I'm on the fence about Limited Atonement of the TULIP. I'm leaning towards being a Four Point Calvinist.
Can one be a Four Point Calvinist? I read an article that argues you cannot. It said if you reject Limited Atonement, the others cannot stand.
What say you? What are you? Four or Five?
God Bless!
__________________ For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved - Romans 10:13
For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not parish, but have everlasting life - John 3:16
I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me - John 14:6
In my conversion to belief in Reformed soteriology, I started out as a four-pointer but quickly became convinced of the truth and logic behind the 'L' as well.
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"Here is found the most fundamental difference between liberalism and Christianity—liberalism is altogether in the imperative mood, while Christianity begins with a triumphant indicative; liberalism appeals to man's will, while Christianity announces, first, a gracious act of God." —J. Gresham Machen
"Christianity is the sine qua non of the intelligibility of anything." —Cornelius Van Til
To me they all stand or fall together. There are many reasons I believe that particular redemption is both Scriptural and true. Not the least of which is any other view makes the atonement of Christ something other than an actual atonement and makes His suretyship pointless. BTW, I do not hold to the sufficient for all but efficient for some view. I believe it is dealing in hypotheticals that have no usefulness but to give theologians something to debate.
__________________ What is a preacher? A preacher is a nobody who tells everybody about Somebody who can save anybody.
-Scott Richardson
The only thing a man can call all his own and not given to Him by God is his sin.
Natural man is so adamant about having his will that he would make God bow to it.
When you point saints to Sinai you point them away from Christ.
I'm on the fence about Limited Atonement of the TULIP. I'm leaning towards being a Four Point Calvinist.
Can one be a Four Point Calvinist? I read an article that argues you cannot. It said if you reject Limited Atonement, the others cannot stand.
What say you? What are you? Four or Five?
God Bless!
I can see why some Christians are 4 pointers , they seem to have some scriptures on their side , and at first glance preaching the Gospel to everyone seems to imply an unlimited atonement , after all it is the person and work of Christ that sinners are to put their faith in.
However , a real study of the words used about the work of Christs atonement will show it is definite (literally deals with sin) and an indefinite atonement cannot save anyone.
Either our sins have been "blotted out" and God is "Propitiated" or He is not and we are still in our sins.
Other arguements relating to the words "all" and "world" can be shown from scripture to be less than universal.
Greetings Cygnus.
__________________
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... "That He by the grace of God should taste death for every man"(Heb. 2:9) no more included Cain, Pharaoh and Judas than "every man" is to be understood absolutely in Luke 16:16; Romans 12:3; 1 Corinthians 4:5; and "all men" in 1 Timothy 2:4, 6, is no more to be taken as meaning all without exception than it is in Luke 3:15; John 3:26; Acts 22:15.
A W Pink
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Last edited by cygnusx1; 21st November 2006 at 04:29 AM.
What Ron (who can't spell his name) said. I agree. They all stand together.
I am 5 points and supralapsarian (did I spell that right?). Can't see it any other way and still "let" God be God and the Bible make sense.
"The earth is the Lord’s, and everything in it.
The world and all its people belong to him.
For he laid the earth’s foundation on the seas
and built it on the ocean depths." Psalm 24:1, 2
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I do not hold to the sufficient for all but efficient for some view.
Ok. I'm going to bite on this. Why not?
__________________ χάρις
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"Here is found the most fundamental difference between liberalism and Christianity—liberalism is altogether in the imperative mood, while Christianity begins with a triumphant indicative; liberalism appeals to man's will, while Christianity announces, first, a gracious act of God." —J. Gresham Machen
"Christianity is the sine qua non of the intelligibility of anything." —Cornelius Van Til
Because it is unscriptural! How would you prove it?
__________________
"The earth is the Lord’s, and everything in it.
The world and all its people belong to him.
For he laid the earth’s foundation on the seas
and built it on the ocean depths." Psalm 24:1, 2
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