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  #21  
Old 17th August 2004, 06:26 PM
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The fabled and distinguished chief of naval operations (CNO), Admiral Elmo Zumwalt, said -- 30 years ago when he was still CNO -- that during his own command of US naval forces in Vietnam, just prior to his anointment as CNO, young Kerry had created great problems for him and the other top brass, by killing so many non-combatant civilians and going after other non-military targets.





"We had virtually to straight-jacket him to keep him under control," the admiral said. "Bud" Zumwalt got it right when he assessed Kerry as having large ambitions -- but promised that his career in Vietnam would haunt him if he were ever on the national stage.




“John Kerry just bet the farm on a fairy-tale version of his Vietnam service, figuring, no doubt, that it always worked for him before. What he doesn't realize is that huge numbers of veterans who didn't care if he was a Senator from the People's Republic of Massachusetts will crawl across broken glass to keep him from becoming Commander-in-Chief. That battle is now joined.” – Scott Swett, webmaster of WinterSoldier.com (7/31/04)



In 1992, John Kerry came to the defence of Bill Clinton, whose avoidance of service had become a campaign issue for George H. W. Bush.

“I'm here personally to express my anger, as a veteran,” Mr Kerry told National Public Radio, “that a president who would stand before this nation in his inaugural address and promise to put Vietnam behind us is now breaking yet another promise and trying to use Vietnam and service in order to get himself re-elected. That is not an act of leadership, that is an act of shame and cowardice.”


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  #22  
Old 17th August 2004, 07:07 PM
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[quote=Gunny][size=2][size=3]

The fabled and distinguished chief of naval operations (CNO), Admiral Elmo Zumwalt, said -- 30 years ago when he was still CNO -- that during his own command of US naval forces in Vietnam, just prior to his anointment as CNO, young Kerry had created great problems for him and the other top brass, by killing so many non-combatant civilians and going after other non-military targets.

Well which is it Kerry didn't do squat or Kerry was to agressive?
Much of Nam was a free fire zone. That made everything a target.
Atacks came from all directions and soldiers reacted accordingly.

We the People sent a lot of troops there and we killed a lot of people.
Civilians, well that is a tough call. In large measure civilians were who we were fighting for and against.

Kerry came back convinced we were doing the wrong thing there.
He stood up and layed it out for the people.
Are we surprised that Brass and hawks alike take a dim view.
Still there are brass who don't want America to go that way again.
It is a mixed bag.
There is no reason to demonize Kerry.
This is only an attempt to mobilize for political gain, at the expense of more resonable truth.
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"Back in 2000 a Republican friend warned me that if I voted for Al Gore and he won, the stock market would tank, we'd lose millions of jobs, and our military would be totally overstretched. You know what? I did vote for Gore, he did win, and I'll be shocked if all those things didn't come true!" --James Carville
  #23  
Old 17th August 2004, 07:36 PM
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...still not convinced it was the wrong one.

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Originally Posted by daidhaid
You guys are going to hard on this.
It's wrong to slash and burn on Kerry because he is not your candidate.
Your opinions are questionable athe the very least they are controversial and open to debate.
Does that mean you shouldn't slash and burn on Bush?
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  #24  
Old 17th August 2004, 07:42 PM
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"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth has been formed to counter the false "war crimes" charges John Kerry repeatedly made against Vietnam veterans who served in our units and elsewhere, and to accurately portray Kerry's brief tour in Vietnam as a junior grade Lieutenant. We speak from personal experience -- our group includes men who served beside Kerry in combat as well as his commanders. Though we come from different backgrounds and hold varying political opinions, we agree on one thing: John Kerry misrepresented his record and ours in Vietnam and therefore exhibits serious flaws in character and lacks the potential to lead.

We regret the need to do this. Most Swift boat veterans would like nothing better than to support one of our own for America's highest office, regardless of whether he was running as a Democrat or a Republican. However, Kerry's phony war crimes charges, his exaggerated claims about his own service in Vietnam, and his deliberate misrepresentation of the nature and effectiveness of Swift boat operations compels us to step forward.

