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18th July 2003, 04:59 PM
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Reps: 20,477 (power: 35) | | Originally Posted by Hank The Pope has the same disease, does that mean he does not glorify god?
The Pope has Parkinson's, not ALS. Your point is made, however.
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18th July 2003, 05:04 PM
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Reps: 12,682 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Hank The Pope has the same disease, does that mean he does not glorify god?
Why did SARS kill nurses?
There "eight million stories in the naked city" and this is just one of them. Each individual has their own story to tell. So it is not so easy to generalize when each individual is just that, a unique individual. Created by God to bring Him honor and glory.
Public figures just happen to be center stage out there for everyone to see. Just like my pastor is a very public figure out there for everyone to see and make comments about him. If sickness only attacks evil, good would need no doctors. Is being sick a sign to be evil?
Are you really wanting to open this up for discussion? Even under the law people can have divine health, how much more can we have divine health under grace. But not everyone has entered in, and not everyone is healed. But we do see a lot of miracles and healing, and we do capture them on video for others to see.
There use to be a lot of discussion about this on here. Maybe some of those posts are still around.  |
18th July 2003, 05:25 PM
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Reps: 12,682 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Philip The Pope has Parkinson's, not ALS.
Along with Billy Graham, one of the ten most beloved people in the world today according to the Gallop polls. Also Janet Reno, Michael J. Fox, Mohamad Ali.
"I'll preach as long as I have the strength," Graham said in 1996, after learning he has Parkinson's.
"I'm still the greatest," Ali said in 1997, after learning he has it.
"I don't feel like I have any impairment," Reno said in 1995.
"I can't do things a million times," Fox, who quit his television show, said in People Magazine. "I can only do them once or twice." http://allsands.com/Health/Diseases/...sea_xzb_gn.htm |
18th July 2003, 05:33 PM
|  | Senior Member
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Reps: 14 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by JohnR7 Are you really wanting to open this up for discussion? Even under the law people can have divine health, how much more can we have divine health under grace. But not everyone has entered in, and not everyone is healed. But we do see a lot of miracles and healing, and we do capture them on video for others to see.
There use to be a lot of discussion about this on here. Maybe some of those posts are still around.
You started the healing subject. If you can find old post, please provide a link, I can't find it 
To use your own Bible I quote: ... He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.
Sickness attacks humans irrespective to faith. If you believe in the healing power of god fine, no problem, but I don't. There is no empirical evidence. What is proven that the body has self healing mechanism build in. Those can be accelerated with positive actions and life styles.
A broken leg will heal, it will heal faster and better with medical attention. I prefer doctors over prayer. In my never humble opinion 
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18th July 2003, 06:11 PM
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Reps: 295,212,687,427,838,720 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by JohnR7 There are some things I try to shake off and walk away from. But when it comes to Stephen Hawkings, there is something about him that people just can not seem to shake it off of them.
There is no question that Hawking's is a brillant man. The question then is, did he use what God gave him to honor or glorify God or not? Most people I believe would say that Hawking's does nothing to honor God.
Apparantly those who don't do this every waking minute will be struck down with a degenerative motor disease.
In the old days, it was a simple plague of locusts, an earthquake, or a nice clean smiting. Quick and painless.
Your God has gotten very creative with his petty sadism. You must be proud, John. The Bible clearly says that "as a man thinketh in his heart, so is he". No one objects to Hawking's thinking. Nor do they think his ourward appearance has any connection to his thinking. But that is not what the Bible says: "as a man thinketh in his heart, so is he".
So the Bible tells that the outward appearence is a reflection of what's on the inside? God help the ugly people of the world.... I suggest here that the outward appearance is a reflection of the man. The thoughts, the intents, the charactor, the attitude.
I suggest that this is the most shallow and superficial piece of bad advice that a human being could give: "Feel free to judge a book by its cover. The Bible says so."
Now, you can be as superficial as you want, John, that's your right. But why must you twist God into such a fool to justify your own shallowness? I had a friend at church who recently died from this disease.
Then, by your own definition, your "friend" was not worthy of God's love, and by extention, not worthy of yours. Be careful how you call him "friend," lest God decide to send some divine punishment your way.
John, I think you have managed to hit a new low. Your God is petty, egotistical, cruel, and sickening.
Why not preserve a shred of honesty and just say that you don't agree with Stephen Hawking? Does it give you some sort of self-righteous thrill to claim the wrath of God on him?
If what you imply is true, and that ALS is some sort of divine punishemt for not praising God enough, then I'd be at a loss to decide which is more evil:
A: A God who would do such a thing
B: The followers who would applaud it. |
18th July 2003, 08:12 PM
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Reps: 12,682 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Hank Sickness attacks humans irrespective to faith. If you believe in the healing power of god fine, no problem, but I don't. There is no empirical evidence. What is proven that the body has self healing mechanism build in. Those can be accelerated with positive actions and life styles.
Of course there is evidence, people are healed. Even they have a camera that will photograph the healing power that heals the people. We have seen a lot of people receive their miracle or their healing.
Of course the body has the ability to be able to heal itself. That is the difference between someone who is healed and someone who receives a miracle. A miracle is something the body is not able to do on it's own. Either way, it is the power of God at work. A broken leg will heal, it will heal faster and better with medical attention. I prefer doctors over prayer. In my never humble opinion
No one is saying not to go to the doctor. In some ways it is better to receive all the help you can from man. Then go to God to receive what your not able to get from man. In some cases people do not have the option of going to a doctor. There are people in Africa who can not even afford $1 a day for medicine. It is available, but they do not have the money to buy it. So they either get no help, or God's help. |
18th July 2003, 09:09 PM
|  | N. Hale - he died for you
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I assume you have done some sort of a statistical analysis that shows non-Christians are afflicted with ALS at a higher rate than Christians. If you haven't you are spewing your baloney from a sample of one.
Fallacy of argument by generalization. Could also be considered fallacy of selective observation.
Prof. Hawking doesn't practice your religion. He also has a disease. That must be the cause of the disease.
Fallacy of confusing correlation with causation.
In my personal opinion, your statement is the epitome of bovine scatology. |
18th July 2003, 11:39 PM
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Reps: 12,682 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Nathan Poe Apparantly those who don't do this every waking minute will be struck down with a degenerative motor disease.
Well either he is the innocent victom of a ravaging disease, or he is not so innocent. Are you here to defend his innocence and purity?
Do you feel he has done nothing wrong and that he is in no way to blame for the condition that he finds himself in? |
18th July 2003, 11:45 PM
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Reps: 12,682 (power: 0) | | Originally Posted by Just An Atheist So JohnR7,
I assume you have done some sort of a statistical analysis that shows non-Christians are afflicted with ALS at a higher rate than Christians. If you haven't you are spewing your baloney from a sample of one.
It is no problem to show that people who live christian lives live longer. But it would be difficult to break that down for each individual illness that people can die from. At least that's what a recent study from the Duke University Medical Center indicates. Looking at 4,000 older adults from rural North Carolina, the Duke team concluded that even occasional private prayer and Bible study helped people live healthier and longer lives.
"The person who prays is less stressed. He becomes less anxious, and his blood pressure and pulse improve." http://www.family.org/focusoverfifty.../a0019095.html
Last edited by JohnR7; 19th July 2003 at 12:58 AM.
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19th July 2003, 12:40 AM
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Reps: 33,621 (power: 55) | | Originally Posted by JohnR7 Well either he is the innocent victom of a ravaging disease, or he is not so innocent. Are you here to defend his innocence and purity?
Do you feel he has done nothing wrong and that he is in no way to blame for the condition that he finds himself in?
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