Creation & EvolutionForum for the discussion of this important topic. This forum is open to non-believers. There is a Christians-only forum in the Christians-only section too.
My interpretation is that genesis is not literal. A literal genesis completely fails even grade school science. stuff like photosynthesis and the solar system. Genesis is the literary origin story. kind of like the first issue of a superhero comic book. without the radioactive spider, spider-man is just some guy randomly able to walk on walls and spin webs. Genesis sets up man's relationship with God and the state of the world.
Your appraisal leaves the absolute power of the CREATOR GOD out of the picture and suggests that the ONLY feasible possibility is that the CREATOR GOD must follow any rules HE established in HIS ordered universe. Rules do not apply to the CREATOR but to only what HE creates. It is like saying that Picasso must be blue because he choose blue hues in his "blue period." Or that Michelangelo must like to spackle because he painted a plaster ceiling. Just because GOD established rules for nature and man, doesn't mean they have any effect whatsoever on what GOD permits HIMSELF to accomplish in HIS due time.
Your appraisal leaves the absolute power of the CREATOR GOD out of the picture and suggests that the ONLY feasible possibility is that the CREATOR GOD must follow any rules HE established in HIS ordered universe. Rules do not apply to the CREATOR but to only what HE creates. It is like saying that Picasso must be blue because he choose blue hues in his "blue period." Or that Michelangelo must like to spackle because he painted a plaster ceiling. Just because GOD established rules for nature and man, doesn't mean they have any effect whatsoever on what GOD permits HIMSELF to accomplish in HIS due time.
I do not limit God, God limits himself. This is the same God that created the 2nd law of thermodynamic which means that there is no perfect system and the same God that established F = Ma so that every action must have a force behind it. God certainly has the ability to break the rules of nature, but he doesnt. nothing that happens is completely outside of science to explain.
__________________ "Nothing in Biology Makes Sense Except in the Light of Evolution" - Theodosius Dobzhansky
Can you honestly believe that man could write the Bible and achieve salvation by making up stories that explain GOD? Man had the ability to understand his relationship to GOD?
That is not even Christian logic. GOD reaches down and reveals HIMSELF to FALLEN man. GOD HIMSELF pays the penalty for man's trangressions. Man can only screw up EVERYTHING he attempts to do on his own merit. That is why I believe GOD and not man edited the Bible. It says exactly what GOD wanted to say the way HE wanted to say it. GOD is not at either the mercy of any law HE established or Fallen man's stupidity.
Last edited by LittleNipper; 18th January 2008 at 05:19 PM.
I do not limit God, God limits himself. This is the same God that created the 2nd law of thermodynamic which means that there is no perfect system and the same God that established F = Ma so that every action must have a force behind it. God certainly has the ability to break the rules of nature, but he doesnt. nothing that happens is completely outside of science to explain.
JESUS CHRIST calmed the storm. The storm was a "natural" phenomenon. JESUS CHRIST brought the dead girl back to life. HE countermanded the "natural" laws surrounding death. JESUS CHRIST changed water into wine. HE did not limit HIMSELF to "natural" processes. CHRIST arose from the dead HIMSELF. He didn't remain in the tomb as everyone else has.
Can you honestly believe that man could write the Bible and achieve salvation by making up stories that explain GOD? Man had the ability to understand his relationship to GOD?
That is not even Christian logic. GOD reaches down and reveals HIMSELF to FALLEN man. GOD HIMSELF pays the penalty for man's trangressions. Man can only screw up EVERYTHING he attempts to do on his own merit. That is why I believe GOD and not man edited the Bible. It says exactly what GOD wanted to say the way HE wanted to say it. GOD is not at either the mercy of any law HE established or Fallen man's stupidity.
so the bible is right in everything it says even if parts of it bear no resemblence to reality? I interpret much of the bible out of necessity. I cannot be a rational evidence-loving scientist if i thought that plants were created before the sun.
__________________ "Nothing in Biology Makes Sense Except in the Light of Evolution" - Theodosius Dobzhansky
JESUS CHRIST calmed the storm. The storm was a "natural" phenomenon. JESUS CHRIST brought the dead girl back to life. HE countermanded the "natural" laws surrounding death. JESUS CHRIST changed water into wine. HE did not limit HIMSELF to "natural" processes. CHRIST arose from the dead HIMSELF. He didn't remain in the tomb as everyone else has.
I cant speak to biblical times because i wasnt there and theres no evidence. all i can do is go by the observation that the earth and universe are filled with explainable phenomena and that nothing occurs that is totally outside the domain of explanation.
__________________ "Nothing in Biology Makes Sense Except in the Light of Evolution" - Theodosius Dobzhansky
There is nothing there to indicate this. It actually says that man should be expelled from the garden lest he reach out and eat from the tree of life and live forever.
Right, that was after the eternal life no longer applied.
So not only does it not say that there was no death for man but it strongly implies that man was mortal all along.
Taking the fruit and living forever implies that to you?
The no death part is made up.
No, it is part and parcel of the tree of life.
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Originally Posted by LittleNipper
Can you honestly believe that man could write the Bible and achieve salvation by making up stories that explain GOD? Man had the ability to understand his relationship to GOD?
That is not even Christian logic. GOD reaches down and reveals HIMSELF to FALLEN man. GOD HIMSELF pays the penalty for man's trangressions. Man can only screw up EVERYTHING he attempts to do on his own merit. That is why I believe GOD and not man edited the Bible. It says exactly what GOD wanted to say the way HE wanted to say it. GOD is not at either the mercy of any law HE established or Fallen man's stupidity.
Originally Posted by LittleNipper
JESUS CHRIST calmed the storm. The storm was a "natural" phenomenon. JESUS CHRIST brought the dead girl back to life. HE countermanded the "natural" laws surrounding death. JESUS CHRIST changed water into wine. HE did not limit HIMSELF to "natural" processes. CHRIST arose from the dead HIMSELF. He didn't remain in the tomb as everyone else has.
Originally Posted by dad
Right, that was after the eternal life no longer applied.
Taking the fruit and living forever implies that to you?
No, it is part and parcel of the tree of life.
I can tell you honestly, I truly feel sorry for you guys,
what they have done to you both is an absolute sin,
and I am sure that even some of the Christians here would agree with me.
I can tell you honestly, I truly feel sorry for you guys,
what they have done to you both is an absolute sin,
and I am sure that even some of the Christians here would agree with me.
So believing in eternal life at creation for man is a sign of having something terrible done to one now in your tormented mind? Interesting. Sad, though. Cheer up, though, salvation is available for all men if we seek God, and believe Him.
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Originally Posted by dad
So believing in eternal life at creation for man is a sign of having something terrible done to one now in your tormented mind? Interesting. Sad, though. Cheer up, though, salvation is available for all men if we seek God, and believe Him.
Don't you find it's fascinating, you think there is a God up in heaven,
I think there are demons in the cellar, you are accepted as normal, but I am considered to be mad.
it's a strange old world we live in, don't you think?
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