifice looked forward to that of Christ, the second Adam. Therefore Adam as a type of Christ was innocent, but symbolically punished anyway becoming sin on behalf of the church.
Women (types of Eve) will be saved in "childbearing." What this means is that she will be a wife to her husband and submissive to his authority. God-ordained marriage places woman in submission to her husband's rule.
owg
Last edited by oldwiseguy; 31st January 2009 at 08:14 PM.
If indeed Adam was "the figure of him who was to come", referring to Christ, then all you have to do is study the relationship of Christ and the church to (somewhat) understand what happened in the garden. Christ=Adam, Eve=the church. Who sinned, and who must pay the penalty as if he were the sinner?
God did not put them to death but instead instituted substitutionary sacrifice to 'cover' their sin. The sacrifice looked forward to that of Christ, the second Adam. Therefore Adam as a type of Christ was innocent, but symbolically punished anyway becoming sin on behalf of the church.
Women (types of Eve) will be saved in "childbearing." What this means is that she will be a wife to her husband and submissive to his authority. God-ordained marriage places woman in submission to her husband's rule.
owg
That analogy fit in very limited ways. The biggest difference is Eve did suffer and most would agree suffered more then Adam.
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