| Creation & Evolution Forum for the discussion of this important topic. This forum is open to non-believers. There is a Christians-only forum in the Christians-only section too. |
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8th March 2007, 04:36 PM
| | BEYOND PARANOID
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Hey, I don't believe I've posted here before. (Right off the bat, please note that I am very ignorant of the science of evolution.) I thought of this briefly a while ago and didn't get back to it until now. I'd like to ask, if either Christians or non-Christians would like to speculate or answer. It's a short question, I think:
When we read in the Bible that Christ died for men, would we say that it applied also to previous evolutionary states, like the Neanderthal? If not, then what if our present evolutionary state (Homo sapien) evolved once more--would we still say that Christ died for even the previous evolutionary state--the one that said that He did not die for the one before it? And if that is the case, how far back in the evolutionary line could it be?
Or is it only those that can have faith? If we accept that human babies and the mentally handicapped might be saved, on account of their inability to have faith, though they would if they could, then what about previous evolutionary states?
Just some thoughts... and a hello.  |
8th March 2007, 04:41 PM
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Reps: 876 (power: 0) | | | Which "state" was created in the image of God, according to the Bible? Oh, and we didn't evolve from Neandertals. |
8th March 2007, 04:49 PM
| | BEYOND PARANOID
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | I'm not really sure, llDayo. The meaning of "in the image of God" is not something, so far that I know, that has been widely agreed upon in the Christian community. I'm guessing a Christian who firmly accepts evolution would be able to answer that one better (reading the Bible, obviously, in an evolutionary frameset).
My mistake, regarding Neanderthal and Homo sapien being in the same line. Timelines, such as the one at the Wikipedia article "Human evolution" might better provide me insight, but I'm not great at following a lot of technical information. |
8th March 2007, 07:27 PM
| | Flaming Calvinist
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Reps: 4,248,754,869 (power: 4,248,777) | | | If you're going to take the Bible according to the Theistic Evolution standpoint, then I suppose that the fall of Adam and Eve would represent some time during which man revolted against God. Thus, I suppose that every human who is descended from these people is created in the image of God, and is in need of salvation through faith in Christ.
Whatever standpoint you take, I would caution you not to believe in the falsehood that man has any possibility of salvation other than faith in Jesus Christ.
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Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. (John 3:18) |
8th March 2007, 07:35 PM
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Reps: 508 (power: 0) | | | Brilliant topic! I had never thought about that. Thanks for yet another reason to be an atheist.
Think about it, either god doesn't allow previous human evolutionary states into heaven, or there are millions of sub-human dimwits running around. Oh wait, no, god makes them fully human, that's it right?
Pfft. What a load of nonsense. |
27th June 2009, 02:17 PM
| | BEYOND PARANOID
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | | Bump, because I'm curious if this topic will garner more feedback. |
27th June 2009, 02:48 PM
|  | I prefer you trust your reason.
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Reps: 228,193,399,886,833,536 (power: 228,193,399,886,840) | | | I would imagine he died for anyone with the capability to believe they are saved... yeah?
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27th June 2009, 03:32 PM
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Reps: 44,404,246,110,554,912 (power: 44,404,246,110,568) | | Originally Posted by Neal  Hey, I don't believe I've posted here before. (Right off the bat, please note that I am very ignorant of the science of evolution.) I thought of this briefly a while ago and didn't get back to it until now. I'd like to ask, if either Christians or non-Christians would like to speculate or answer. It's a short question, I think:
When we read in the Bible that Christ died for men, would we say that it applied also to previous evolutionary states, like the Neanderthal? If not, then what if our present evolutionary state (Homo sapien) evolved once more--would we still say that Christ died for even the previous evolutionary state--the one that said that He did not die for the one before it? And if that is the case, how far back in the evolutionary line could it be?
Or is it only those that can have faith? If we accept that human babies and the mentally handicapped might be saved, on account of their inability to have faith, though they would if they could, then what about previous evolutionary states?
Just some thoughts... and a hello.
Good question. I asked the same question in different formats before. So far, nobody gave me any satisfactory answer. My answer to this question is still the best.
This question is the best for Theistic Evolutionist (TE). There are some good TEs in the Origin forum. People in this forum are mostly atheists. This question does not apply well to them, even there are some scientific factors involved. I don't think you can get much here, except from me.
Your question can also be put this way: Why did not God try to save monkey which appeared on the earth just a fraction of geologic second earlier than human? Why save human now? Why not just wait for another fraction of a second to save a "better" creature which would evolved from human? (Evolutionists, don't give me the crap that evolution knows no direction. IT KNOWS!) |
27th June 2009, 03:36 PM
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Reps: 44,404,246,110,554,912 (power: 44,404,246,110,568) | | Originally Posted by Raydon Brilliant topic! I had never thought about that. Thanks for yet another reason to be an atheist.
Think about it, either god doesn't allow previous human evolutionary states into heaven, or there are millions of sub-human dimwits running around. Oh wait, no, god makes them fully human, that's it right?
Pfft. What a load of nonsense.
Wrong. If you really think about this question, only Christianity can give the best answer. |
27th June 2009, 03:44 PM
|  | Beholder
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Reps: 6,565,145,261 (power: 6,565,148) | | Originally Posted by juvenissun Evolutionists, don't give me the crap that evolution knows no direction. IT KNOWS!
lol, this explains quite a lot why you have no idea about the ToE...
'it' knows. 
As for Neal's question, I don't think Homo Sapien can branch of into other groups anymore. There has to be some sort of isolation that prevents breeding so certain 'unique' genes can't be shared anymore which causes bigger and bigger changes between us humans and hypothetical human X. But in today's world our race breeds with everyone all around the globe thus preventing any way to branch into another group.
Don't forget however, that just because we won't branch into other groups doesn't mean future humans won't be different. In fact, we already are fairly different from earliest homo sapiens but as long as there is no branching we'll keep being named homo sapien. - Ectezus
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Sigmund Freud [1856-1939] (Austrian physician and pioneer psychoanalyst) said:
"It would be very nice if there were a God who created the world and was a benevolent providence, and if there were a moral order in the universe and an after-life; but it is a very striking fact that all this is exactly as we are bound to wish it to be."
Last edited by Ectezus; 27th June 2009 at 03:50 PM.
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