For more than thirty years, most Vietnam veterans kept silent as we were maligned as misfits, addicts, and baby killers. Now that a key creator of that poisonous image is seeking the Presidency we have resolved to end our silence. "

The time has come to set the record straight.
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  #25  
Old 17th August 2004, 07:50 PM
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Swift Veterans Quotes



"We resent very deeply the false war crimes charges he made coming back from Vietnam in 1971 and repeated in the book "Tour of Duty." We think those cast an aspersion on all those living and dead, from our unit and other units in Vietnam. We think that he knew he was lying when he made the charges, and we think that they're unsupportable. We intend to bring the truth about that to the American people.

We believe, based on our experience with him, that he is totally unfit to be the Commander-in-Chief."



-- John O'Neill, spokesman, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth







"I do not believe John Kerry is fit to be Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces of the United States. This is not a political issue. It is a matter of his judgment, truthfulness, reliability, loyalty and trust -- all absolute tenets of command. His biography, 'Tour of Duty,' by Douglas Brinkley, is replete with gross exaggerations, distortions of fact, contradictions and slanderous lies. His contempt for the military and authority is evident by even a most casual review of this biography. He arrived in-country with a strong anti-Vietnam War bias and a self-serving determination to build a foundation for his political future. He was aggressive, but vain and prone to impulsive judgment, often with disregard for specific tactical assignments. He was a 'loose cannon.' In an abbreviated tour of four months and 12 days, and with his specious medals secure, Lt.(jg) Kerry bugged out and began his infamous betrayal of all United States forces in the Vietnam War. That included our soldiers, our marines, our sailors, our coast guardsmen, our airmen, and our POWs. His leadership within the so-called Vietnam Veterans Against the War and testimony before Congress in 1971 charging us with unspeakable atrocities remain an undocumented but nevertheless meticulous stain on the men and women who honorably stayed the course. Senator Kerry is not fit for command."



-- Rear Admiral Roy Hoffmann, USN (retired), chairman, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth







"During Lt.(jg) Kerry's tour, he was under my command for two or three specific operations, before his rapid exit. Trust, loyalty and judgment are the key, operative words. His turncoat performance in 1971 in his grubby shirt and his medal-tossing escapade, coupled with his slanderous lines in the recent book portraying us that served, including all POWs and MIAs, as murderous war criminals, I believe, will have a lasting effect on all military veterans and their families.

Kerry would be described as devious, self-absorbing, manipulative, disdain for authority, disruptive, but the most common phrase that you'd hear is 'requires constant supervision.'" -- Captain Charles Plumly, USN (retired)




"While in Cam Rahn Bay, he trained on several 24-hour indoctrination missions, and one special skimmer operation with my most senior and trusted Lieutenant. The briefing from some members of that crew the morning after revealed that they had not received any enemy fire, and yet Lt.(jg) Kerry informed me of a wound -- he showed me a scratch on his arm and a piece of shrapnel in his hand that appeared to be from one of our own M-79s. It was later reported to me that Lt.(jg) Kerry had fired an M-79, and it had exploded off the adjacent shoreline. I do not recall being advised of any medical treatment, and probably said something like 'Forget it.' He later received a Purple Heart for that scratch, and I have no information as to how or whom.

Lt.(jg) Kerry was allowed to return to the good old USA after 4 months and a few days in-country, and then he proceeded to betray his former shipmates, calling them criminals who were committing atrocities. Today we are here to tell you that just the opposite is true. Our rules of engagement were quite strict, and the officers and men of Swift often did not even return fire when they were under fire if there was a possibility that innocent people -- fishermen, in a lot of cases -- might be hurt or injured. The rules and the good intentions of the men increased the possibility that we might take friendly casualties."
-- Commander Grant Hibbard, USN (retired)




"Lt. Kerry returned home from the war to make some outrageous statements and allegations... numerous criminal acts in violation of the law of war were cited by Kerry, disparaging those who had fought with honor in that conflict. Had war crimes been committed by US forces in Vietnam? Yes, but such acts were few and far between. Yet Lt. Kerry gave numerous speeches and testimony before Congress inappropriately leading his audiences to believe that what was only an anomaly in the conduct of America's fighting men was an epidemic. Furthermore, he suggested that they were being encouraged to violated the law of war by those within the chain of command.

