Denomination-specific TheologyA special subforum where a thread starter can restrict threads to replies by members of a particular denomination only to discuss denomination-specific theology.
From Judaism 101
...But to those who observe Shabbat, it is a precious gift from G-d, a day of great joy eagerly awaited throughout the week, a time when we can set aside all of our weekday concerns and devote ourselves to higher pursuits. In Jewish literature, poetry and music, Shabbat is described as a bride or queen, as in the popular Shabbat hymn Lecha Dodi Likrat Kallah (come, my beloved, to meet the [Sabbath] bride). It is said "more than Israel has kept Shabbat, Shabbat has kept Israel."
Shabbat is the most important ritual observance in Judaism. It is the only ritual observance instituted in the Ten Commandments. It is also the most important special day, even more important than Yom Kippur. This is clear from the fact that more aliyot (opportunities for congregants to be called up to the Torah) are given on Shabbat than on any other day.
Shabbat is primarily a day of rest and spiritual enrichment. The word "Shabbat" comes from the root Shin-Beit-Tav, meaning to cease, to end, or to rest.
Shabbat is not specifically a day of prayer. Although we do pray on Shabbat, and spend a substantial amount of time in synagogue praying, prayer is not what distinguishes Shabbat from the rest of the week. Observant Jews pray every day, three times a day. See Jewish Liturgy. To say that Shabbat is a day of prayer is no more accurate than to say that Shabbat is a day of feasting: we eat every day, but on Shabbat, we eat more elaborately and in a more leisurely fashion. The same can be said of prayer on Shabbat.
In modern America, we take the five-day work-week so much for granted that we forget what a radical concept a day of rest was in ancient times. The weekly day of rest has no parallel in any other ancient civilization. In ancient times, leisure was for the wealthy and the ruling classes only, never for the serving or laboring classes. In addition, the very idea of rest each week was unimaginable. The Greeks thought Jews were lazy because we insisted on having a "holiday" every seventh day.
My first question was on tithing and here I am, secondly, asking what is probably a novice question of the forum: when we're commanded to keep the Sabbath, what does that mean? I exercise on Sunday, we eat out, the kids do homework, we play games, go shopping. With the exception of going to church, our Sundays (Sabbaths) are similar to other days. While I haven't done an exhaustive study of the Sabbath, I can at least get the sense from a cursory reading of Scripture that my Sabbath's aren't like the ones described for the Jews. We've recently started attending some local churches that have really early services that are heavily attended, and several of the people we've talked to have said they attend the early service so that church won't take up the whole day--they can be done by 10 am! I fear I've lost touch with the notion of "a sabbath" other than acknowledging God in a more formal way on that day. How do you all feel about your Sabbaths? Is it a heart attitude or an expected, literal ritual/limitation on activities of a particular day? Hopefully my form of the question isn't too confusing. I think most of you have strong feelings one way or the other on what I've shared. Thanks to any of you who take time to respond.
David
__________________ I'll see you when the smoke clears.
There is no religion stronger than truth.
There is no power greater than love.
The sabbath still exists for the jewish brothers and sisters in the world.
Jesus gave us 'the Lords day" as is outlined in both revelation and the writings of thge early church, calling it the Lords own day, which of course was Sunday. If you read Justin Martyr, he describes the mass in the second century, and it sounds almost identical to the mass today. how reassuring.
The sabbath still exists for the jewish brothers and sisters in the world.
The sabbath was man for man, not just Jews.
Jesus gave us 'the Lords day" as is outlined in both revelation and the writings of thge early church, calling it the Lords own day, which of course was Sunday.
Yet the Bible calls the sabbath the Lord's day.
Isa 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, [from] doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking [thine own] words:
If you read Justin Martyr, he describes the mass in the second century, and it sounds almost identical to the mass today. how reassuring.
Nothing canonical in Justin Martyr's work. I'm as obligated to read him and reverence his writings as I am the Pope. Martyr denied the sabbath began at creation and taught that it started with Moses.
" 'As, then, circumcision began with Abraham, and the Sabbath . . . with Moses, and it has been proved they were enjoined on account of the hardness of your people's hearts, so it was necessary, in accordance with the Father's will, that they should have an end in him, who was born [15] of a virgin, of the family of Abraham.' —Justin Martyr to Trypho, a Jew."
Thus it is that Justin Martyr understood that the Sabbath began with Moses, and ended in Christ. This is in perfect harmony with the Scriptural teaching.
If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, [from] doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking [thine own] words:
Nothing canonical in Justin Martyr's work. I'm as obligated to read him and reverence his writings as I am the Pope. Martyr denied the sabbath began at creation and taught that it started with Moses.
" 'As, then, circumcision began with Abraham, and the Sabbath . . . with Moses, and it has been proved they were enjoined on account of the hardness of your people's hearts, so it was necessary, in accordance with the Father's will, that they should have an end in him, who was born [15] of a virgin, of the family of Abraham.' —Justin Martyr to Trypho, a Jew."
Thus it is that Justin Martyr understood that the Sabbath began with Moses, and ended in Christ. This is in perfect harmony with the Scriptural teaching.[/quote]
I can appreciaite your views.
