Questions by Non-Christians (Archived)This forum is for non-believers seeking to know more about Christianity. This forum is NOT for Apologetics or debates.
Is Jesus your potential? Meaning is it your goal to become like Him?
it is a goal of mine, yes, except i want to marry. Other parts of his character I am striving to be like.
Or are Christians waiting for the "final days"? When their Messiah will come and take them home, away from all those who do not believe like them?
Christians are waiting for Jesus to return, but not in order to take us away from other people, but rather to be with the Lord.
I am not here to argue. Only curious as I never really understood what Christians are about or why there are so many denominations. Is there an underlying commonality between all the different churches?
That all depends, as what is called "unorthodox theology" has nothing really in common with Christianity.
You will find true Christianity in churches where the Bible is fully believed, fully accepted, and one does not believe a new doctrine must be added. Where the Bible is believed to be the only truly God-inspired, God-breathed Word of God. In these churches you will find that the Christians believe Jesus to be the only way to God, and that Christians must live by faith for the Lord, and not for self.
p.s. I once believed in Jesus, but I left the faith because the Christians I knew, had only a desire for triumph. At the moment, I would say I am a very beginning Buddhist.
Could you explain this about triumph? If you really want Jesus and believe a Christian should set a good example, then the only way to do this is follow Him and do as the Word says striving to worship the Lord in spirit and in truth, which means wholeheartedly in thoughts and actions.. Jesus does not reject those who truly humbly go to Him.
Is Jesus your potential? Meaning is it your goal to become like Him?
Pretty much, yeah.
2 Cor 3:18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit
Or are Christians waiting for the "final days"? When their Messiah will come and take them home, away from all those who do not believe like them?
I hope not. That's pretty lazy.
On a serious note, the above passage says we are "being transformed into the same image." Right now. And that takes work.
I am not here to argue. Only curious as I never really understood what Christians are about or why there are so many denominations. Is there an underlying commonality between all the different churches?
There are so many denominations...I don't know. But it shouldn't be that way.
The truth is the truth.
p.s. I once believed in Jesus, but I left the faith because the Christians I knew, had only a desire for triumph. At the moment, I would say I am a very beginning Buddhist.
A pastor once used this illustration:
[a backslider tells the pastor the reason he left Christianity was because of the hypocrisy in his last church]
"Christians follow Christ, not other Christians. If a hypocrite comes between you and God, who is closer to God?"
Just because other people cannot follow the truth, does not make the truth any less true.
__________________ The question: "What would you do if you were totally sold out for Jesus?"
Jesus' answer:
“He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. ... He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it."
A spring of hot water can heal, a spring of cold water can refresh, but a pool of lukewarm water causes sickness.
Are you sold out for Jesus, or just a Christian?
Is Jesus your potential? Meaning is it your goal to become like Him?
Or are Christians waiting for the "final days"? When their Messiah will come and take them home, away from all those who do not believe like them?
I am not here to argue. Only curious as I never really understood what Christians are about or why there are so many denominations. Is there an underlying commonality between all the different churches?
p.s. I once believed in Jesus, but I left the faith because the Christians I knew, had only a desire for triumph. At the moment, I would say I am a very beginning Buddhist.
nop!
I only believe in Jesus because I need to go to Heaven, I am tried of this Earth and hate it!
Jehovah's Witness are the one who believe in him so they can "govern in heaven", however they believe in GoD...they rarely mention Jesus
Is Jesus your potential? Meaning is it your goal to become like Him?
I would like to be like Him, that is I would like to be able to say "I do always those things that please the father".
The christian is assured that we are being conformed into Christs image. It is not us who does this, it is He Who does this in us.
__________________
Jesus said: It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you are spirit and are life.
Last edited by calidog; 22nd May 2008 at 10:40 AM.
Well, what do you mean that the christians you knew only wanted to triumph? I'm a christian spiritually first and intellectually second because of the overwhelming evidence there is of the Bible compared to all books that exist in this world. As a start Evidence that Demands A Verdict by Josh McDowell (it would stand up in a court of law) and Examine the Evidence by Muncaster(a former athiest). Also, www.reasons.org - concerning science and belief. The Bible could only be written by God as one of its characteristics include having hundreds of detailed prophesies that has been fulfilled and more to come.
Biblical Evidence – This is a very small amount of information out of large amounts of information out there.
Internal Evidences-Prophesies that are confirmed with Bible;
mentioning only a few – but there are hundreds.
