As a member of an Antiochian parish it seems many little traditions that other Orthodox groups, such as ROCOR, maintain have already been done away with. When I attend a ROCOR parish I'm struck by how traditional they are by standing during the entire service, not having pews, majority of men donning beards, women wearing headcoverings, the royal doors remaining closed much more during the service, a curtain being drawn across above the royal doors during parts of the service, the faithful moving around the room more to venerate icons and light candles, kissing the Holy Gospel after it is read, following the prescribed fasts during coffee hour, use of the Julian calendar, and the priest not wearing a Roman collar.
I know many of these things are not essential practices or our faith, but without them our faith seems a little less unique, mystical, and beautiful. I don't want to be caught up on things that are not important, but what is the value of some of there more traditional practices. Do they really teach us something about God and our relationship to Him that we could miss in our more contemporary parishes?
I don't want to be like the Amish trying to hold on to old-fashioned customs just for nastalgia or to flee change . . . . I just want to know if there's some redeeming value to these small "t" traditions.
Last edited by vanshan; 24th June 2004 at 09:30 AM.
Why DO some Orthodox priests wear those roman collars? The OCA priest here doesn't, just as an aside.
I'm not sure. I've seen OCA and Greek priests wear them, I'm not even sure of the symbolism of them. I don't care for them personally and I think they clash with normal hierarchical vestments, but who am I to say one way or the other.
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From the CF Dictionary:
Tradition of men: Biblical doctrine that I disagree with.
Word of God: My personal opinion.
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I would not consider fasting a small tradition, either, but I know it's not held as stricly by all of us.
I need all the help I can get, so if these other things have value I would like to know. Would it help me develop a more Orthodox mindset to have a beard to my belt? I know friends have said that having a beard is humbling because they are not comfortable or popular in society. They also "feel" more Orthodox, but is this truly helpful or just a vain sensation, having little spiritual value? Like fasting, I assume, the value would not be inherit in the observance of having a beard, but it could be a means to the end of having a more Orthodox image of onself.
Last edited by vanshan; 24th June 2004 at 09:43 AM.
Interestingly enough, our priest ALWAYS wears his cassock. I do not understand the roman collar thing either, but don't sweat it too much. My favorite local Greek priest wears one all the time, along with black shirt and pants.
I agree with Oblio on the observance of fasts. This is not "small t" stuff. All except the elderly, infirm and very young should be firm in following them. Of course hospitality takes precedent, but this shouldn't be the practice at coffee hour of all places.
His unworthy servant,
Eusebios.
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I'm not sure. I've seen OCA and Greek priests wear them, I'm not even sure of the symbolism of them. I don't care for them personally and I think they clash with normal hierarchical vestments, but who am I to say one way or the other.
The Roman collars are also the norm in my diocese, the Carpatho-Russians. If I were ever asked what I suggested (and you should be glad I'm not), I would think that the return to wearing cassocks by clergy would be at or near the top of the list. I think it is good that we are different, that we are not like the rest of Christianity. As it is, an Orthodox priest wearing a Roman collar simply scandalizes people who assume he must be Roman Catholic and that his Matushka must be his girlfriend.
James
Last edited by Iacobus; 24th June 2004 at 10:01 AM.
I won't tell you about our 'Get out of Lent free' raffle tickets we proposed to our Bishop to raise money for our church
goofy converts!
As to the hair and beard thing, there is a decent, if somewhat rigid article about it here. I have personally chosen to follow these pious customs to a large degree, and have found that it has actually provided for a number of oppurtunities to share about the Orthodox faith.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Eusebios.
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In giving birth, you preserved your virginity, in falling asleep you did not forsake the world O Theotokos. You were translated to life, O Mother of Life and by your prayers you deliver our souls from death.
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Our priest (Antiochian) wears both a roman collar and a cassock, so I guess I could make a really bad joke about that.
I think the pious customs are important and intregal and we seem to observe our own, but probably in a more relaxed manner. I've always heard the Russians are usually much more strict about these things than say the Syrians or Lebanese who founded the Antiochian churches in this country. I do know that the cradle Orthodox in our parish are the ones at the forefront to keep it a Pan-Orthodox parish and not have it be identified with any one set of ethnic customs.
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