| Archived - Ethics & Morality Archived threads from Ethics & Morality |
18th June 2008, 07:30 PM
|  | Nihilist Extrodinaire
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Reps: 90,202,544,509,276,112 (power: 90,202,544,509,284) | | Originally Posted by Athene  It doesn't mean treating someone unfairly for personal gain?
*sigh* re-read my initial response on what exploitation means in political economic discourse. |
18th June 2008, 07:32 PM
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Reps: 442,931,412,538 (power: 442,931,422) | | Originally Posted by Gracchus Resources become limitless? That is not the real world. 
No but it is the real universe.
It is a large place and it is chock full of resources.
This is science fiction we are talking about, not what is going to happen inthe next few decades.
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18th June 2008, 07:37 PM
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Reps: 442,931,412,538 (power: 442,931,422) | | Originally Posted by Eudaimonist
Land, art, entertainment, ideas. Man does not live by bread alone.
But Land is not in short supply, and artists and musicians would have no need to sell their work as they would have nothing to spend their money on.
It takes a leap of imagination to imagine a society with limitless resources and no need for money, but it is an interesting exercise and Iain M. Banks has done it very well, I commend his sci-fiction novels and I am not a fan of the genre as an whole.
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" The result, therefore, of this physical enquiry is that we find no vestige of a beginning, no prospect of an end" James Hutton, from his 1788 paper to the Royal Society of Edinburgh on the principles of geology |
18th June 2008, 07:41 PM
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Reps: 442,931,412,538 (power: 442,931,422) | | Originally Posted by Isambard You have it backwards friend. Socialism and social policies are dying across the globe via the retrenchment of Keynsian compromises. Unadulterated capital mobility is also spelling the death for socialism as its now almost an impossibility to use a fordist model for national economics without getting stagflation no matter how committed the politicians are. (See 1970s France under the socialists)
I am thinking rather more long term than you 
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A scientist, it's official
" The result, therefore, of this physical enquiry is that we find no vestige of a beginning, no prospect of an end" James Hutton, from his 1788 paper to the Royal Society of Edinburgh on the principles of geology |
18th June 2008, 07:59 PM
| | Nihilist Extrodinaire
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Reps: 90,202,544,509,276,112 (power: 90,202,544,509,284) | | Originally Posted by Baggins I am thinking rather more long term than you
If by longer term, you mean some 1000+yrs in the future after civilization has collapsed and the world is ruled by giant radioactive ants, then sure. I guess we would have to pool our resources to fight our 6legged overlords  |
18th June 2008, 08:05 PM
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Isambard Exploitation is relative to the theortical framework you're using. If you have your Marxist hat on, then you are absolutely correct. Even in the boom of returns and rights for workers during the golden age of tripartite corporatism, it is still exploitation of the workers in marxists eyes as workers are generating surplus value but arnt being paid for it. This is known as labour theory.
If you are a functionalist, surplus value doesnt exist, ergo, exploitation doesnt exist because profit derives from the collection of dues earned by the non-worker aspects of the production and selling process. So a business owner's $$ comes from the risk he partook in to get the business started as well as innovation in selling techniques, management etc etc. This view of value is known as marginalization theory.
Personally, I think both are bogus as they they rely on fallacies, and you get hilarious errors if applied to the world non-post hoc.
You are way ahead of me, my views are much more organic. I just see an inequity and it doesn't sit well. I would probably fall into the labour theory side of it. However, I do believe innovation should be rewarded, but also think capitalism supresses innovation as much as it rewards it.
Anyway, I'd like to know more of the fallacies and hilarity you mention. |
18th June 2008, 08:32 PM
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Reps: 442,931,412,538 (power: 442,931,422) | | Originally Posted by Isambard If by longer term, you mean some 1000+yrs in the future after civilization has collapsed and the world is ruled by giant radioactive ants, then sure. I guess we would have to pool our resources to fight our 6legged overlords
I for one will welcome our six legged overlords and help them impliment their Formician plans.
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" The result, therefore, of this physical enquiry is that we find no vestige of a beginning, no prospect of an end" James Hutton, from his 1788 paper to the Royal Society of Edinburgh on the principles of geology |
18th June 2008, 09:58 PM
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Reps: 231,212,662,613,935,360 (power: 231,212,662,613,954) | | Originally Posted by Isambard You have it backwards friend. Socialism and social policies are dying across the globe via the retrenchment of Keynsian compromises. Unadulterated capital mobility is also spelling the death for socialism as its now almost an impossibility to use a fordist model for national economics without getting stagflation no matter how committed the politicians are. (See 1970s France under the socialists) If that's true, than I weep for the common man and women and their future. Why? Because Capitalism just doesn’t care about them or the ecology. The only thing Capitalism cares about are profits. Period!! .
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20th June 2008, 07:06 PM
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by dlamberth If that's true, than I weep for the common man and women and their future. Why? Because Capitalism just doesn’t care about them or the ecology. The only thing Capitalism cares about are profits. Period!!
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Have you read the book or it's movie called "The Corporation". It basically diagnoses corporations as sociopaths. Very compelling read and movie...though I liked the book more. |
20th June 2008, 07:49 PM
|  | Reverencing the Exalted Spirit of Man
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Reps: 440,945,404,461,670,976 (power: 440,945,404,461,699) | | Originally Posted by dlamberth If that's true, than I weep for the common man and women and their future. Why? Because Capitalism just doesn’t care about them or the ecology. The only thing Capitalism cares about are profits. Period!!
There is no entity "Capitalism". There are the varying views of individual capitalists, and I think it is prejudiced to think that they all don't care about the common man and the ecology. This is just as prejudiced as to say that all poor people are thieves.
I say we end prejudice. eudaimonia,
Mark
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