Life of Christ The Tribe of Judah, Gen. 49:10, Luke 3:23-28 (Genesis was written 4004 BC to 1689 BC) (Luke’s time period is 60-70 AD)
Royal Line of David, Jer 23:5, Matt 1:1 (Jeremiah 760 to 698 BC)/(Matthew 60-70 AD)
Born of a Virgin, Isaiah 7:14/Matt 1:18-23 (Isaiah 760 to 698 BC)/(60-70 AD)
Rise of Empires In the book of Daniel, Chapter 2 – four kingdoms are described in the interpretation of the dream of Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon: Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greek – Daniel 8:21, 10:20/ and a fourth great kingdom to follow which was part iron and clay – which is the Roman Empire – during this empire, Christ came and the church was established – Daniel 2:44.
Historical Accuracy
The Bible is loaded with historical statements concerning events of hundreds of years ago, yet none of them has been proven to be incorrect. (Bible compared to other ancient documents) New Testament – starts at 25 years – between the original and surviving copies Homer- starts at 500 years/Demosthenes – at 1400 years/Plato – at 1200 years/ Caesar – at 1000 years
Consistency – Written by 40 men over a period of time exceeding 1400 years, and has no Internal inconsistencies.
Claim of Inspiration- It claims to be spoken by God, 2 Tim 3:16-17). No other religious book makes such claims.
External Evidences
(Prophesies Outside the Bible) These cities were prophesied to be destroyed and never to be built again- and they haven’t. Niveveh – Nahum 1:10, 3:7, 15, Zephaniah 2:13-14 Babylon – Isaiah 13:1-22 Tyre -Ezekiel 26:1-28
Bible before Science
He hangs the earth on nothing – Job 26:7 (Job was written at least 1000 years ago – some scholars think it could have been even 3000 years ago) Note: Man only knew the above for 350 years. Earth is a sphere – Isaiah 40:22/Air has weight – Job 28:25/ Gravity – Job 26:7, Job 38: 31-33/Winds blow in cyclones, Eccl 1:6
Documents that Prove Bible is True
Gilgamesh Epic, The Sumerian King List, Mari Tablets, Babylonian Chronicles
Archealogical Evidence (Still adding to this list today- it hasn’t stopped) Excavations of Ur, Location of Zoar, Ziggurats and the foundation of Tower of Babel
***Yes, Christ's Second Coming will be happening soon. If you interested in biblical prophesy, I will email you concerning this website.
[quote=obscure101;46838216] Or are Christians waiting for the "final days"? When their Messiah will come and take them home, away from all those who do not believe like them?quote]
I disagree with your view that Jesus (pbuh) will come and take them home, away from all those who do not believe like them
Please take the time to read Matthew 7:22
Matthew 7:22 - Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? Matthew 7:23 - Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you evildoers!'"
Jeses will be coming again but not to take the Christians away from the non-believers but to testify against the Christians. The Christians will say to Jesus didn’t we do so many things for you? We looked after lepers, we brought these backward nations to your religion, baptised them in your name, we built orphanages for them, hospitals for them, we educated them, took out devils from them in your name, didn’t we do all these things in your (jesus’) name?
He Jesus will say to them get away from me you rubbish I don’t even know you! And that’s why he’s coming to tell them (Chrisitans) they are off the track. He’s not going to say to the Jews get away you rubbish nor to the Muslims get away you rubbish nor to the Hindus get away you rubbish because they do not do things in the name of Jesus – he’s going to say it to the Christians get away from me – you who say Jesus is God… get away from me I don’t even know you because you are off the track instead of worshipping the one true god in heaven alone with no partners you worshipped me and I didn’t ask you to do that.
The mistake made by Christians is that they made the man Jesus into God. Jesus was a man but a man chosen by God to be his prophet just like Adam, Moses, Abraham, Solomon and all those before him were prophets. There is no single clear unequivocal statement in the bible where Jesus says I am God, Worship me.