Very specific orders, on file at the Vietnam archives at Texas Tech University, were issued by my father [Admiral Elmo Zumwalt] and others in his chain of command instructing subordinates to act responsibly in preserving the life and property of Vietnamese civilians." -- Lt. Col. James Zumwalt, USMC (retired)







"I served with these guys. I went on missions with them, and these men served honorably. Up and down the chain of command there was no acquiescence to atrocities. It was not condoned, it did not happen, and it was not reported to me verbally or in writing by any of these men including Lt.(jg) Kerry.

In 1971, '72, for almost 18 months, he stood before the television audiences and claimed that the 500,000 men and women in Vietnam, and in combat, were all villains -- there were no heroes. In 2004, one hero from the Vietnam War has appeared, running for President of the United States and Commander-in-Chief. It just galls one to think about it."
-- Captain George Elliott, USN (retired)





"During the Vietnam War I was Task Force Commander at An Thoi, and my tour of duty was 13 months, from the end of Tet to the beginning of the Vietnamization of the Navy units.

Now when I went there right after Tet, I was restricted in my movements. I couldn't go much of anyplace because the Vietcong controlled most of the area. When I left, I could go anywhere I wanted, just about. Commerce was booming, the buses were running, trucks were going, the waterways were filled with sampans with goods going to market, but yet in Kerry's biography he says that our operations were a complete failure. He also mentions a formal conference with me, to try to get more air cover and so on. That conference never happened..." -- Captain Adrian Lonsdale, USCG (retired)



"My name is Steve Gardner. I served in 1966 and 1967 on my first tour of duty in Vietnam on Swift boats, and I did my second tour in '68 and '69, involved with John Kerry in the last 2 1/2 months of my tour. The John Kerry that I know is not the John Kerry that everybody else is portraying. I served alongside him and behind him, five feet away from him in a gun tub, and watched as he made indecisive moves with our boat, put our boats in jeopardy, put our crews in jeopardy... if a man like that can't handle that 6-man crew boat, how can you expect him to be our Commander-in-Chief?"
-- Steven Gardner




"I served in Vietnam as a boat officer from June of 1968 to July of 1969. My service was three months in Coastal Division 13 out of Cat Lo, and nine months with Coastal Division 11 based in An Thoi. John Kerry was in An Thoi the same time I was. I'm here today to express the anger I have harbored for over 33 years, about being accused with my fellow shipmates of war atrocities.

All I can say is when I leave here today, I'm going down to the Wall to tell my two crew members it's not true, and that they and the other 49 Swiftees who are on the Wall were then and are still now the best." -- Robert Brant




Kerry, has made his four months and twelve days in country as a primary reason he has the capacity to be a strong Commander-In-Chief because his voting record in the Senate is of one who is very weak regarding National Defense. He can not stand on his record in the Senate nor his four months and twelve days in Vietnam to show that he is a strong leader.

Kerry, is the last thing these United States need at such a time as this.
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"I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

Genesis 12:3
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"Pray for the peace of Jerusalem; May those who love you be secure."

Psalms 122:6
NIV

"You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me".

John 5:39
NIV

Last edited by Gunny; 17th August 2004 at 08:01 PM.
  #26  
Old 17th August 2004, 09:36 PM
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on the other hand...

12 Generals and Admirals Endorse John Kerry

Boston, MA - In an unprecedented display of support from the military establishment, twelve retired generals and admirals endorsed John Kerry for president of the United States on Wednesday.

The endorsement comes on the day the convention is focused on the Kerry-Edwards plan to make a stronger, more secure America. General John Shalikashvili (Ret.) will speak at the Convention on Wednesday evening and be introduced by Lieutenant General Claudia Kennedy (Ret.). There will be a special video tribute to John Kerry featuring distinguished flag officers talking about what is at stake in this election and why they support John Kerry to build a strong America, respected in the world.

"Success in the global war on terror requires enlightened U.S. leadership – leadership that knows the importance of listening to and working with other countries. Senator Kerry is such a leader, and as Commander-in-Chief, he will adapt our military to the unprecedented security demands faced by our country and its armed forces," said Lieutenant General Daniel Christman (USA, Ret.)



