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24th June 2009, 01:34 AM
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Reps: 82,864,414,902 (power: 82,864,433) | | Originally Posted by Catholic_NE  The Church is big enough for everyone.
Some seem eager to get rid of the riff-raff that they see as marring the Church's purity. |
24th June 2009, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by fragmentsofdreams That's a horrible thing for a priest to say. The CCC is useful but incomplete. And not everything contained in it is binding (or mandatory, de fide, or whatever other term you want to use) on Catholics.
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4th July 2009, 04:16 AM
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Reps: 281,066,741,495,701,312 (power: 281,066,741,495,709) | | Originally Posted by Catholic_NE And not everything contained in it is binding (or mandatory, de fide, or whatever other term you want to use) on Catholics. That's not what the Pope said about it. .
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“For neither does he [the Devil] seek those whom he has already subdued, nor does he take the trouble to overthrow those whom he has already made his own. The foe and enemy of the Church despises and passes by those whom he has alienated from the Church, and led without as captives and conquered; he goes on to harass those in whom he sees Christ dwell.” – Saint Cyprian (Epistle 56)
Pope Benedict XVI is innocent |
4th July 2009, 10:09 AM
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Reps: 764,535,182,527,354,880 (power: 764,535,182,527,376) | | Originally Posted by Catholic_NE The Church is big enough for everyone.
... perhaps the church is, but I don't think the Catholic Church is. As witnessed by the reality that 50% of Christians are not a part of it, and some 50% of those that are claimed by it don't agree with it and don't worship there....
It seems that the RCC is for those that will accept what the RCC itself alone demands: that all accept whatever it alone says with docility, as Christ speaking. Those that regard such as inappropriate or unnecessary or simply don't do it perhaps should have the honesty and integrity to leave? As my deacon stated, there are true Catholics and then there are..... well, those that perhaps should not call themselves or regard themselves as Catholic at all.
Thank you!
Pax
- Josiah
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POLITICAL resolution: Power, Authority, Individualism, pride, lording it over others, lecture, demands for quiet submission.
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4th July 2009, 10:17 AM
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| | Join Date: 11th August 2006
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Reps: 178,751,386,065,373,056 (power: 0) | | Hmmm. I imagine your deacon would probably call me a protestent hiding in the church... I blame my protestent mother.
I'm just not to sure where it says that we are supposed to blindly submit to the church without ever evaluating the church's position or teachings? I'm sorry. God gave me a brain, I simply don't imagine he doesn't want me to use my own investigative abilities and logic to decide what is true or not, rather than blindly taking things on faith that someone else is better placed to make such decisions than me, and that "they" are always correct. If that makes me a bad Catholic, so be it. But I'm baptised and confirmed, so ya can't get rid of me, nyah, nyah  |
4th July 2009, 10:19 AM
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Reps: 178,751,386,065,373,056 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by LivingWordUnity That's not what the Pope said about it.
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Maybe thats one of the bits that isn't mandatory.
Next: Was the first Pope to claim Papal Infalibility covered by the doctrine of Papal Infalibility at the time? |
6th July 2009, 02:38 AM
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Reps: 281,066,741,495,701,312 (power: 281,066,741,495,709) | | Originally Posted by LightHorseman Maybe thats one of the bits that isn't mandatory.
Says who? Originally Posted by LightHorseman Next: Was the first Pope to claim Papal Infalibility covered by the doctrine of Papal Infalibility at the time?
I recommend reading the following at these links: Apostolic Succession (Fathers *) The Authority of the Pope Part 1 (Fathers *) The Authority of the Pope Part 2 (Fathers *) Origins of Peter as Pope (Fathers *) Papal Infallibility Peter and the Papacy Peter the Rock Peter's Primacy (Fathers *) Peter's Roman Residency (Fathers *) Peter's Successors (Fathers *) Was Peter in Rome?
I also recommend these articles: THE CHURCH'S MAGISTERIUM Onward Christian Soldiers .
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“For neither does he [the Devil] seek those whom he has already subdued, nor does he take the trouble to overthrow those whom he has already made his own. The foe and enemy of the Church despises and passes by those whom he has alienated from the Church, and led without as captives and conquered; he goes on to harass those in whom he sees Christ dwell.” – Saint Cyprian (Epistle 56)
Pope Benedict XVI is innocent
Last edited by LivingWordUnity; 6th July 2009 at 07:02 AM.
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6th July 2009, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by LightHorseman Hmmm. I imagine your deacon would probably call me a protestent hiding in the church... I blame my protestent mother.
I'm just not to sure where it says that we are supposed to blindly submit to the church without ever evaluating the church's position or teachings? I'm sorry. God gave me a brain, I simply don't imagine he doesn't want me to use my own investigative abilities and logic to decide what is true or not, rather than blindly taking things on faith that someone else is better placed to make such decisions than me, and that "they" are always correct. I guess the way I see it is, Catholics are supposed to be docile to the leadership of the hierarchy; and the hierarchy is supposed to shepherd the faithful without "lording it over" them.
You might compare it to that passage about husbands and wives.
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Catholic in New England.
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Let it be" |
6th July 2009, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by LightHorseman Next: Was the first Pope to claim Papal Infalibility covered by the doctrine of Papal Infalibility at the time? Kind of hard to answer, because I don't think we know who was the first pope to claim infallibility.
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Catholic in New England.
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There will be an answer
Let it be" |
7th July 2009, 01:04 AM
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Reps: 281,066,741,495,701,312 (power: 281,066,741,495,709) | | Originally Posted by Catholic_NE Kind of hard to answer, because I don't think we know who was the first pope to claim infallibility. Papal Infallibility didn't start with the claim of a Pope, it started with the promise of Christ to Peter and his successors. Like all other dogmas in history, they are only made when there becomes a great enough resistance to divinely revealed truth. The fact that the Church didn't see the need to make the doctrine of Papal Infallibility into an officially defined dogma until late shows that before that the primacy of the successor of Peter was, for the most part, something that was taken for granted. The first exercise of the primacy and infallibility of Peter was recorded in the book of Acts when Peter was consulted in the Counsel of Jerusalem to infallibly determine that Gentile Christians did not have to be circumcised or refrain from eating pork. The next example of a Pope exercising his universal primacy was when the church of Corinth in Greece, an ancient eastern church, had a dispute that they could not resolve on their own. So the Corinthians made a long distance appeal to Pope Clement to help them settle the issue once and for all. And that's what the Pope did around the year 80 A.D. Here is the quote of Pope Clement: “Owing to the sudden and repeated calamities and misfortunes which have befallen us, we must acknowledge that we have been somewhat tardy in turning our attention to the matters in dispute among you, beloved…Accept our counsel, and you will have nothing to regret…If anyone disobey the things which have been said by Him through us, let them know that they will involve themselves in transgression and in no small danger…You will afford us joy and gladness if, being obedient to the things which we have written through the Holy Spirit, you will root out the wicked passion of jealousy.” (St. Clement of Rome, Letter to the Corinthians, 1: 58–59, 63, A.D. 80) .
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“For neither does he [the Devil] seek those whom he has already subdued, nor does he take the trouble to overthrow those whom he has already made his own. The foe and enemy of the Church despises and passes by those whom he has alienated from the Church, and led without as captives and conquered; he goes on to harass those in whom he sees Christ dwell.” – Saint Cyprian (Epistle 56)
Pope Benedict XVI is innocent | | |
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