The Jews went astray from Gods message so God sent Jesus to put their house in order. Similarly the Christians went astray from Gods message by making Jesus into God so God sent Muhammad (pbuh) as the final seal of prophets to correct those gone astray. Have you ever read the Quran? Islam is the only religion (aside from Christianity) that glorifies Jesus! We believe he is one of the mightiest messengers of God, We believe in his miraculous birth which many modern day Christians don’t believe, we believe that he gave life to the dead by Gods permission, and he healed those blind and lepers by Gods permission. (notice the difference Christians say he did these miracles because he was God Muslims say he was a man, a prophet and did these miracles by Gods permission)
Remember when the angles said: “O Mary! Verily, Allah gives you glad tidings of a word from Him, his name will be Messiah Isa (Jesus), the son of Mary, held in honour in this world and in the hereafter, and will be one of those who are near to Allah,” “He will speak to people, in the cradle and in manhood, and he will be one of the righteous. She (Mary) said: “O my Lord! How shall I have a son when no man has touched me” He said: “So it will be for Allah creates what he wills. When He says to it only: Be!” – and it is. And He (Allah) will teach him (Jesus) the Book and faultless speech of the prophets wisdom. And will make him (Jesus) a messenger to the Children of Israel saying “I have come to you with a sign from your Lord, that I design for you out of clay, a figure like that of a bird, and breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Allah’s permission; and I heal him who was born blind, and the leper, and I bring the dead to life by Allah permission. And I inform you of what you eat, and what you store in your houses. Surely, in that is a sign for you, if you are believers. “And I have come conforming that which was before me of the Torah, and to make lawful to you part of what was forbidden to you, and I have come to you with a proof from your Lord. So fear Allah and obey me. “Truly, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him alone. This is a straight path.” Quran 3: 45-51
And because of their sayings “We killed Jesus son of Mary, the messenger of Allah” – but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but it appeared so to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no certain knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely, they killed him (Jesus) not. But Allah raised him (Jesus) up to himself and Allah is Ever All-Powerful, All Wise. Quran 4: 157-158
Or are Christians waiting for the "final days"? When their Messiah will come and take them home, away from all those who do not believe like them?quote]
I disagree with your view that Jesus (pbuh) will come and take them home, away from all those who do not believe like them
Please take the time to read Matthew 7:22
Matthew 7:22 - Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? Matthew 7:23 - Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you evildoers!'"
Jeses will be coming again but not to take the Christians away from the non-believers but to testify against the Christians. The Christians will say to Jesus didn’t we do so many things for you? We looked after lepers, we brought these backward nations to your religion, baptised them in your name, we built orphanages for them, hospitals for them, we educated them, took out devils from them in your name, didn’t we do all these things in your (jesus’) name?
He Jesus will say to them get away from me you rubbish I don’t even know you! And that’s why he’s coming to tell them (Chrisitans) they are off the track. He’s not going to say to the Jews get away you rubbish nor to the Muslims get away you rubbish nor to the Hindus get away you rubbish because they do not do things in the name of Jesus – he’s going to say it to the Christians get away from me – you who say Jesus is God… get away from me I don’t even know you because you are off the track instead of worshipping the one true god in heaven alone with no partners you worshipped me and I didn’t ask you to do that.
The mistake made by Christians is that they made the man Jesus into God. Jesus was a man but a man chosen by God to be his prophet just like Adam, Moses, Abraham, Solomon and all those before him were prophets. There is no single clear unequivocal statement in the bible where Jesus says I am God, Worship me.
The Jews went astray from Gods message so God sent Jesus to put their house in order. Similarly the Christians went astray from Gods message by making Jesus into God so God sent Muhammad (pbuh) as the final seal of prophets to correct those gone astray. Have you ever read the Quran? Islam is the only religion (aside from Christianity) that glorifies Jesus! We believe he is one of the mightiest messengers of God, We believe in his miraculous birth which many modern day Christians don’t believe, we believe that he gave life to the dead by Gods permission, and he healed those blind and lepers by Gods permission. (notice the difference Christians say he did these miracles because he was God Muslims say he was a man, a prophet and did these miracles by Gods permission)
Remember when the angles said: “O Mary! Verily, Allah gives you glad tidings of a word from Him, his name will be Messiah Isa (Jesus), the son of Mary, held in honour in this world and in the hereafter, and will be one of those who are near to Allah,” “He will speak to people, in the cradle and in manhood, and he will be one of the righteous. She (Mary) said: “O my Lord! How shall I have a son when no man has touched me” He said: “So it will be for Allah creates what he wills. When He says to it only: Be!” – and it is. And He (Allah) will teach him (Jesus) the Book and faultless speech of the prophets wisdom. And will make him (Jesus) a messenger to the Children of Israel saying “I have come to you with a sign from your Lord, that I design for you out of clay, a figure like that of a bird, and breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Allah’s permission; and I heal him who was born blind, and the leper, and I bring the dead to life by Allah permission. And I inform you of what you eat, and what you store in your houses. Surely, in that is a sign for you, if you are believers. “And I have come conforming that which was before me of the Torah, and to make lawful to you part of what was forbidden to you, and I have come to you with a proof from your Lord. So fear Allah and obey me. “Truly, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him alone. This is a straight path.” Quran 3: 45-51
And because of their sayings “We killed Jesus son of Mary, the messenger of Allah” – but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but it appeared so to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no certain knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely, they killed him (Jesus) not. But Allah raised him (Jesus) up to himself and Allah is Ever All-Powerful, All Wise. Quran 4: 157-158
It is a contradiction to use the Bible to support the Quran. Islam does not support the Bible. Jesus will turn away all who did not follow His teachings, not just phony Christians. Jesus said "I am the Way, the Truth, the Life, and no man comes to the Father but by me." John 14:6
Therefore, Buddha, Mohammed, etc cannot lead you to God. Jesus makes it clear that only through Him we have assurance of salvation, yet Mohammed makes no such claim, but in fact teaches that his followers should to do good deeds, and there is maybe a possibility of entering heaven if the deeds are good enough.