The flag officers endorsing John Kerry are:

Lieutenant General Edward D. Baca (United States Army, Retired)

Baca served as Chief of the National Guard Bureau in Washington, D.C. where he was responsible for formulating, developing, and coordinating all policies, programs and plans affecting Army and Air National Guard personnel. During his tenure as head of the National Guard, Baca was one of the highest-ranking Latinos in the U.S. military. A native of New Mexico, Baca enlisted in the New Mexico Army National Guard in 1956, volunteered for service in Vietnam, and retired as a three-star general officer. Baca also served as the Adjutant General of the New Mexico National Guard where he exercised joint command over both the Army and Air National Guard of New Mexico.

“I am proud to have served our country in the military for over 41 years. I am even prouder that 4 of my children have worn the uniform of our armed forces. Three are still serving. As a combat veteran and proven leader, I know that John Kerry will never send them in harm’s way, without exhausting all means of diplomacy. Even then, it will be a last resort. God forbid if he ever has to, he will make sure that they are part of an armed force as best equipped, best training, and most respected in the world.”

Lieutenant General Daniel W. Christman (United States Army, Retired)

Christman served as the Superintendent of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point. He also served for two years as Assistant to the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, during which time he represented the U.S. as a member of NATO's Military Committee in Brussels, Belgium. He is a combat veteran of Southeast Asia where he commanded a company in the 101st Airborne Division. Christman was born on May 5, 1943 and is a native of Hudson, Ohio.

“Success in the global war on terror requires enlightened U.S. leadership – leadership that knows the importance of listening to and working with other countries. Senator Kerry is such a leader, and as Commander-in-Chief, he will adapt our military to the unprecedented security demands faced by our country and its armed forces.”

General Wesley K. Clark (United States Army, Retired)

Wesley Clark was born December 23rd 1944 in Chicago, Illinois, and raised in Little Rock, Arkansas. He graduated first in his class from the United States Military Academy at West Point in 1966 and received his Masters degree in Philosophy, Politics and Economics from Oxford University where he was a Rhodes Scholar. In the Army, Clark rose steadily through the ranks, culminating in his service as the Commander-in-Chief of US Southern Command from 1996 to 1997 and NATO Supreme Allied Commander from 1997 to 2000. He retired from the Army in 2000. Clark and his wife Gert live in Little Rock, Arkansas and have one son.

"I ask you to join me in standing up for an American who has given truly outstanding service to his country in peace and in war. John Kerry has the right message and right character to bring the nation forward. Both John and I served in Vietnam -- and know what it is to be tested on the battlefield, fighting for your country. John Kerry never quit fighting for his country."

Admiral William J. Crowe (United States Navy, Retired)

Crowe served as Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the highest ranking officer in the U.S. military. Prior to serving as Chairman, he served as Commander in Chief in several areas, including the U.S. Pacific Command, Allied Forces in Southern Europe, U.S. Naval Forces in Europe and the Middle East Forces. He was chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff from 1985 until his retirement from the Navy in 1989.

"The current administration has an overly simplistic view of how and when to use our military. By not bringing in our friends and allies, they have created a mess in Iraq and are crippling our forces around the world. John Kerry has a realistic understanding of the requirements of our military and the threats that we face."

Vice Admiral Lee F. Gunn (United States Navy, Retired)

Gunn served as the Inspector General of the Department of the Navy until his retirement in August 2000. Gunn commanded the USS BARBEY and the Destroyer Squadron “Thirty-one,” a component of the U.S. Navy's Anti-Submarine Warfare Destroyer Squadrons. Gunn is from Bakersfield, California and is a graduate of the University of California, Los Angeles. He received his commission from the Naval ROTC program at UCLA in June 1965.

"My son is a Navy sailor, my son-in-law is a Navy sailor, and my nephew is a Navy sailor. I want them, and all of America’s sons and daughters in uniform to have a new, wiser, better, and courageous commander-in-chief in John Kerry."

