| Christian History The forum to discuss the history of the Christian church. |
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14th August 2008, 04:28 PM
|  | have you not read,what God has spoken unto you?
     
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Reps: 2,094,389,573,611,522,304 (power: 2,094,389,573,611,544) | | Originally Posted by Uphill Battle  nobody's making you bow to an "idol" simon.
nobody can take away Icons from the other side either. Nope they sure aren't making me...I wouldn't for fear of offending my maker.
Oh yeah someone can take away the icons.
-God, the history as written in the OT shows as much and God is the same yesterday today and forever.
They offend Him that much is clear in scripture you can choose not to speak up against it but I won't be so quiet.
Peace.
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It is better to speak the truth that hurts than falsehoods that comfort.
It is better to be divided by truth than united in sin.
It is better to be hated for telling the truth than liked for telling a lie.
It is better to stand alone with truth, than be wrong with the multitude.
~A Rogers
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14th August 2008, 04:33 PM
| | | Originally Posted by Philothei How is kissing an icon or let us say the crucifix the same as kissing the idol of Zeus?
The Jews opposed to kissing ANY Christian symbol (although the Orthdox Jews kiss the Shema every time they go in and out from their homes) an idol... because Christ was a "blasphemere" since God had no son.. Not because they objected it be an idol...They had other motives for rejecting Christ. The icons was the "icing on the cake" in their proving that He had nothing to do with "their" God and Christians were worshiping a false god... an idol...
But this was all nice a dandy to do....
kissing a schroll....venerating it ... I can say they worship it if i wanted to be picky could I??
Or also kissing the Torah... 
or a muslim woman kissing the Koran... 
How this is different? Are these good folks worshiping the book?? or their content?
You decide...
I tend to agree with you on this.
I personally believe that the use of Icons is wholly unnecessary... but I would say that the same vein of "worship" is given the word of God itself. |
14th August 2008, 04:34 PM
| | have you not read,what God has spoken unto you?
| | Join Date: 17th April 2006 Location: Minnesota
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Reps: 2,094,389,573,611,522,304 (power: 2,094,389,573,611,544) | | Originally Posted by Anglian Dear Simon,
Let us examine this word 'worship' you use so readily.
Readily????????????
You guys have been trying to back me into a corner for this very purpose that much is obvious, 200 Plus posts the accusations of worship did not come from my mouth it actually came from your putting words in my mouth, so now it is READILY.
You have no desire to discuss the valid points of this topic and have not a bit.
__________________
It is better to speak the truth that hurts than falsehoods that comfort.
It is better to be divided by truth than united in sin.
It is better to be hated for telling the truth than liked for telling a lie.
It is better to stand alone with truth, than be wrong with the multitude.
~A Rogers
|
14th August 2008, 04:35 PM
| | | Originally Posted by simonthezealot Nope they sure aren't making me...I wouldn't for fear of offending my maker.
Oh yeah someone can take away the icons.
-God, the history as written in the OT shows as much and God is the same yesterday today and forever.
They offend Him that much is clear in scripture you can choose not to speak up against it but I won't be so quiet.
Peace.
Simon, nobody ever figured that you'd be quiet... don't worry! 
and I think you are confusing Roman Catholicism with the Orthodox in this one matter. |
14th August 2008, 04:35 PM
| | have you not read,what God has spoken unto you?
| | Join Date: 17th April 2006 Location: Minnesota
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Reps: 2,094,389,573,611,522,304 (power: 2,094,389,573,611,544) | | Originally Posted by Uphill Battle ... but I would say that the same vein of "worship" is given the word of God itself.
Yes with some even though it shouldn't be.
__________________
It is better to speak the truth that hurts than falsehoods that comfort.
It is better to be divided by truth than united in sin.
It is better to be hated for telling the truth than liked for telling a lie.
It is better to stand alone with truth, than be wrong with the multitude.
