Is it wrong to thank God that you have been granted mercy to have enough food?
Even with that you have a problem?
I can see his POV, even though I can also see yours.
To an atheist, giving praise to a personal deity who could end all suffering and injustice with a wink (yet obviously does not do so) must be the ultimate perversion. It's like praising a tyrant for handing you a bunch of scraps while he blissfully watches how thousands of others die.
It's a reaction to the (admittedly rather repulsive and somewhat simple-minded) literalist beliefs of some Christians, who'd picture God as nothing but a Man written larger than life, handing out supernatural trinkets to those who say the right words to please Him.
Have you never come across one of these obnoxious "I prayed to the LORD to let me find some parking space, and then the SUV in front of me reversed out of the lot and made room for me" - kind of posts?
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There is no greater threat to freedom than a happy slave.
"Liberty means responsibility. This is why most people dread it." G.B. Shaw
Were taxes an option, would you withhold all of them and keep all the money for yourself?
Imagine we all do that.
No more police.
No more fire stations.
Libraries would have to close.
Roads would be in ruin. I mean, why should I pay for roads to get fixed when I don't have a car?
Public schools would cost a lot of money, and people that didn't have enough money for their kids wouldn't be able to send them to school, creating a huge problem when they became adults, creating a section of the "Best Country in the World" with uneducated kids.
Hungry people would have to find more creative ways to eat, such as, taking food, robbing people, etc.
Mothers who need to feed their babies would have malnutritioned babies, just like the commercials, right next to mansions with BMWs parked outside. No matter. They can break into your house and steal. There aren't any tax funded police anymore, so dial 911 all you want.
I would be happy for anyone person that hellbent to take all of their money, shut up about it already, and go live in a yert and count your money all day long. In the meantime, some of us are trying to live as a community.
__________________ Love is the only miracle there is. -Osho
Matthew 10:16
See, I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. So be as cunning as serpents and as innocent as doves.
17 “But beware of men, for they will hand you over to the courts and scourge you in their synagogues; 18 and you will even be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 “But when they hand you over, do not worry about how or what you are to say; for it will be given you in that hour what you are to say. 20 “For it is not you who speak, but it is the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you. 21 “Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 22 “You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.
Is it wrong to thank God that you have been granted mercy to have enough food?
Even with that you have a problem?
I have a problem with you considering yourself worthier in the eyes of God than others.
__________________ Don't walk in front of me; I may not follow. Don't walk behind me; I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend. - Albert Camus
I can see his POV, even though I can also see yours.
To an atheist, giving praise to a personal deity who could end all suffering and injustice with a wink (yet obviously does not do so) must be the ultimate perversion. It's like praising a tyrant for handing you a bunch of scraps while he blissfully watches how thousands of others die.
It's a reaction to the (admittedly rather repulsive and somewhat simple-minded) literalist beliefs of some Christians, who'd picture God as nothing but a Man written larger than life, handing out supernatural trinkets to those who say the right words to please Him.
Have you never come across one of these obnoxious "I prayed to the LORD to let me find some parking space, and then the SUV in front of me reversed out of the lot and made room for me" - kind of posts?
God could, but then we wouldn't learn.
I think of the situation like this:
Mom leaves my older brother Larry $20 for pizza. He orders the pizza, eats 3/4 of it until he's almost sick, then calls us in for supper, the 4 of us looking at the sad, 2 pieces of pizza we have to share. He says, "Well, if Mom was really a good mother, she would have left us $40, so that you could have eaten, too."
There are hungry people simply because we don't share.
If we had all that we needed, never needed each other, never needed someone to help move a couch, as my neighbor asked me to do, and learning to do it because you are simply being a good neighbor, want to make a good neighborhood, then we would never learn love.
We would never learn to be given to graciously, or to sacrifice for others out of kindness. We would never see someone at work who forgot their food, offer half of our sandwich, and make each other understand love, support, community, working together as one body.
We would just eat our provided sandwiches at our desk, needing nothing from anyone, nor ever asked for anything from another. There would be no need for community, no need to care for others, because God just provides it in a wink of an eye, like that replicator on Star Trek.
I was taught to bring enough for the class and share, and there is something learned in that.
However, if you don't learn to share, even when you have more than enough, it's ridiculous to ask of God to give you something. Why should you be stealing from God? You didn't pay him anything. And yet, God gives us our daily bread. Is it that much to ask that we share some of what we are given?
Or are you going to sit and eat the entire bag of Oreos yourself?
And do you think I'm going to help you move, because you need help, when you didn't help me? You don't need me. You only care about yourself, so move it all alone, like I had to, when you asked me, and think about how hard it is, and how much easier it could have been if we had only cooperated. But now? You have nothing to offer me, I am moved already, and not in the mood to take the high road. Good luck.
It's us, it's not God. If I make 16 million dollars a year playing ball, and you barely make enough money to pay for rent as a teacher, is it God's fault that you don't have enough food, or mine, because God provide us with enough food, gave most of it to me, and to thank him, I kept it all, shrugged at you, thanked only myself for earning it and being fortunate, thinking God not a part of the equation at all, UNTIL it is time to blame God for poverty and people being hungry.