General Joseph Hoar (United States Marine Corps, Retired)

Hoar served as Commander-in-Chief, U.S. Central Command. After the first Gulf War, Hoar led the effort to enforce the naval embargo in the Red Sea and the Persian Gulf, enforce the no-fly zone in the south of Iraq. He oversaw the humanitarian and peacekeeping operations in Kenya and Somalia and also led the U.S. Marine Corps support for operations in Rwanda, and the evacuation of U.S. civilians from Yemen during the 1994 civil war. Hoar was the Deputy for Operations for the Marine Crops during the Gulf War and served as General Norman Schwartzkopf's Chief of Staff at Central Command. General Hoar was born in Boston, Massachusetts and graduated from Tufts University where he received his commission through the ROTC program.

"Sen. Kerry has demonstrated his courage in combat and his broad knowledge of international relations while in the Senate. He’s a leader who is not afraid to lead."

Lieutenant General Claudia J. Kennedy (United States Army, Retired)

Kennedy is the first and only woman to achieve the rank of three-star general in the United States Army. Kennedy also served as Deputy Chief of Staff for Army Intelligence, Commander of the U.S. Army Recruiting Command, and as Commander of the 703d military intelligence brigade in Kunia, Hawaii. She was born in Frankfurt, Germany, and earned her commission as a second lieutenant in June 1969 through the Women's Army Corps.

"John Kerry understands the future as it is framed by the international community and by the people at home. He will make the right decisions about education, defense, intelligence, economic development both foreign and domestic, and sustaining international relationships. He is a leader I trust."

Lieutenant General Donald Kerrick (United States Army, Retired)

Kerrick served as Deputy National Security Advisor to the President of the United States where he was responsible for developing, implementing, and managing United States foreign and national security policies. He was a principal negotiator on the international Bosnia Peace Delegation that ended the Bosnian War, and served on the Steering Committee for the Protection of United States Critical Infrastructure. Kerrick holds a Masters degree from the University of Southern California and a Bachelors degree from Florida Southern College. He was awarded an honorary Doctor of Diplomacy from Florida Southern College. Kerrick was born on April 1949 in Bethesda, Maryland and was raised in Islamorada, Florida.

"The miscalculations of the last three years have severely stressed our armed forces both around the world and here at home. John Kerry understands the military and war. He is the right leader at the right time to restore America’s credibility around the world."

General Merrill “Tony” A. McPeak (United States Air Force, Retired)

McPeak served as the Chief of Staff of the U.S. Air Force. Previously, McPeak served as Commander in Chief of the U.S. Pacific Air Forces. He is a command pilot, having flown more than 6,000 hours, principally in fighter aircraft. General McPeak was born January 9, 1936 in Santa Rosa, California and entered the Air Force in 1957 as a distinguished graduate of the San Diego State College ROTC program.

"I’m a registered independent, but I like and admire John Kerry. He simply has a great record of brave and skillful service to the country. He is sure to be a fine Commander-in-Chief, one we can all be proud of, and proud to follow."

General John M. Shalikashvili (United States Army, Retired)

Shalikashvili served as Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the highest ranking officer in the U.S. military. Prior to serving as Chairman, he served as the Supreme Allied Commander Europe and also as the Commander-in-Chief of the U.S. European Command. He served as Deputy Commander-in-Chief of the U.S. Army in Europe and during the first Gulf War in 1991, assumed command of Operation Provide Comfort, the relief operation that returned hundreds of thousands of Kurdish refugees to Northern Iraq. Shalikashvili is a naturalized U.S. citizen and was born in Warsaw, Poland on June 27, 1936.

"I believe in John Kerry. As a young man, he heeded his country’s call to service when it needed him. He commanded in combat and did so with bravery and distinction. He knows from experience a commander’s responsibility to his troops. He stands with our troops and with their families."

Admiral Stansfield Turner (United States Navy, Retired)

Turner served as the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency from 1977-1981.