~A Rogers
|
14th August 2008, 04:38 PM
| | | | how much respect do you apply to the word of God? |
14th August 2008, 04:43 PM
| | have you not read,what God has spoken unto you?
| | Join Date: 17th April 2006 Location: Minnesota
Posts: 14,867
Blessings: 52,930,734 My Mood
Reps: 2,094,389,573,611,522,304 (power: 2,094,389,573,611,544) | | Originally Posted by Uphill Battle Simon, nobody ever figured that you'd be quiet... don't worry!
and I think you are confusing Roman Catholicism with the Orthodox in this one matter.
Good one UB, and your right no probably ever would figure that.
Nope disgruntled with both the same as the both have a required allegiance to the council of 787. They both face the same unscriptural issues regarding relics and icons.
__________________
It is better to speak the truth that hurts than falsehoods that comfort.
It is better to be divided by truth than united in sin.
It is better to be hated for telling the truth than liked for telling a lie.
It is better to stand alone with truth, than be wrong with the multitude.
~A Rogers
|
14th August 2008, 04:47 PM
| | have you not read,what God has spoken unto you?
| | Join Date: 17th April 2006 Location: Minnesota
Posts: 14,867
Blessings: 52,930,734 My Mood
Reps: 2,094,389,573,611,522,304 (power: 2,094,389,573,611,544) | | Originally Posted by Uphill Battle how much respect do you apply to the word of God? Your speaking of kissing the bible and such I assumed? well put it this way I have never kissed my bible...I don't tiz out if I drop it on the floor...
Nor would I ever show veneration to the book any more than looking to the sky and praising my Lord for giving a us a way for HIM to communicate to us.
__________________
It is better to speak the truth that hurts than falsehoods that comfort.
It is better to be divided by truth than united in sin.
It is better to be hated for telling the truth than liked for telling a lie.
It is better to stand alone with truth, than be wrong with the multitude.
~A Rogers
|
14th August 2008, 05:45 PM
|  | let us love one another, for love is of God
57  
| | Join Date: 21st October 2007 Location: Held
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Reps: 277,563,643,894,892,704 (power: 277,563,643,894,905) | | Originally Posted by simonthezealot Readily????????????
You guys have been trying to back me into a corner for this very purpose that much is obvious, 200 Plus posts the accusations of worship did not come from my mouth it actually came from your putting words in my mouth, so now it is READILY.
You have no desire to discuss the valid points of this topic and have not a bit. Dear Simon,
I have tried, in quite a few posts now to have a serious discussion with you. You, in turn, have seized on one word, without in any way engaging with the ideas put forward in those posts.
No one is trying to back you into any corner. You have been claiming that worship and veneration are practically synonymous; I have tried to show you why we think they are not. You asked questions, I have tried to provide some detailed answers. I am unsure whether you are interested in a serious discussion, but if you are, I shall look forward to some engagement with the ideas and arguments.
Peace,
Anglian
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14th August 2008, 05:47 PM
|  | The Dude Abides
  
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Reps: 9,223,372,036,854,775,808 (power: 9,223,372,036,854,808) | | Originally Posted by simonthezealot Readily????????????
You guys have been trying to back me into a corner for this very purpose that much is obvious, 200 Plus posts the accusations of worship did not come from my mouth it actually came from your putting words in my mouth, so now it is READILY.
You have no desire to discuss the valid points of this topic and have not a bit.
I'M the one who claims veneration is worship, & that the invention of equating intention with acceptable degrees thereof is vain imagination.
The One True Holy Roman & Apostolic Church articulates this folly in their online encyclopedia.
At this point (since at LEAST 1054)it is self-defeating to refer to "The Church" as one thing in complete agreement with itself.
Simon, I can't figure out from reading exactly what the claim & contention about Jeroboam was.
__________________ Dear Optimist, Pessimist, & Realist...
While you were arguing about the glass of water, I drank it!
Sincerely,
The Opportunist
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