Jesus is more than a prophet, He was the only begotten son of God (John 3:16) born of a virgin, and raised from the dead on the third day.
I don't know about you, but I would rather follow a leader that gives assured salvation, than somebody that says if you follow him, maybe or maybe not everything will be okay..
As for me, indeed, I await with joy the opportunity to be One with my Creator. (Gospel of John, chapter 17, verses 20 through 23.) I know for sure that many churches do not agree -- but this is inherent in the situation at present. All know of Him, but only in part.
J.E.B.
Originally Posted by obscure101
Thank you for the response.
I am not quite sure exactly what you are saying, it sounds as though Jesus is possibly your potential but only after full admittance of your inherent sinfulness. Is the opportunity to be One with the Creator (as you believe Jesus Is) an experience to be waited for, upon death?
About the commonality of the Churches, is it your feeling that virtually all would agree?
I realize I am not perfect so no-one has to read any ulterior motives in my words.
It is a contradiction to use the Bible to support the Quran. Islam does not support the Bible. Jesus will turn away all who did not follow His teachings, not just phony Christians. Jesus said "I am the Way, the Truth, the Life, and no man comes to the Father but by me." John 14:6
Therefore, Buddha, Mohammed, etc cannot lead you to God. Jesus makes it clear that only through Him we have assurance of salvation, yet Mohammed makes no such claim, but in fact teaches that his followers should to do good deeds, and there is maybe a possibility of entering heaven if the deeds are good enough.
Jesus is more than a prophet, He was the only begotten son of God (John 3:16) born of a virgin, and raised from the dead on the third day.
I don't know about you, but I would rather follow a leader that gives assured salvation, than somebody that says if you follow him, maybe or maybe not everything will be okay..
"I am the Way, the Truth, the Life, and no man comes to the Father but by me." John 14:6
You have quoted John 14:6 out of context. You should always check the context of the verses. For the context of John 14:6 go to John 14:1 onwards where Jesus says In my Fathers house a various mansions, many mansions are there. If it were no so I would not have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. And you know where I am going, and you know the way. Thomas asked him Lord we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way? So Jesus says I am the way the truth and the life no one comes to the father but by me.
I agree with that statement – Jesus was the way the truth and the life no one came to god but by him. But during his time. Every messenger in his time was the way the truth and the light. At the time of Moses, he Moses, was the way the truth and the life. At the time of Abraham, he Abraham, was the way the truth and the life and so on with all the messengers in their time.
The context is if you are following me you are following God. If you continue reading John it says… but we have not seen God so Jesus says he that has seen me has seen God. Meaning if you follow my commandment you are following the commandments of God. John 14: 1 gives the context - Jesus doesn’t say in MY house are many mansions he says in My fathers house are many mansions. He is not talking about himself he is talking about god. If you follow the example of Jesus you are following god. Thomas had misunderstood and was thinking of a geographical location (way) but the way was not geographical the way was following the example of Jesus. And jesus' example was not to worship him as God and in his second coming he will deny those who worship him - Matthew 7:22
Please prove that Mohammed doesn’t make this claim? He is the way the truth and the life. Since he supersedes all previous messengers – he is now the only way, truth, life.
What does begotten mean?
If Jesus is god then does that mean Adam is a greater God? since he had no father and no mother and was not in a woman’s womb for nine months and then born of child birth
Did Jesus rise from the dead on the third day? Read the bible Jesus did not fulfil the sign of Jonah. Check Mathhew 12: 30-40. The son of man was not 3 days and three nights in the heart of the earth…. Friday night, Saturday morning, Saturday night. So jesus was two nights and one day in the heart of the earth not three days and three nights. This proves that jesus was not crucified since Jonah was Alive in the belly of the whale and jesus said like jonah was three days and three nights so shall I….
Linear Mode