Previously, he served in the U.S. Navy as Commander of the U.S. Second Fleet and NATO Striking Fleet Atlantic. Turner also served as the Commander-in-Chief of NATO's Southern Flank, and as President of the Naval War College. Before promotion to Admiral in 1970, he served on destroyers off the shores of Korea and Vietnam, and as executive assistant and naval aide to two Secretaries of the Navy. A native of Highland Park, Illinois, Turner received his commission from the United States Naval Academy and was a Rhodes Scholar.

"George Bush as the Commander-in-Chief has got us into a morass in both Iraq and Afghanistan. John Kerry is a true veteran, and would be a much better commander-in-chief."

General Johnnie E. Wilson (United States Army, Retired)

Wilson served as the Commanding General of the U.S. Army Material Command, and was responsible for the Army's wholesale logistics, acquisition and technology generation operations. He was born on February 4, 1944 in Baton Rouge, Louisiana and raised in Lorain, Ohio. He entered the Army in August 1961 as an enlisted soldier and retired n 1999 as a four-star general. Wilson is one of just four African-Americans to earn four stars in the U.S. Army's more than 200-year history. Wilson held a wide variety of important command and staff positions including Deputy Chief of Staff for Logistics, and Chief of Staff of the U.S. Army Materiel Command.
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"Back in 2000 a Republican friend warned me that if I voted for Al Gore and he won, the stock market would tank, we'd lose millions of jobs, and our military would be totally overstretched. You know what? I did vote for Gore, he did win, and I'll be shocked if all those things didn't come true!" --James Carville
  #27  
Old 18th August 2004, 12:00 AM
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Christ Kerry Museum Photo Documented

Communist Vietnamese honor John Kerry, the war protestor, as a hero in their victory over the United States in the Vietnam War -- Part II.

On Memorial Day, May 31, 2004, Vietnam Vets for the Truth broke an extraordinary story about a photograph hanging in the Vietnamese Communist War Remnants Museum (formerly known as the "War Crimes Museum") in Ho Chi Minh City (Saigon). The photograph, displayed in a room dedicated to foreign activists who contributed to the Communist victory over America in the Vietnam War, shows Senator John Kerry being greeted by Comrade Do Muoi, General Secretary of the Communist Party of Vietnam. Jeffrey M. Epstein of Vietnam Vets for the Truth acquired the photograph during the Memorial Day weekend in response to a general request for photographs and records detailing Kerry's activities on behalf of the enemy.

Vietnam Vets for the Truth has now further documented the photograph. Photographer Bill Lupetti returned to the War Remnants Museum in Saigon on June 2 at the request of Dr. Jerome Corsi, co-author of the original article, and photographed a current edition of the "Viet Nam News" next to the display honoring John Kerry.

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Photograph of John Kerry meeting with Comrade Do Muoi, General Secretary of the Communist Party of Vietnam, in Vietnam. Photo displayed in the War Remnants Museum (formerly the "War Crimes Museum") in Saigon. The June 2, 2004, edition of "Viet Nam News" is held beside the Kerry photograph to confirm the date the photo was taken. English-language placard below photograph reads: "Mr. Do Muoi, Secretary General of the Vietnam Communist Party met with Congressmen and Veterans Delegation in Vietnam (July 15-18, 1993)."

Dr. Corsi asked Mr. Lupetti to more thoroughly document the layout and scope of the museum, particularly the section featuring those foreign anti-war activists whom the Vietnamese communists wished to honor. He took a number of additional photos at the War Remnants Museum and elsewhere, several of which are presented below. CLICK HERE FOR THE REST OF THE STORY
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"I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

Genesis 12:3
NIV

"Pray for the peace of Jerusalem; May those who love you be secure."

Psalms 122:6
NIV

"You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me".

John 5:39
NIV
  #28  
Old 18th August 2004, 12:03 AM
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Christ Welcome to KerryLied.com

John Kerry told the world we were war criminals who raped, tortured and murdered in Vietnam. Now, thirty-three years later, we will tell America the truth. Join us at the rally we call:



KERRY LIED . . . while good men died
A gathering of Vietnam veterans from across America
Where: Upper Senate Park, Washington, D.C. It is easy to get to, shady and pretty, with a great view of the Capitol dome in back of the speaker's platform. THIS IS A NEW LOCATION AS OF 7/17/04

When: Sunday, Sept 12, 2004 2:00-4:00 PM (EDT)

Why: To tell the truth about Vietnam veterans.
To counter the lies told about Vietnam veterans by John Kerry


All Vietnam veterans and their families and supporters are asked to attend. Other veterans are invited as honored guests.