__________________ Love is the only miracle there is. -Osho
Matthew 10:16
See, I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. So be as cunning as serpents and as innocent as doves.
17 “But beware of men, for they will hand you over to the courts and scourge you in their synagogues; 18 and you will even be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 “But when they hand you over, do not worry about how or what you are to say; for it will be given you in that hour what you are to say. 20 “For it is not you who speak, but it is the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you. 21 “Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 22 “You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.
I have a problem with you considering yourself worthier in the eyes of God than others.
I didn't say that I was worthier than others. I simply thanked God for providing, knowing that I am simply lucky, and nothing more. SCANDALOUS!
Doesn't it make sense for Paris Hilton to privately thank God and acknowledge the fact that she has been blessed with a lot of money? Bono thanks God for his success by using the money for a lot of international causes, helping the less fortunate.
It doesn't mean that they are worthier than me, nor do I think someone who is wealthier or has more opportunities is loved by God any more or less than one who is less fortunate.
It simply means that one acknowledges that God has blessed them, rather than take it for granted, or take full credit for it, saying that they worked for all of that money, and none of it was God.
I deserve none of it, nor have I said that. You said that.
Do you not appreciate that you have your health? That doesn't mean you are more worthy than someone who is very sick. If you thank your wife for marrying you and being such a good wife, that doesn't mean that you are more worthy than anyone else, and she was only giving you what you rightly deserve, but rather, that she choose you, and you are grateful.
Since when is simply thanking God for what he has provided, for the mercy to have health, or enough food, when God owes me nothing, but gives in love, a bad thing?
__________________ Love is the only miracle there is. -Osho
Matthew 10:16
See, I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. So be as cunning as serpents and as innocent as doves.
17 “But beware of men, for they will hand you over to the courts and scourge you in their synagogues; 18 and you will even be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 “But when they hand you over, do not worry about how or what you are to say; for it will be given you in that hour what you are to say. 20 “For it is not you who speak, but it is the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you. 21 “Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 22 “You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.
If God isn't being extra-specially nice to you, why thank her?
I can see the personal value of counting your blessings, but I don't understand why you'd want to drag God into it. If she's responsible for your blessings, she's also responsible for others' starvation. In which case, I don't know if you should be praising her.
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Jesus says we die a little death for him every day.
~ La Petite Mort, Erin McKeown
There are far more who don't work, than cannot work,
Based upon what?
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Just a Christian
Lord, make me an instrument of your peace,
Where there is hatred, let me sow love;
where there is injury, pardon;
where there is doubt, faith;
where there is despair, hope;
where there is darkness, light;
where there is sadness, joy; O Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek to be consoled as to console;
to be understood as to understand;
to be loved as to love.
If you're an American, the vast majority of your taxes that are used as direct cash payments to others is Social Security. (Other federal welfare programs--ADC, food stamps, etc. are miniscule, by comparison.) Yes, it is the world's biggest pyramid scheme, but it's also the most successful government program ever in improving people's lives. Before SS, at least 40-50% of the elderly who could no longer work were impoverished. They were either institutionalized or cared for by family--which often strained family resources. And then during times of unemployment, the whole extended family faced financial ruin. That's exactly what happened during the Great Depression, and why a government old age pension program was passed. By helping elderly parents to be financially independent, SS also helps their working-age children. SS has made middle class life possible for millions. I've made the maximum SS "contributions" for over 30 years. But it's helped my parents remain independent--which removes a burden from me. I can't honestly say I enjoy paying that FICA, but I know I'm going to eligible for it too in 5 years. So I'm not simply paying for others, I'm also paying for myself. And like others have said, it's a far more worthwhile use of my taxes than a lot of other things.
Thank you for explaining it better than I could. Programs such as food stamps, and TANF (I think that's what it's called now) are very small comparatively, yet it seems to be what people complain about the most.
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Just a Christian
Lord, make me an instrument of your peace,
Where there is hatred, let me sow love;
where there is injury, pardon;
where there is doubt, faith;
where there is despair, hope;
where there is darkness, light;
where there is sadness, joy; O Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek to be consoled as to console;
to be understood as to understand;
to be loved as to love.
The tax collectors were reviled by Jews. One of them was accepted by Christ after he stopped collecting taxes.
Again, a Buddhist preaching Christianity reeks of insincerity. Move on or change your icon to be more effective. Don't be afraid to be more inconspicuous.
You mean like a Unitarian?
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Just a Christian
Lord, make me an instrument of your peace,
Where there is hatred, let me sow love;
where there is injury, pardon;
where there is doubt, faith;
where there is despair, hope;
where there is darkness, light;
where there is sadness, joy; O Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek to be consoled as to console;
to be understood as to understand;
to be loved as to love.
Its that time of the year. Time to do taxes and find out how much you pay to or get back from the government. My question to you is, do you think you should be forced to pay for someone else to get food and health care for free while you have to pay for it?
I stopped resenting taxes when a family member needed government aide in order to get through a bad time. Some abuse it, other's don't and find their way out of the system. So, it no longer bothers me so much. Sure, I can use the money that gets taken. But...
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