BTW the only thing canonical about scripture itself, is because the Catholic Church canonized it in 382ad.
In other words, if you hold to the 27 books of the NT you hold to the Catholic canon of the NT.
the fact that Luther(a mere man) decided to take 7 books out of the OT, does not make him correct, and therefore you have an insufficient OT.
You also do not hold to Luthers desired NT canon, of which he would have removed James and revelatiojn, but Philip melanchton would not let him.
lol
You see, scripture does not possess the list of inspired books, but it took an authoritative and legislative church which the Holy Spirit worked through to do this.
Of course the Sabbath was the Lords day, but not titled as "The Lords Day" referring specifically to Jesus. Martyr's testimony fits perfectly with the wording from revelation, you can try to parse this all you like, but you will have to then say that every christian previous to the 1800s was wrong on this.
BTW the only thing canonical about scripture itself, is because the Catholic Church canonized it in 382ad.
Did the Catholic church write 1 Timothy 3:16?
In other words, if you hold to the 27 books of the NT you hold to the Catholic canon of the NT.
Those letters were written well before there was a catholic church. BTW, if you believe that scripture is from the Inspiration of the Lord then scripture is from Him and Him alone.
the fact that Luther(a mere man) decided to take 7 books out of the OT, does not make him correct, and therefore you have an insufficient OT.
Many so called Catholic father also rejected the Apocrypha.
You also do not hold to Luthers desired NT canon, of which he would have removed James and revelatiojn, but Philip melanchton would not let him.
lol
That might explain why I'm not a Lutheran.
You see, scripture does not possess the list of inspired books, but it took an authoritative and legislative church which the Holy Spirit worked through to do this.
That's OK, that's certainly your POV and you have a right to it. Of course, Abraham didn't have a Bible and he didn't OK.
Of course the Sabbath was the Lords day, but not titled as "The Lords Day" referring specifically to Jesus.
Johnwas in vision on the Lord's day" i.e. sabbath.
Martyr's testimony fits perfectly with the wording from revelation, you can try to parse this all you like, but you will have to then say that every christian previous to the 1800s was wrong on this.
Be serious. Martyrs words can't be gainsaid to assume something he did not say.
he Sabbath is still Saturday. Even the Roman Catholic Church admits this.
The Sabbath is a special thing between God and Israel and Judah. The question is then who is Israel? Who are those who walk with God? His Sabbath is a blessing. It is a 24 hour blessing. His paths of holyness lead to a joyful life.
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There is no power greater than love.
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Hey all I realise I'm new here, but I'd like to interject and get back to newadam's original dilemma: "Has he lost the Sabbath?" Well adam it seems to me like you have. I think I'm correct in saying you're worried that by doing the same things you do the rest of the week, you're stealing the sacred wonderfullness of the "Lord's Day" and making it, well, plain. According to Scripture, the Sabbath was set aside as a day of rest. It also states that the Seventh Day is the Sabbath. Just remember that, like bbbbbbb said earlier, the Sabbath was made for Man, not Man for the Sabbath (Mark 2:27). It's a day set aside for our benefit, a time to rest from all the stress, work, worry and even play that the daily routine of life gives us. Try and think of it as a time to recharge the batteries. Instead of doing normal things, try spending time in nature,try just BEING with your family, try sleeping (you'd be surprised how great a good 4 hours of sleep in the middle of the day is lol) or spending time with God. Whatever you choose to do, the point is REST.
...The question is then who is Israel? Who are those who walk with God? His Sabbath is a blessing. It is a 24 hour blessing. His paths of holyness lead to a joyful life.
Interesting question: "Who is Israel?"
According to the Bible, I am grafted into Israel, so I am part of Israel along with all believers who do not disqualify Israel as His.
As far as saying that you have lost the concept of Sunday-sabbath, Sunday never was a biblical sabbath anyway, so you haven't lost anything.
Regarding tithing, read about it in the Bible rather than in common literature. The tithe was a way that farmers gave in order to feed the priests and the hungry, and the giver was invited to join in. It was a big barbecue, and all the food and drink, not money, was given away. The only play money had in it was when someone lived too far from the Temple, so they brought money instead of livestock or food. The money was then spent by the tither, in order to buy whatever the heart desired, then that was given, and they joined in, eating.
That does not give anyone entitlement to be stingy, however. People in the Bible were known to give so much that the priests would have to tell them to stop giving!
__________________ Who can speak of His mighty deeds or show all His praise? How blessed are those who keep justice,
I have a question to all those people who say that keeping the Sabbath Day holy is not important anymore! Firstly why is it that when you break the other commandments then its wrong but if you break the Sabbath then it's ok, because God just happen to love us and he condones it? We are not allowed to murder or commit adultary but if we don't keep Sabbath as God so clearly says, REMEMBER (in none of the other ones does he say REMEMBER) then it's ok! Secondly If I'm getting marring on 1 August but I arrive there the next day, do you think my future (maybe ex) husband will be ok with it? I mean if I just arrive any day I feel like it, but hey I still love him, does that make it ok!? Also if you read in Is 66: 23 you read that in the new Jerusalem that we will worship from one Sabbath to another. Do you not think that if we will keep Sabbath in the Heaven that it is actually important?
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