Printable flyer Click here
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"I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

Genesis 12:3
NIV

"Pray for the peace of Jerusalem; May those who love you be secure."

Psalms 122:6
NIV

"You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me".

John 5:39
NIV
  #29  
Old 18th August 2004, 12:11 AM
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Christ

Swift Boat Officers Photo






Touch the photo to see which Swift officers support John Kerry

The purpose of this photo is to correct the misleading use of our images -- against our will -- to further John Kerry's campaign.



This photograph of John Kerry and 19 other Coastal Division 11 Swift boat officers was taken at Ton Son Nhut Air Base on January 22, 1969, immediately following a meeting with General Abrams and Admiral Zumwalt.

The Kerry campaign featured the photograph in an advertisement released in May titled Lifetime. Swift Boat Veterans for Truth has contacted surviving members of this group to find out how many actually support John Kerry, and discovered that of 19 Swift boat skippers pictured other than Kerry, 12 consider him unfit, 4 are neutral, two have died, and 1 is working with the Kerry campaign. Four other officers were not present for the photo session; all oppose Kerry.

Only 1 of John Kerry's 23 fellow Swift boat commanders from Coastal Division 11 supports his candidacy today.

Click here for a morphing video of the "before" and "after" images above.



Here's a breakdown of the Swift boat officers in the photo showing where they stand:







On June 1, 2004, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth sent a cease and desist letter to John Kerry for President, Inc. on behalf of 11 officers shown in the photograph, pointing out that using their images in a campaign advertisement "wrongfully and incorrectly suggests their present endorsement of his candidacy."


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"I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

Genesis 12:3
NIV

"Pray for the peace of Jerusalem; May those who love you be secure."

Psalms 122:6
NIV

"You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me".

John 5:39
NIV
  #30  
Old 18th August 2004, 11:06 AM
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Josh

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Originally Posted by daidhaid
He exposed war crimes as policy and put it in the congressional record.
He took the anti-war movement forward. He testified before the government how is that Fonda style.



not everyone accepts a dental chart as proof of service.
You think Bush was sane for avoiding Nam, I say he is a chickenhawk.
Sanity?
My platoon was generaly about 1/2 RA at any given moment.
I'd also say they had it together as well as the Draftees and better than most of the remfs I see posting iin these forums.



What do you think happens in a free fire zone? The rules of engagement are set aside.
If it lives you kill it. If it grows you kill it. If it burns you burn it.
All persons, men women children, in a free fire zone are automatically classed as enemy, you kill them if you can. they escape if they can.
Booby traps are left behind, water is poluted, crops are destroyed.
Artillery can be called in on any target H&I fire is permitted as requested.
We used IED's daily and often left them when we moved out.
There is nothing at all unusual about any of that.
Kerry never did anything to be prosecuted for, his money didn't protect him.
If that were the case Kerry could have used his money and connections to avoid combat or service altogether like our current leaders.
If Kerry is a hero or just a guy who went he still maxes out over Bush and Chenney

I don't like to think of myself as an apologist for Kerry, but I am a member VVAW, and so was he when he testified before congress at the winter soldier hearings.
this link will take you to his actual words. Read for yourself what he said.
http://lists.village.virginia.edu/si...ry_Senate.html
Yes he did allege that war crimes were common, and he gave general examples. No small surprise the brass didn't like seeing a Naval officer protesting in front of congress.
He was not indicting soldiers or individuals he spoke for the victims on all sides. Guess what war crimes were common, and most of us didn't see them as crimes or we no longer cared. Kerry told the world.
Kerry parted with VVAW long ago and he probably wouldn't attract my vote today if it weren't for Bushes policies.
Kerry is just is the better man.
Kerry also led the senate select comittee that abandoned our POW's that we left in vietnam. I'm a member of a POW family, I know what I'm talking about. This man doesn't deserve to be a commander in chief.
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